Rockets will draft Dunleavy as #1 if Ming falls through

I call bull****. Houston is the perfect city for Ming for a variety of reasons. Quit being a hater.

 

dude have u seen the how many asians there are in new york? i doubt houston is better than new york is the asian community there is like the latin community here.

 

I don't know whether Ming will pan out, or not, but his attitude is already a million times better than the so-called leaders on this team..present and past. Modern players continually talk about respect, respect, respect while they act like children and worse. If Francis won't give this a shot and play hard and be the leader that he says he wants to be, then f*ck him. Trade his ass to Cleveland, or Denver and let him see how many endorsements he gets as the losses and migraines pile up in February.

As for Troy, I thought you weren't going to return until after the draft to gloat. You are doing more spin than Kennedy's at Chappaquidick. If your inside information (aka being a towel boy) is air tight, what's with all of the ass covering the last few days? As Jeff pointed out, *nothing* you've said in this thread rises above the kind of common sense that even disrespectful jerks can stummble upon every now and then. Jerry West you are not. And the idea that "you speak for many who do not post" their feelings against Ming is r****ded for even you, Troy. In your not-long-enough exile from posting on the BBS did you not see the dozens of postings critical of Ming's selection? Could it be that the reason a relative consensus has been reached here about Ming is because this mirrors what most of the scouts have said about him and his potential? Naah, of course not! We're all just pickin' on you and poor Steve Francis.

 

Troy you should of stated it that way before. I totally see were your coming from. It does seem silly to put so much stock into a player whose a marketing and political puppet to a totalitarian, political organization. Also, what i got from your last post was that Steve may be concerned that Yao MIng could go from being a solid team contributor one moment, to being a political refugee called back to bow down to a piece of red flag, the next. If thats a concern of Francis's, then i can see where hes coming from.

 

TroyBaros: Do you still feel Glen Rice is going to be a big factor in the rise of the 2002-2003 Rockets? I have read that he is committed to a return to his old form, perhaps retiring in a blaze of Rocket glory at the end of 2004.

Is Cato doing anything this summer to help his cause? How do you feel Eddie is going to fit in? Finally, will you (Steve) play with Ming -- really give him a chance as a teammate -- if he is drafted?

 

So I guess you're one of the Caron Butler-is-the-next-Paul-Pierce guys. That explains a lot. Butler has unspectacular quickness, unspectacular agility, unspectacular jumping ability, unspectacular strength, and unspectacular height. He definitely does not have any of the physical characteristics to say he should be a #1 pick in the draft. And as far as his basketball skills go, while he obviously has some skills, I don't think they're anywhere close to being great enough to make him the #1 pick in the draft. He is not Paul Pierce. More accurately, he is a less athletic version of Ron Artest.

 

Rudy will retire when he damn well feels like it, and not a minute sooner - he has impregnable job security. The Rockets are not about to go FIRING a person synonomous with the franchise right as they're opening a new arena - it would be a horrible puplic relations move.

Wrong. The CBA has already guaranteed that Ming will play the full season and all of the playoffs, PLUS they have a vested interest in seeing Ming succeed in the NBA, there's no reason for them to screw it up like that. Thats, frankly, no more coherent than me suggesting that we should trade Francis because he might get kidnapped by aliens . . . .

Show me.

Which is it? Does Ming have Baggage? Or does he have baggage only because he's going to be a Rocket? Consistency is a b**** sometimes, so feel free to backtrack some more.

Your post is full of rambling hypotheticals, and not one shred of evidence or logic to back up your position.

 

Yo this insider stuff is getting out of control some beleivable but others hmm but i guess it could be fun too im gona try:



Oscar Torres doesn't want to play with Ming or Mobes or Steve he doesn't like them he wants Hilario at #1..

Oscar has also stated that he wants his brother to come and start at the 5 , even though he has no Basketball knowledge but he needs a green card.

Moochie stated "dont draft Jwilliams or im out" he wants Rudy to draft his barber so he could be closer to him.

Oscar also told me that he might have to leave for the Pan AMerican games so he might not make the playoffs next year ......

all this from a very good Insider trust me..

