Good point. When I wasn't eating meat, I didn't eat any "substitutes" whatsoever. Although I probably won't be one again, I'm glad I gave it up for a while...it broadened my appreciation of different foods. Now, I need to get back to my cheese steak... x34
That is a significant key. In America, we are simply conditioned that you must have MEAT at every meal. Pasta with tomato sauce isn't enough. You have to have meatballs or sausage. You can't just have a baked potato and a salad (which is more than filling for most). You have to have a taco salad or grilled chicken ceasar with chili on your potato. The best lesson I ever got on this was the first date I went on with Mrs JB. I asked her where we should go to eat knowing she didn't eat meat. She said, "Anywhere I can get a baked potato or a salad or something like that." We even ordered a pizza once and I said, "But, what about the meat?" She said, "You don't have to put meat on the pizza." To this day, we still eat cheese pizzas very often. By the way, maybe the simplest and best meat substitute is ground meat substitute. It is almost impossible to tell the difference if you season it correctly, particularly when it is in something like spaghetti sauce or a caserole. I know people who have served it to meat eaters and they didn't know the difference.
My thing is. . . . If you giving up meat. . . GIVE UP MEAT Why go with substitutes and imitations....if you like the taste texture etc of meat why give it up? Rocket River
Very interesting topic, BK. So happens that in August of last year I (more or less) eliminated red meat from my diet. The (more or less) is that I cheat maybe once in a couple of months. Let's just say that I know my limitations. I also got rid of non-scaled fish as well. That was probably harder than the red meat. I had to leave the house on my son's birthday for a while (a menu of shrimp and scallops) because I just couldn't take it. My wife, silly her, tried to cut it cold turkey. She almost went crazy! She had the shakes and everything! For me, it hasn't been really bad. Like everything, it was hard at first, but now I don't really think about it much. The results have been amazing: my blood pressure's improved dramatically (I was borderline hypertensive), I feel younger and I even feel smarter.
I greatly reduced my red meat intake by switching to turkey and chicken. Chicken fried chicken can almost make you forget about a great chicken fried steak. Turkey burgers and ground turkey aren't for everyone, but I have enjoyed them quite a bit. I've actually gotten to the point now where I'll take turkey or chicken brest over a steak 90% of the time. I've tried some veggie burgers and they aren't too bad, but they are out of my price range to eat on a regular basis. Is pork considered red meat? I guess I don't do so well on avoiding red meat in the mornings if that is the case. Every morning at work I get a breakfast taco with ham, bacon, churisso, sausage, potato and egg. I only started doing that since I got my current job. Before I'd switch off between oatmeal and cereal, but I'd rather have a freshly cooked breakfast taco for a buck vs. cereal. B
Red meat: easy Chicken: easy Pork: easy fish/seafood: mixed bag sushi: hard, although most places make a lot of vegetable-based rolls, etc... milk: easy cheese: easy (except for the fancy French cheeses ) River, Personally, I don't like a lot of meat substitutes, but if I use any, it is just for something different than tofu or tempeh or whatever. If I have a burger, I choose to avoid boca- the things that try to taste and have texture like real meat...I just don't like them. I, instead, will go for more grain, bean, or vegetable based kinds. I just think they tatse better than "soy steak" types. There are some good fake fish produts (typically only found in asian markets), but that is because they are wrapped in seaweed...anything with that is gooood.
I'm also vegetarian, but it took me about 1 1/2 years to fully eliminate meat from my diet. There were things I thought I could just never stand getting rid of, like pepperoni on pizzas (that was my last thing!), but fortunately my wife is both vegan and a nutritionist, which made it much easier. I imagine it would be very difficult if you had kids or a spouse that wanted to keep eating meat and you had to "go it alone." I also want to agree with Jeff about the benefits of soy *and* state that as Americans, we tend to vastly overestimate our daily needs for protein. I know that I get that question a lot when people ask me about my vegetarianism -- "Where do you get your protein?" But unless you are some kind of serious weight-lifter and are trying to put on lots of muscle mass, you can easily get as much as you need from soy, beans, or other legumes and nuts.
dude!! veggie pepperoni rocks! if you've never tried it, find some and slap it on a pizza, you'll think you're eating the real thing! (minus some grease)
I gave it up my senior year in college. After I graduated, I moved back in with my folks here in Houston. At the dinner table my first night back, my Dad plopped a big juicy T-bone on my plate. When I told him I didn't eat that stuff anymore, he said "you do if you're living under my roof". So that was the end of that. I think it's easy to give up red meat, but you have to really want to do it, like giving up cigarettes. If you convince yourself properly & strenuously enough, you can change any part of your lifestyle you want to.
