Robert Mueller, Former F.B.I. Director, Is Named Special Counsel for Russia Investigation

Hey, I really and truly appreciate your answer. Many thanks.

1. I do see what you mean, culturally, about a political "witch hunt" from the left for Two Scoops.
2. I think there were similar movements for B. Clinton, GWB, Obama, and H. Clinton, but it's been getting steadily worse since the mid-90's.
3. I don't think Mueller in any way is part of a witch hunt, and I think you agree. He's doing his job and actually being professional.
4. I disagree that there is some kind of great organization on the left. I'm on the left. I haven't heard of half of what you mentioned, and what I see more than anything is lefties crying into their avocado toast at the local coffee shop and giving another $20 to Planned Parenthood. I can't emphasize this enough. I think it feels more organized to those on the right, BUT I will tell you: I've never seen the left this fired up to work on the midterms and go vote. (shrug.)

Thanks again. Really appreciate it.

 

Um, no you didn't.

 

I think you make a good point, but it's a pivot from the question. There is a robust constellation of voices in the public sphere that have pretty much made up their mind that Trump is guilty of something, and say so repeatedly. It has created an oppressive atmosphere of presumption of guilt for the president. I don't think 'witch hunt' is the right vocabulary to describe it, but that's a real thing. I think it has much to do with the fact that we have drips and drabs of suggestive information, but we're going on 2 years without resolution. People have come to their conclusions, and those who are pretty sure he's guilty are understandably incensed that a guilty person would remain president.

It's also not what Trump himself calls a witch hunt though -- he very specifically calls Mueller's investigation the witch hunt. He says the investigation is illegitimate and politically motivated. And, @B-Bob's question would still stand: why would a guy like Mueller engage in false and politically-motivated investigation?

So, do you think trial-by-jury is systematically corrupt, or only in DC?

I still care about the trial because the charges are serious and include Manafort's activities in an area of national interest (the power struggle between pro-Russian and pro-Western factions in Ukraine). If he's guilty, I want him to be convicted. Now, this discussion is in the Mueller thread. I'm not so interested in the implications on the Trump investigation at this point. I think it is still a factor -- associating with pro-Kremlin convicted felon Paul Manafort would probably come up, even if Manafort doesn't testify -- but I think getting the conviction is more important than Manafort flipping.

 

I do not know if this is still true but ... last year I posted an articles stating that Trump had committed more FBI resources into investigating HRC than Mueller had on his team. And Trump is still saying that that HRC colluded with the Russians, while he is innocent.

 

You're welcome and I appreciate your response as well, thanks. 2. completely agree, the speed of information is increasing and this is negative impact. 3. absolutely correct but as i explained in another post, i can understand how DT and his side will not see any distinction and in fact will make the case it's related. 4. i believe you but see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_Trump_movement and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_against_Donald_Trump for a easy to read chronological summary. it really is persistent, well funded and well organized opposition.

 

well said and as i mentioned in my reply to @larsv8 , DT is incorrectly, but understandably, amalgamating the investigation into the "witch hunt."

 

Yes, though I'd say that is a very sympathetic interpretation, especially since Trump is the one who coined and pushes the term. He isn't misunderstanding or speaking loosely. He is very cynically and shrewdly conflating his 'liberal' detractors with the investigation to push a conspiracy theory that Mueller is doing the DNC's dirty work. It is only 'understandable' in that we can see how he can gain advantage. It isn't acceptable or forgivable.

 

The President almost daily screams "WITCH HUNT" and the press covers it. And the media and the left are to blame?

 

I dont necessarily think Hillary should get in trouble for colluding with the Russians. It was probably spearheaded by the DNC.

 

The DNC contacted the Russian government?

Good to know.

 

Not necessarily the government, but they definitely used Russians to create the dossier which led to the Fisa warrants which led to this investigation.

 

Why wouldn't you go to the source to get information? If I'm getting information about Russian involvement, I would hope that I have information from Russian sources to help. I don't understand why that's a problem.

 

No, they didn't.

 

Law and order, but only when convenient.

 

Shanelessly lifted from Reddit. After resigning to avoid impeachment, Nixon's approval rating was still at 25% which blows my mind. It suggests a significant minority will support Trump no matter what. As he himself said, Trump could shoot someone and people would explain it away.



Also:



It's also interesting to me that for all his talk about what a great guy Manefort is, I have yet to see Trump claim that he didn't systematically break the law. Just that he's a great guy, so (I imagine by implication) should be able to break the law or something?

In his mind, do you imagine Nixon ever thought sending guys to break into the DNC was a big deal or a legit real criminal act before he was called out on it?

 

I mean he was viewed as a shady businessman before politics. He settled his Trump University lawsuit before taking office, his Foundation is being investigated in New York, and his family is being investigated for emoluments.

How should we be viewing Trump...? How much leeway should he be given?

 

This is the definition of a lie. You are lying, and you know it.

Fusion GPS is an American company who Republicans used prior to the Clinton campaign. Fusion GPS had an BRITISH spy, Christopher Steele, supplying them RAW INTELLIGENCE. Christopher Steele was a BRITISH source for the US government for years, and years.

There is zero evidence that the Clinton's went to THE RUSSIAN GOVERNMENT for help LOSING the election to Donald Trump just so they could setup Trump after he inevitably won the election in order to then create chaos.

(THE FISA WARRANT in question was used to spy on Carter Page who was a self described adviser oto the Kremlin & was used for intelligence far before he was ever a candidate to serve in the Trump campaign... Different propagated talking point you are using to conflate & confuse)

You are better than this. Stop lying & spreading false propaganda...... please.

 

No, he isn't, he has consistently been posting fake news and made up crap, his head is so far up Trump's ass that he can see his nipples from the inside.

DD

 

There were many other pieces of evidence besides the dossier that led to the FISA warrants. It is also not a bad thing that the dossier was presented as evidence to obtain the FISA warrants.

 

I never get the logic behind attacking the legitamcy of the Dossier. Before the Dossier, Fusion GPS was always seen as a crebile investigstive firm and Christopher Steele was a 22 year veteran of MI6, one of the closest allied intellegence agencies the US works with and was a Russian intellegence gathering expert.