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Rangers get Lee give up SO MUCH TALENT, uhum Astros....

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by roflmcwaffles, Jul 9, 2010.

  1. Mailman

    Mailman Member

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    That may be true, but I really don't care about proportioning credit or blame between a GM and his underlings because ultimately accountability is all on the GM. How much credit or blame do we give Tim Purpura when the Astros were winning under Gerry Hunsicker's tenure? I don't think it matters.

    Matsui was by far his worst move, but in the end it didn't cost the team any prospects. Villareal was a wash because he gave up Josh Anderson. Where's Josh Anderson? Really, who cares? That didn't impact the team negatively. As for the consternation over the Feliz deal, get over it. It was a temporary stopgap at third, a one year deal for 4.5mm to get a guy who was supposed to help improve the defense on the left side of the field and provide some insurance in case Chris Johnson wasn't ready. If Johnson hadn't gotten hurt, the Feliz deal wouldn't have become such a focal point. As for Wolf, I am gobsmacked that you could supposedly complain about overpaying for a guy like Lyon while criticizing Wade for not outbidding the Brewers for Wolf's services. Do you know what his contract particulars are? How about 3 yrs/30 million for a 33yr old pitcher. I like the guy a lot but this team right now is in no position to take on that kind of salary for a Randy Wolf.

    I am not at all convinced that Oswalt's contract is the albatross the pundits are making it out to be when I know for a fact that it is well under market value for a pitcher of his ilk. We are talking about the guy with the fourth-best active ERA, fourth-best W-L%, seventh-best active WHIP, and he has a lot of playoff experience. Yes, he is owed the remainder of his salary this year and 16 mill next year, but the final year on the contract includes a two million dollar club option. In my mind he is a perfect acquisition for a contending team in the market for an ace because he does not come with a long-term contract but he's better than a half-season rental.

    One factor you have to keep in minding in comparing the Rangers acquisition of Cliff Lee is the setback they suffered this week in the potential ownership change. There is virtually no chance that situation gets settled before the trade deadline, which made it next-to-impossible for the Rangers front office to take on any salary this year or commit to additional salary next year. Hence, the Mariners agreeing to pay most of Lee's salary this year....

    I think Ryan wanted Oswalt first because he'd be better than a rental, but when the legal proceedings got delayed yet again he knew they had to act quickly to get Cliff Lee.
     
  2. rockets934life

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    Good points but a couple of things to point out, it wasn't that acquiring Oscar was the issue but the contract that was then given to him that was a BAD move..2 yrs almost 3 million and Wolf actually had a GREAT year with the DODGERS who signed him for 1 yr 5 million. Saying that, Wolf probably is more on Uncle D then Wade. I was actually okay with the Feliz move so not going to kill him to much on that but CJ looks to have been ready to help the team thus why go out and sign the guy? Overall, he has done an okay job no real issue with the guy and, like I said, in development area Heck seems to be getting the organization on the right track again.

    I do somewhat agree with you on Roy in that if the right package isn't there then don't just trade him for peanuts, he is still under control for another year and much like Halladay he could be dealt in the offseason for a nice package. Saying that, if the reason we don't move Roy is Drayton not wanting to eat some of the cash owed while the prospects are there to be had, then it goes back to management.
     
  3. Kate81

    Kate81 Member

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    I'd like to see Roy-O make a run on a Championship team such as the Yankees. That'd be nice to see.
     
  4. Mailman

    Mailman Member

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    The average major league salary is what, 3-4 mill per year, and you want to make hay over Oscar Villareal getting 2.85 over 2 years? If that's what you're hanging your hat on to skewer Wade, then you are wasting your time and really stretching the case. Matsui, yes, but Villareal? Cmon.

    As for Wolf, I assume you are talking about the 2007 year? First, it wasn't the Dodgers who signed him (it was San Diego) and he was coming off a significant shoulder injury. I can't fault any GM for not taking that risk, especially since Wolf wasn't thought of as highly then as he was a year-and-a-half later.
     
  5. Mailman

    Mailman Member

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    Nah, I'd like to see him do it in Tampa.
     
  6. Mailman

    Mailman Member

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    Never mind, I understand what you're saying now. I still don't understand what the whole backstory was on that offer that they pulled from him that year.

    I have less of a problem with that one that I do Wigginton. Never should've let that guy get away.....
     
  7. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    Wiggington was arbitration eligible, coming off $5 mil/yr. To keep him would have cost $7mil - $8mil per year. No way in hell is he worth that.

    It is just a stupid reality of the arbitration system that if the Astros don't give him that ridiculous contract via arbitration, he is probably going to go somewhere else.
     
  8. Refman

    Refman Member

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    Seattle got Smoak and 3 highly regarded prospects for Lee and a reliever who just had back surgery. It is not unheard of for an Oswalt to bring 3 good prospects. Also, Seattle is paying $2.5 M. That is a far cry from subsidizing a larger salary this year and next. It is that type of move that landed the Rangers in bankruptcy court.
     
  9. MadMax

    MadMax Member

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    ask the list of coaches that find their heads on the block every season....it's results-oriented business.
     
  10. Joe Joe

    Joe Joe Go Stros!
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    Morey was a major part of the Celtics organization and left them closer to their championship than Wade. When he came to the Rockets, he explained that Boston was trying to gather assets so they could then flip those into stars to pair with Pierce. The Celtics got lucky and this plan happened with the Celtics getting Garnett and Allen

    Morey comes to Rockets with the GM red carpet for him because of his work in Boston at getting them in position to acquire stars. He acquires assets so that he can try to flip them to give Yao some help. So far, Morey has been unlucky at his attempts to get stars like Bosh, but has the Rockets in good position if the opportunity ever happens. Even if Yao goes down for the entire season this year, they have a good chance to make the playoffs.

    In the four years preceding Morey, the Rockets averaged 43 wins. Last year without Ming and McGrady broken...Morey's players still won 42. During Morey's 4 years with the Rockets, they have broken 50 wins 3 years. Morey has earned his reputation. The only thing Morey hasn't been able to do is draft a superstar (the closest opportunity being Gay and he is only half a player) or get one to sign with the Rockets.

    Wade is behind both Smith and Morey. I do like Wade and would give him some more time to get Astros turned around as baseball is a much slower sport in most regards. I do fear that Wade is trying to go for Major League Ready Talent for Oswalt and Berkman. The Astros need to build slowly as it requires 25 players versus 8-9 for a basketball rotation.
     
  11. DontTradeOswalt

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    I think the astros should trade berkman, I heard the rays were interested in berkman, ed wade should do it! Rays are loaded with talent
     

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