For those of us who don't have moral objections to eating animals at least some of the time, it seems like a compromise is in order. It does seem that some people have to have meat at every meal, and I don't know why. For me, some meals happen to have meat and some don't. Usually the ones I cook at home don't (because it's easier not to bother with cooking the meat), and the ones I eat out do. I've gone several days without meat and haven't even noticed. That's fine. I don't eat much. However, giving it up entirely seems unnecessary. Saying "I can never eat it again" is a lot harder than saying "I'm not going to eat it most of the time." Taco Cabana fajita tacos alone are enough reason not to give up beef. Also, red meat tends to be fattier, but if you get lean cuts of beef or pork I don't see the problem. Good protein. Chicken is healthy, people think. Well, one of my favorite guilty pleasures is Church's fried chicken tenders with purple pepper sauce. They are sooo crispy. I'm not sure if I even care about the chicken so much as enjoying the "fried" aspect of it. Right now, my diet isn't in great shape, but it's not from too much meat. There's plenty of other stuff out there to cause problems, such as cheese, french fries, desserts, and pretty much anything non-fruit or vegetable if you aren't exercising. For some reason, when we're busy, our hunger instinct kicks in and we're miserable if we don't eat much... and don't have time to cook healthy food at home... but that's a whole 'nother topic...
Genesis 9: 2,3 "The fear and dread of you will fall upon all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air, upon every creature that moves along the ground, and upon all the fish of the sea; they are given into your hands. Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything. "
<i>He who, seeking his own happiness, punishes or kills beings who also long for happiness, will not find happiness after death.</i> - Dhammapada (sayings of the Buddha) <i>"You must not use your God-given body for killing God's creatures, whether they are human, animal or whatever." (Yajur Veda, 12.32) "By not killing any living being, one becomes fit for salvation." (Manusmriti, 6.60)</i> - Hindu Spiritual Texts <i>Encouraging responsible stewardship as Christ's ambassadors for the reconciliation of all Creation - II Cor. 5:13, 17-21; Col. 1:16-23</i> - Slogan and accompanying verses from http://www.christianveg.com . <i>The recent chief rabbi of Israel, Scholomo Goren, is a strict vegetarian and so was the first chief rabbi of the modern state of Israel, Abraham Isaac Kook. Kook's successor, the late Isaac ha-Levi Herzog, wrote: "Jews will move increasingly to vegetarianism out of their own deepening knowledge of what their tradition commands...Man's carnivorous nature is not taken for granted or praised in the fundamental teachings of Judaism...A whole galaxy of central rabbinic and spiritual leaders...has been affirming vegetarianism as the ultimate meaning of Jewish moral teaching."</i> From Judaism and Vegetarianism by Ted Altar <i>"The Holy Prophet Muhammad (S) was asked by his copmpanions if kindness to animals was rewarded in the life hereafter. He replied: 'Yes, there is a meritorious reward for kindness to every living creature'." (Bukhari) "There is not an animal on earth, nor a bird that flies on its wings - but they are communities like you." (The Quran, 6:38) "The Holy Prophet (S) forbade the beating or the branding of animals. Once he saw a donkey branded on its face and said: 'may Allah condemn the one who branded it'." (Muslim) "The Holy Prophet (S) condemned those who pinion or restrain animals in any other way for the purpose of target shooting. (Al-Masburah and Al-Mujaththamah)." (Muslim) "The Holy Prophet (S) said: 'It is a great sin for man to imprison those animals which are in his power'." (Muslim)</i> - Islamic references to vegetarianism and treatment of animals <i>If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who deal likewise with their fellow men. Not to hurt our humble brethren is our first duty to them, but to stop there is not enough. We have a higher mission - to be of service to them wherever they require it.</i> - St. Francis of Assisi How's that?
I haven't had beef in over a year... I don't see what's so great about it. Chicken and fish both taste exponentially better and are a hell of a lot easier to chew... Beef biproducts(milk, cheese, etc.) on the other hand, would be damn near impossible for me to give up.
I gave it up for a month, and it wasn't bad. Then I tried to give it up for longer, and I went crazy. As long as there was some date in the future, when I could cut loose and half my steak, everything was alright. I eat red meat maybe once per week. It's a good balance for me.
And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat. Genesis 1:29 This scripture is why the African Israelites are vegan.
rimmy: That's odd. I'm aware of that scripture, but a later covenant permitted them to eat meat. Pretty explicit, I believe.
