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Random Trade Thread 2023-24

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Shark44, Jul 10, 2023.

  1. astrosrule

    astrosrule Member

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    The 2 easiest ways to improve are 1. having a good lead guard or 2. having an elite defensive big. We won't have #2 but we're going from a horrific PG to a good PG, which will improve the team a ton
     
  2. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

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    Fred VanVleet by all accounts of those who know basketball
    will tell you Fred VanVleet is a 5'11" Shooting Guard.

    His numbers were worse than KPj' s while having better coaches
    and better teammates.

    With no 3-pt shooters it's idiotic to walk the ball up the
    court and force your offense with no spacing to go up
    against the set half court defense of your opponent.
    Fred VanVleet likes to walk the ball up the court.
    Less efficient FG% of KPj while taking more shoots.



    So you have two strikes against you on your point 1 & 2.

    What was your win-loss totals for last year (preseason)?
     
  3. astrosrule

    astrosrule Member

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    I think last season i was in the 18-20 range. Are you saying that FVV is WORSE then KPJ as a starting PG?
     
  4. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

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    I'm not saying KPj is good....but I am saying both are average.

    Lord help us if our elite point guard (FVv) is shooting 9 three pointers
    a game as he averaged the last few seasons.

    Rockets were 30th in 3P%
    Raptors were 27th in 3P%

    Opponents loaded up the paint making it hard for PG's to penetrate
    and facilitate in the paint with 4 sets of arms clogging up the paint.

    That's why both (KPj & Steady Freddy) had poor numbers.

    Nick Nurse ran plays while Silas ran vanilla 5-man out with
    no movement for 3/4 of the season. Silas was making it easy
    for defenses to guard us because we were tanking.

    Silas didn't add movement until the final 24 games of both
    of the last two seasons.

    Brunson got $27M and VanVleet is not near Brunson. At the
    most VanVleet should have gotten $25M. We overpaying him
    $18Million. It's BS for Udoka saying they will compete for
    the starting job. Udoka is not going to let KPj or Amen
    win the starting gig at PG. And have Fred VanVleet
    coming off the bench while making $43 million.

    Dillon Brooks won't come off the bench. He will refuse to
    accept that. I doubt Dillon Brooks will accept Jalen Green
    take more shots than him. Dillon thinks he can shoot
    and score like LeBron or some crazy thing like that.
     
  5. astrosrule

    astrosrule Member

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    I mean even you have to admit that fvv as an overall player completely blows away kpj…..or at least i would hope so

    Edit- surprised you’re positive on brunson, last offseason you were calling people like me idiots for saying he’s better then kpj
     
    #85 astrosrule, Jul 19, 2023
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2023
  6. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

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    Both are too diminutive for my liking.
     
  7. astrosrule

    astrosrule Member

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    Would you rather have a short pg who’s good or a tall pg who’s awful?
     
  8. OremLK

    OremLK Member

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    Honestly starting to think we should just trade KPJ for a non-lottery pick or something, to avoid locker room drama, add trade assets for future superstar availabilities, and make room for Cam and Amen to get more minutes. Maybe we get in on the Harden trade as a third team with KPJ going to Philly? Maybe send him up to Toronto for like, Thaddeus Young, a first rounder, and filler?
     
    Little Bit likes this.
  9. CHAMPBOY

    CHAMPBOY Member

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    Sengun is a nice Pick and Roll players in the paint, but he plays very inferior with team that has size. He played SCARED, WEAK and PASSIVE when he is playing against Cleveland, Indiana, Philadelphia, and other big teams. I know everyone is glad he is a legit 6’11 now but his WINGSPAN is small for a center. We play well against inferior centers but but good centers his play is inferior. I know, I know…he is only 20 years old but he needs a outside shot, get bigger and stronger to be a legit center….also the 3rd year is the big year of a player development…
     
  10. CHAMPBOY

    CHAMPBOY Member

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    We need a defensive center, who can rebound and alter shots….JABARI needs to gain weight
     
  11. Mathloom

    Mathloom Shameless Optimist
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    I don't know. I don't think anyone is convinced that he's a long term good rotation player, so I doubt we get anything but a couple of second rounders for him. I don't think Udoka is anywhere near as optimistic as everyone else about Whitmore and Amen's rookie seasons. One of them can't shoot well at all and the other just turned 19 and is learning how to function in a team setting. On any average team, these two should get very limited minutes. On Udoka's team? I think it would be very difficult.