 

Troy,

Go and tell Steve he doesn't have the right to hold this team hostage. Maybe you won't have to; maybe he's already posted here. Hell, maybe you're him, for all I know.

With this behaviour, Steve Francis is only proving his detractors correct. Spoiled. Childish. Arrogant. (Of course, I don't want to mix Steve's and TroyBaros' attitudes.) If this is how Steve feels, I've reached the point where I will no longer stick up for him.

I can understand Steve's apprehensions about Ming's availability, but I don't think that's the real issue. On some of your points, Troy, I must disagree.

To say that the days of the dominant center are over, that this is a quicker, run-and-gun game, just points out the fact that Steve wants to be the star of the show, and won't stand to lose his spotlight. Ask Steve how far the Rockets have gone with our "run-and-gun" offense. Run and gun? If that's our style, then we're doing it with wheelchair-bound amnesiacs packing water pistols.

The reason the age of the dominant center is "gone": for years, there hasn't been a center worthy of getting excited about. UNTIL NOW. Exciting for the rest of us. But sounds like somebody doesn't want to share his toys.

Why should Steve worry about losing the spotlight? This is a high-post center, a perfect compliment for Steve. This center will bring in fans (NO MORE EMPTY SEATS AT THE COMPAQ CENTER!) What's the problem?

 

I just hope Rudy and CD stick up for themselves and don't let Steve bully them around. They should go to him and tell him to either get rid of that attitude or he's gone.

 

Not True.
Well . . .In the Bulls Great run . . . What great Centers did they
face? Ewing? Smits? None in the finals. Rockets ALWAYS did well
against the Bulls even at the HEIGHT of their greatness.

The Run and Gun is good. . . when Niether team has a dominate
center. . . .but when one does. . .

THEY USE HIM!!!

Rocket RIver

 

Troy,

When somebody posts something, the two things I look for are logic and consistency. I really don't care how you present your facts, I'm just evaluating whether or not they are logical and if you are consistent in what you are saying. Here's where I'm having problems:


1) First you say Steve wants Jay Williams. But, at the draft Steve said that the only thing that he knew was that we didn't need to draft a PG. Later, on The Best Damn Sports Show, Cuttino says that he and Steve have been discussing things. He also says that drafting Jay Williams would be disrespectful to Steve. Now, all of a sudden, you're not mentioning Jay Williams anymore. Drafting Jay Williams isn't logical. Mobley and Francis' statements are inconsistent with yours. You claiming Jay Williams is Francis' choice and now no longer making that claim is inconsistent.

2) You also said there would be a blockbuster trade between Chicago/LAC/Houston. Now such trade appears to be unlikely and now you now longer mention that deal. That deal could certainly be logical. But since the Rockets look like they are taking Yao,Chicago Jay Will and LAC talking to Portland and Philly about their picks, it looks like there's no way this deal happens. That's inconsistent

3) You said Yao wouldn't be a Rocket for more than 10 minutes. Now you seem to be conceding that they will indeed draft Yao. Again, inconsistent.

4) Now you say that if the Rockets draft Yao and don't make the playoffs, then Francis will leave to sign with Chicago or NY. Lets examine that idea a little more closely.
To me that’s not really logical and here’s why:

Francis is under contract for the '02-'03 season for a salary of $3,652,985.20

We hold the right of first refusal for Francis following the '02-03 season.
In order to retain the right of first refusal on Francis, we have to tender him a contract offer of $4,767,145.69 after the '02-03 season.

Francis can take that one-year offer and then he's an unrestricted free agent following the '03-04 season.

Francis also has the option of signing an offer sheet with another team. The problem is that that offer sheet has to be for a minimum of 3 years. Plus the Rockets have the right to match the offer sheet and since he's a Bird FA, they can exceed the cap to match the offer.

Also, remember that if Francis resigns with Houston, then he can sign a 7-year deal and get a 12.5% raise each year of the deal.

If Francis signs with a team other than Houston, then he can only sign a 6 year deal and get a raise of 10% each year.

