1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Rafer Alston: Shoot 1st, Pass 2nd

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by kryten128, Nov 28, 2006.

  1. cenbo416

    cenbo416 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2005
    Messages:
    356
    Likes Received:
    0
    There is nothing wrong with Rafer taking those wide open shots. As a point guard, I like the way he pushes the ball, but he did a bad job passing the ball to Yao at the best time - these times go away quickly. T-Mac did a great job finding Yao at those moments. I hope Novak can take some of the shots Rafer took, thus we'll be better off.
     
  2. jeremyang2002

    jeremyang2002 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    659
    Likes Received:
    0
    Agree here.

    He could be more efficient in playing around 30 PPG instead of 37 PPG.

    Especially in 4th QT, his role is redundant and he becomes an exclusive 3pt shooter.

    V-Span's defense, Hayes' rebound, Novak's shooting all could be better choices under different situations.
     
  3. solid

    solid Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2001
    Messages:
    21,209
    Likes Received:
    9,032
    I am not a fan of Rafer, IMO, he is a mediocre NBA PG on the lower end of the scale. Good handles, but not a particularily good playmaker, defender, or shooter. Like the older version of Wesley, seems to be a really nice guy, but the Rockets have their quota of nice guys. I wish we had a PG that was an aggressive, hardnosed defender, and a lights out shooter. That would make the game much easier for TMac and Ming. But we don't. And if you think Rafer is being flamed now, wait til Steve Nash has a go at him.

    Could Maggette run the Point?
     
  4. jeremyang2002

    jeremyang2002 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    659
    Likes Received:
    0
    Nobody has problems with him when the shooting is wide open.

    But Rafer is shooting average 3pt 6.3 per game, does he really has so many wide open times?
     
  5. Deuce

    Deuce Context & Nuance

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2001
    Messages:
    26,598
    Likes Received:
    35,723
    Clutch, I think it's quite clear that with the way our offense is being run right now Alston is going to get shots. And they are WIDE OPEN shots. No one is leaving Hayes because he has shown that he will put in that layup. No one is leaving Battier in the corner. It is Alston at the arch that is wide open.

    Clearly the PG position on this team with Tmac initiating the offense in the half court is pretty much relegated to a spot up shooter. This is NOT Alston's skillset. And that is a problem. It IS Head's skillset though. Something to ponder.

    Also, if we put Vspan in this position, I dont want him jacking shots there either. He needs to have the 'green light' from JVG to DRIVE on those plays. We saw a couple of times against the Wolves where Vspan's dribble penetration was key in getting to the FT line. Who else is going to do that for us sans Tmac? And wouldn't this skillset be VERY nice to have in the game when Tmac is NOT on the floor? When our offense is STAGNANT?

    I think the system is ok, we just need to shuffle the roles on some of these players and/or continue to look around the league to find players that best fit our system.
     
  6. real_egal

    real_egal Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2003
    Messages:
    4,430
    Likes Received:
    247
    I am happy for the win, and happier about the fact they remained poise and executed in finish minutes, when Rafer and Battier contributed the most. However, I am concerned about those 1-9 shooting streches. There is no rule saying if you are open for a 3, you must take a 3, otherwise, you would be given a Technical. Rafer did practice a lot in the Summer for his 3 pointers, but still, he's not a great shooter. After 3, 4 consecutive missed shots, maybe he should have adjusted a little bit, by stepping in for a 2, or driving a little bit more. It doesn't have to be a 3. Eric Snow is a terrible 3 pointer shooter, but what's good about him is that he knows it, and even he's open for the 3, he will take one dribble and step in for a closer 2, and shoots at a decent percentage. In today's NBA, fewer and fewer players can make a mid-range jumper on a consistent base; fewer and fewer players can stop the dribble and pull a decent jumper. Looking at those bricks Howard, Rafer, Snyder, and Head laid in mid-range, I could only shake my head. It's easier to improve your 2 pointer shooting than 3 pointers, and it will improve our team greatly.

    If Battier hadn't shot 5-5 from downtown, last night could well have been another meltdown. I guess then, Rafer would have had a much harder time to repeat his routine post-game quote "we need to play with higher intensity" etc. Maybe then he would start the quote with an "I", that he should have shot less 3s. It's not a crime for a not so good shooter to pass up a wide open 3.
     
  7. Amel

    Amel Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    Messages:
    10,641
    Likes Received:
    5,726
    totally
     
  8. jeremyang2002

    jeremyang2002 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    659
    Likes Received:
    0
    I dont think Maggette ever plays PG in his whole career. Of course he is a very aggressive scorer and gets a lot of free throws.

    Ideal PG for this team should be high ass/to ratio, good one-on-one defender, reliable outside shooting.
     
  9. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2003
    Messages:
    61,810
    Likes Received:
    41,282
    LOL, yeah just a little matter of missing 9 of 10 shots before getting hot....of course he heated up after that and was 2-13 before the 3rd period buzzer sounded....

