Well TJ, my brother-in-law and the father of two kids is getting ready to go back to Iraq for his second tour of duty. I don't want him to die in a losing cause and what I see right now is a losing cause. A losing cause because it was ill conceived and justified by lies. I love my country, but I also choose to live in the real world. Try changing the channel from Faux News once in a while. What I find so funny is that so many people were worked up over a President having oral sex in the oval office. This administration has lied to get us involved in a quagmire war, ruined the career of a CIA agent for political revenge, alienated the U.S. from most of the world and is leading the country on the road to financial ruin. Nice job George W. Bush, your doing a helluva job!
Well just brand me with a yellow star and send me off to the bigtexxx concentration camp for American liberals.
Wow. You know you've hit a nerve when all the right wing fanatics come out swinging, foaming at the mouth, and not addressing the merits of the issue at hand.
Then maybe you should consider supporting him instead of bad mouthing the efforts of the troops and working to erode support for them at home. All lies from you. 1. Bill Clinton in 1998 said Iraq had WMD 2. Saddam couldn't and wouldn't account for previously-accounted for WMD. Were we supposed to take him at his word? Only a fool would trust a tyrannical maniac. 3. No administration official was indicted for outing a CIA operative. You lied. 4. A broad-based coalition of nations support the War on Terror 5. Our economy has achieved 10 CONSECUTIVE QUARTERS of GDP growth north of 3% You are wrong on all counts. Your frustration and anger as a liberal has driven you to extreme inaccuracies.
There are no merits of the issue at hand. Reid is a frustrated liberal who is disappointed that neither Rove nor Cheney were indicted. He's wanting revenge. He didn't consult with Frist on this stunt and thereby violated protocol. Clearly, this wasn't about getting the Phase 2 report on Iraq. That's stupid. There are much easier ways to go about getting this. This move was about grabbing headlines and political grandstanding. The libpigs thought that last week the Administration would fail -- Miers would continue to hurt the base's support and Cheney and Rove would be indicted in a scandal that reached up to the White House. They got neither. Instead, the Republicans gathered momentum from an innocuous Plame outcome and an emboldened Bush who nominated a great conservative justice in Alito. This gimmickery today is simply the liberals' attempt to try to swing momentum back in their favor after last week's disappointments.
Then I suppose you will voice your opposition to the Republicans also as they have agreed to end their blockage to an investigation of pre-war intelligence, I mean how could they stand with the terrorists also? It is an outrage that America wants an answer to how America went to war and why Americans are dying!
Never said I didn't like our troops. Don't plan to meet them at the airport and spit on them either. The troops are doing the best job they can with the situation they have been put into. I just imagine you saying that like the chef in Sienfeld. No soup for you today. I guess Bill had the same bad intelligence as George. I didn't trust Saddam, but was it worth the war? IMHO, no. Haven't been indicted yet. Right now they are just being charged with a bad memory or imcompetence depending on how you look at it. OK, this one made me laugh. Until real wages for American workers go up, then I don't care what the GDP does. I'm not a CEO so the GDP doesn't mean anything unless my salary goes up. Your frustration and anger as a liberal has driven you to extreme inaccuracies.[/QUOTE] I wouldn't say I'm frustrated and I'm absolutely not angry. I just don't agree with you.
Of course not perjury regarding getting head is far more important to the fate of the country than perjury regarding revealing classified information.
TJ was partially correct. This should have been done a long time ago. But the time to stand up to the bullies is past due. The administration lied to get us into the war, and once there mishandeled the war so badly that we are stuck in a quagmire, and it is clear the administration won't do more to actually succeed there. Either the lying or or mismangement is bad enough, and those that defend both, are apologists of the first order.
I know this maybe hopeless but I'm going to try anyway. During the Clinton Impeachment many Republicans asked Democrats to look consider if a Republican president had done what Clinton had done wouldn't they be calling for his head too? For T_J, Texxx and Basso consider in your mind for a moment if this had been a Democratic administration wouldn't you consider the Valerie Plame / Scooter Libby situation to be something very serious that should require looking into much further? My guess is y'all would be apoplectic calling for impeachment hearings of the President and VP along with indictments of the whole Admin.. Conservatives often say to stand on principle so consider the principle here. There is an indictment of one admin official and lots of evidence regarding unethical and uscrupulous dealings by other Admin. officialls. For one moment can you look to principal that says that no matter what the political party is that they should be held accountable?
Almost no one thought Valerie Plame was actually undercover. Her friends already knew she worked for the CIA. She drove there every day to attend her desk job. This is a total political fabrication.
T_J; Now you sound like a Clinton apologists by trying to diminish the nature of the act. Whether her friends knew she worked at the CIA or not is it a crime to reveal that she was an undercover agent? Is it a crime to obstruct an investigation into that crime by lying under oath about what you said and when? There is a principle here and conservatives are the ones who claim to stand up for principle rather than downplay it.
What I find amusing about Mr. Frist and his "outrage" at some perceived breach of Senate protocol is the inescapable fact the he drove a truck through it to personally campaign against the Minority Leader of the Senate, Tom Daschle, in Daschle's home state, something that had never been done in history, because to do so was a breach of Senate protocol. It's way past time for Democrats to stand up and fight this gang of far-right radical Republicans. And if some Republicans don't like it, tough. And if the sane Republicans are concerned about it, then take back your damned party from the radicals. Keep D&D Civil.
The grand jury indicted Libby for obstructing justice, perjury and false statements. It did not indict him for the "underlying crime" of leaking the classified information, under either the Identities Protection Act of 1982 or the Espionage Act of 1917. No amount of posturing and yelling will make true the false charge that the Bush administration "outed" Valerie Plame to hurt its political enemies, to the detriment of national security. It's not just unprovable – it's false. Democrats are going to have come to come up with a better plan to criminalize the war. Nevertheless, under no circumstances do I believe that T-J is minimizing the alleged crimes of obstruction of justice, perjury and false statements, even if the "underlying crimes" were not committed. I personally have difficulty understanding what motive Mr. Libby, reputed to be of stellar character, would have had to allegedly commit those crimes.
Reading the indictment and statements by Fitzgerald should be required. Yes Plame's identity was outed. Fitzgerald said so. He may not be able to prove who did it in a court of law, but his investigation has definitely turned up the fact that her status was classified and she was outed.