So, what are Francis' real options?

He's under contract for next season so he'll make $3,652,985.20. His choices won't start until after the '02'-'03 season.

1) He can sign a 7-year $108,859,274.39 extension to stay in Houston.

2) He can take Houston's 1-year qualifying offer of $4,767,145.69 and then become a FA. His best deal, as a FA would be to sign a 3year max deal and then resign as a Bird FA with that team after 3 years. So, taking best case, his deal is now worth $88,975,458.67 over the same 7 years.

3) He can turn down Houston's qualifying offer and sign an offer sheet with another team. Well, Houston has right of first refusal and can exceed the cap, so they simply match the offer and he's here through at least '06-07.


So, bottom line is that the Rockets can keep Francis here for at least two more seasons no matter what. Then after two seasons, if he chooses to sign as a FA with another team, he'll lose $19.88M in salary over the next 7 years.

I'm failing to see what leverage he has here.

Now for Chicago and NY.

NY is so capped out; they won't be able to sign a FA for more than the MCE in the next several years. It’s not logical, it can’t happen.

Chicago will have Jay Williams, so why would they offer a max deal to Francis? Remember, Curry and Chandler will both be coming up for extensions the same year that Francis would be able to sign with Chicago. Do you think they'll add another long term, big money deal on top of those two? Especially, when they most likely already have a good PG? Again, it’s not logical.

5) You say that Francis runs the team to a great extent. Let's see, you said that Francis was threatening to walk if they drafted Yao. Well, looks like they are drafting Yao, so what does that mean. It either means that 1) you had bad info and Steve never said that 2) Steve doesn't have that much input and the Rocket's management does what they think is appropriate. The Rocket’s actions (drafting Yao) are inconsistent with what you are claiming.

Sorry, but your story has changed too many times and it just doesn’t make sense for me to believe. You could end up being right about Francis, but even if he is making threats, they seem pretty hollow to me. Threatening to leave in two years and costing yourself almost $20M in salary just doesn’t make sense. I just don’t see what leverage he has. The last thing he can afford to do is to try to force another trade. He’s still getting killed for the Vancouver escapade, if he pulled that again it would be career suicide. He’d never get national endorsement deals or play on a USA Basketball team, both of which are things he wants.

 

You know, this statement alone has demonstrated your basketball IQ. If Shaq has proven anything, he has proven the importance of a dominant center. The center position is still the most important position in the NBA. And that will ALWAYS be the case.

 

Wow, excellent post aelliot.

 

Right on the Money, aelliott.

 

Another brilliant post by Aelliott! I always enjoy reading them.

Bottom line with Francis... The guy is "frustrated." Plus he just had surgery and has nothing to do now but "wait around" and dreamcast or whatever since he can't ball.

He wants to win in the worst way. We all want that. But I think once he gets back on the court and everyone gets back heathly at training camp his tune will change. I think it would mean more if he felt this way a month or so into the season versus on his own time over the summer.

Chris

 

How is it obvious? He hasn't shown any shred of proof that he is buddies with Steve. I also find it extremely hard to believe a player of Francis' stature would give "permission" to a friend to go out and give ulitimatums on his behalf to the franchise he plays for. Steve is a very proud and outspoken individual. If he has something to say about the situation he would say it directly, not through one of his b****es.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, IMO Troy is a leech or a groupie at best and is worried that Steve will leave if Ming is a bust and Troy's gravy train will end.

 

Then I challenge you to go tell those pansies to be men and speak up! Don't hid behind you're b*tches!!

Troy, that entire statement is pure speculation on your part. Sure it is possible that it could happen, but it is also possible that pigs could fly(although highly unlikely). China would do extensive damage to their international business relations(primarily in the sporting arena) for decades to come by calling Ming back during the most important part of the NBA season(that they so desperately want him to be a part of). All necessary parties have already agreed that Ming will be available for camps, games, playoffs, etc. Sorry, but even if they are communists, I'll take their word over yours any day.

On what grounds do you have to make such a judgement/accusation?? Give me some proof.