    Uh, sorry to break it to you but Marko Jaric almost never plays PG and hasn't really for years, so Rafer didn't guard him, and James barely played. Randy Foye on the other hand lit Rafer up like a christmas tree and keyed the T-Wolves comeback (including a few occasions where he straight up embarrassed Rafer to the point where Rafer would have been laughed off of the court at the Rucker league), Troy Hudson also contributed some offense from the PG slot in limited minutes.

    He didn't hold anybody to anything, and showed why he's a luxury and a liability. You think it was Alston that created his few late assists and not Yao?
     
  10. DarkHorse

    DarkHorse Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 1999
    Messages:
    6,751
    Likes Received:
    1,294
    This was my thought as well. Of course we're just making stuff up, but what about a starting lineup with Yao, Hayes, Battier, McGrady, and Head. With McGrady and Battier initiating the offense, feeding the ball into Yao, suddenly Head becomes that much more dangerous than Rafer.

    And then in the second unit, you bring in Rafer and Billy for the penetration and a different look. Yao has proven that he can hit the cutters, and TMac's having the best assists year of his career. You could definitely see the Rockets running more of a motion-style offense with a lineup like that.
     
  11. bejezuz

    bejezuz Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2002
    Messages:
    2,772
    Likes Received:
    69
    Everybody knows Rafer has weaknesses. My question is, who could you replace him with, given the needs of the team.

    Here are the parameters:

    1. Speedy player with handles who can bring up the ball.
    2. Low turnovers
    3. Good defender, not undersized
    4. Pass first, shoot second
    5. Deadly three point shooting
    6. Reliable third scorer without needing the ball constantly
    7. Strong enough to drive and score in traffic
    8. Ability to drive and dish
    9. Moderate salary (MLE or slightly higher)

    I really think that we're demanding from the PG position a player that is very rare. You're asking for a bigger, stronger version of Rafer who shoots better and is a playmaker, all while retaining Rafer's speed and low turnovers. Good luck getting that guy given our salary restraints.
     
  12. Deuce

    Deuce Context & Nuance

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2001
    Messages:
    26,598
    Likes Received:
    35,723
    I don't know DarkHorse, that would require JVG to break his iron clad subsitution pattern. We certainly can't try something new. :rolleyes:

    In all seriousness. Alston and his 36% from 3pt range at the arch or Head at 50%? Where the hell is Morey to throw some numbers at JVG!?!?
     
  13. EssTooKayTD

    EssTooKayTD Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2005
    Messages:
    3,343
    Likes Received:
    74
    I like the guy. Everyone makes mistakes and misses shots. He knew what to do when we were struggling to get the ball in to Yao. Drive, and dish. He found Battier for the 1st of his big 3s in the 4th. And he did it again right after that. Then he hits a big one on his own. Then scores on a drive (if I remember right).

    We are still winning. Never hear **** if he's making shots, but if he doesn't keep shooting *mostly* open shots, then we might not win b/c he hits em down the stretch.

    Too much hate for a team that is winning.
     
  14. bejezuz

    bejezuz Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2002
    Messages:
    2,772
    Likes Received:
    69
    Head's a better shooter than Rafer, but he'll definitely turn the ball over more and he's nowhere near the playmaker. Defensively, they're in the same league. So why screw with something that's working (10-4, baby) when we're already one of the worst teams in the league at turning the ball over.

    My take, starting Head or starting Rafer is just swaping strengths and weaknesses. So why screw up chemistry when we're winning?
     
  15. Cohen

    Cohen Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 1999
    Messages:
    10,751
    Likes Received:
    6

    He has it in him.

    He shot 50% in the preseason, even from 3pt land.
     
  16. Yetti

    Yetti Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2002
    Messages:
    9,589
    Likes Received:
    529
    Don't talk about hate when you say things such as he get the ball to Yao! Rafer has great trouble in passing the ball to Yao Ming, especially when he is set up in scoring position and calling for the ball.
     
  17. Fuse

    Fuse Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2006
    Messages:
    1,488
    Likes Received:
    2
    I agree, most of us are asking too much of him with that salary constraint. I think we would be hard pressed to find somene that fits are parameters with a MLE.

    TJ Ford, Chris Paul, and Deron Williams that comes to mind that are in that wage bracket, but I think all three of their salaries will balloon once their contracts are up for renewal. So in other words, we won't find someone like that.
     
  18. rmoreno

    rmoreno Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2006
    Messages:
    317
    Likes Received:
    18
    I think rafer is doing what he has to do. AGAIN, Yao is being double teamed every possesion and for some reason McGrady has still not found his offensive groove. I think people need to get of Rafer's back, as he is doing what Van Gundy wants him to do (and that is shoot if he's open) :mad: .
     
  19. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2003
    Messages:
    61,810
    Likes Received:
    41,282
    In preseason, Kelvin Cato had it in him to be a game-changing defensive force.
     
  20. solid

    solid Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2001
    Messages:
    21,209
    Likes Received:
    9,032
    Thanks, I couldn't remember about Maggette. All I know is that I have always been impressed with his game and felt he would be a good addition to the Rockets. Would the Clippers be interested in a deal for him? That would be interesting. At least, it would add another scorer to the lineup.
     

Share This Page