    Udoka is about to turn the intensity VERY high as he seeks to make the playoffs. I think rotations will be short and the little bit of "allowing mistakes" development time won't even be enough for Jabari/Sengun/Green/Eason. That's almost half the rotation already. Those 4 are extremely young for a playoff run where they are the most important pieces, so you can imagine how young the two rookies are in comparison. Add to that Udoka just called Amen a pure PG while we just signed a starting PG and a 3rd string vet PG. I anticipate a rotation of 9 players.

    If the only thing that matters is making the playoffs, it's a strategic mistake to have too many young players. Age is one of the most major determinants of your ability to win. Almost any collection of 30 year olds under the cap being paid their market price will at least challenge to make the playoffs. Almost any team consisting mostly of young players will not make the playoffs. Most contenders contain lots of 30 year olds and that's not a coincidence. If Jabari/Sengun/Green/Eason are going to get a lot of minutes and responsibility, I think we are dangerously close to a shortage of older veterans in the rotation. Don't think we'll add both Amen and Whitmore to that rotation because it's highly likely both of them will be making rookie mistakes even later in the season.

    Easy to trade KPJ any time and worth taking one more flyer on him if you ask me. I don't think we should be in a rush to trade him as he could surprise us as one of the best 6th men in the league - which would help us make the playoffs, raise his trade value and create a perfect bridge for Whitmore/Amen to develop slowly. If he gets beat out by Whitmore/Amen, then we can just waive him in the summer or see if anyone is interested. Very low risk, we have him on the kind of contract that gives us great flexibility.
     
    fattz and OremLK like this.
  12. OremLK

    OremLK Member

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    Rebounding is not Sengun's problem, he's one of the best rebounders in the league.

    Landale is also a very good rebounder. 14 rebounds per 100 possessions.

    We're going to have to hope we get extra shotblocking from the perimeter to make up for relatively weak shotblocking at the 5. Amen, Cam, Jabari, and Tari will all pick up some blocks.
     
  13. OremLK

    OremLK Member

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    Good points and well-stated. I don't know that I agree Udoka will run a short rotation though--remember he came up under Pop who was always comfortable running large rotations and making use of a deep bench. I think Ime will be impressed by Amen's and Cam's motors and defensive intensity, and will be underwhelmed by KPJ in those areas.

    I don't think it's likely we'll just dump KPJ's contract, but I'd honestly probably prefer it, even if it costs us a couple wins and potentially making the play-in. I don't agree with all the offseason moves (Brooks contract, cough), but I do like the energy level and competitive drive of all the players we brought in, and I think KPJ is a guy who works against all of that. I also want Amen and Cam to get enough reps to improve quickly so they can contribute to contending Rockets teams in the near future.
     
    fattz likes this.
  14. larsv8

    larsv8 Member

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    Buy low on Gobert, we now have filler salary to make it work. (KPJ, Tate, JeffG, Landale)

    FVV / Amen / Hinton
    Green / Whitmore / Magee
    Brooks / Tari
    Jabari / Mayer
    Gobert / Sengun
     
  15. Francis3422

    Francis3422 Member

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    I’m pretty hard on Porter sometimes but as I have always said, this is a young player on a great contract. His trade value currently is going to go up as long as his behavior remains as it has been. Trading him now is silly. If we wait till February, we will have a lot more clarity. Worth it to wait.
     
  16. Hemingway

    Hemingway Member
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    Really no point to just dumping KPJ. Might as well wait and see how he does in a bench role. I suspect Cam starts in RGV until we trade Tate and KPJ, unless he just blows it away in pre-season like Tari did last year. I think they try to get in play-in contention this year by vastly improving their defense. FVV has not been good offensively and I really didn’t want them to sign him. I warmed up to it after it became a 2 year contract, if only for the defense and veteran presence. He has not always been a bad 3 pt shooter, so if they run the offense through Sengun most of the time, I think FVV will end up as a decent spot up shooter. It will be interesting to see if Ime will bench Brooks for bad shots. If Brooks refuses to play a Tucker role and Ime doesn’t do anything about it, we hired the wrong guy.
     
  17. RHU525

    RHU525 Member
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    I can't believe there is someone out here who still wants Rudy Gobert....
     
  18. dfbreyes

    dfbreyes Member

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    jch1911 likes this.
  19. larsv8

    larsv8 Member

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    Rudy Gobert is a high impact player.

    I can't believe people convinced themselves he isn't.

    Classic buy low scenario.
     
    #99 larsv8, Jul 25, 2023
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2023
  20. prs325

    prs325 Member

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    I’ll wait for Myles Turner to become available
     
    jch1911 likes this.

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