Hmm...well some of it could certainly be true. Maybe some things could be worded differently too that would make better sense to me. For example, the PS3 does not really use any proprietary chipsets...at least, based on what I would call proprietary (the EE and GS are definitely proprietary). The Cell processor could probably be called that I guess, but it was developed (and supported strongly) by IBM and is being used in a variety of devices. AFAIK, Cell supports C, so it isn't like you are writing in assembly like you were with the PS2 (and PSP too I think?). The RSX GPU was made by Nvidia, and is basically not that different from the graphics card in my PC AFAIK (maybe I'm wrong?). I'm pretty sure it uses support and tools similar to Nvidia's graphics cards, although Sony has probably released their own tools and support to "help" (especially in trying to get Cell and RSX to work together). Those might be difficult to work with though. In a way, the 360 uses much more proprietary technology, although I'm assuming it isn't as bad when Microsoft and ATI are helping out as opposed to Sony and (IIRC) Toshiba (or whoever helped Sony make the GS). I think I even read that Sony originally had another GPU lined up for the PS3 (one that would have very nice tech specs), but they went with Nvidia to make a GPU based on their previous history with complicated GPUs and problems with them. Now as for them helping out Japanese developers, this could be true, but I'm pretty sure that much of the team that creates the tools and support for the PS3 are American or European (especially if you count IBM and Nvidia in the process, as well as some other development support company Sony acquired recently whose name I forget). Now technically speaking, they may still be favoring Japanese companies, but that would be a difficult process I imagine (as much as MS helping Japan in a way I would think). And if they are doing that, I certainly can't tell they're helping them given some of the efforts by Japanese developers compared to Western developers (outside of Square-Enix and Konami....but they may still not be getting much help from Sony, though they should if they need it). I do know for a fact that Sony helped one western developer, helping them write 20% of their multiplatform engine, and their game didn't even debut on PS3 first. At GDC, they talked about how their latest tools (which may not have even gone out to all developers yet) were multiplatform friendly, although they could have easily changed that to make things worse. That might not really mean much though, just thought it was interesting to hear at the time. Maybe you can see why I was wondering about some things. Based on what I know, Sony still needs a lot of work on their tools and support, especially in comparison to Microsoft. At the very least, I think they should be more aggressive in releasing their 1st party tools to 3rd parties since it seems pretty obvious that they're using something that 3rd parties don't have access to; this might be a somewhat normal practice, but they can't really afford to keep developers in the dark on this kind of stuff. But it always seemed to me like they were taking a bit of a different approach with things this generation than they were in previous generation, especially on the technology side (although it is still difficult to get the most out of the system). I have no idea about their arrogance and stuff like that though. Hopefully, they start seeing reality pretty soon (if they haven't already) or else they'll start losing even more 3rd party support. It seems as though their "arrogance" (if you can call it that) in other areas has certainly started to disappear...IMO anyway. edit: I was thinking of SN Systems: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SN_Systems Supposedly, they were to release tools (their ProDG development tools) and support to all developers, but I think I remember reading something that went wrong with that. Either they sucked, or it was delayed. I may be wrong...I know I haven't heard much from them since the acquisition. Well, at least the developers of Cold Winter loved their tools and support (on PS2 anyway).
FYI, this is an example of some of the stuff I've read about Sony's approach with the PS3: http://linuxps3.net/articles/features/sonys-pssg-project-5.html One excerpt: A lot more stuff in there too BTW (including the mention about Sony helping a developer with their engine, and how they're apparently helping out many others). Of course, he could be stretching the truth in some regards, although I'd assume some things can't be wrong (like using standards rather than proprietary stuff). It just seems like a much different approach to things than the PS2, at least to me.
Looks like my op made some fanboys upset. I was going to mention the development tools/money factor in my original post, but I wanted to keep it simple. I also wanted to mention Sony learned from Nintendo's mistakes, thats why they were successful with the PS1/PS2. DD said something about money, thats all it boils down to. If you have a company who is providing you with great tools and funding to develop for, it's hard to say no. Compare the xbox to xbox360 Japanese support. Where as the original xbox had very little support, the 360 is receiving a decent amount. MS has done a few things right, one would be focusing on online gaming. Two, providing the necessary tools to devs. Unified buddy system etc. If the xbox or 360 had the games I wanted to play, you would see me on Live. If you look at my past posts, I am not afraid to complain or talk $hit about Sony, MS or Nintendo. I can't really say the same for you other guys who only speak negatively about one system and praise the other. What's amusing about this forum is if your not a 360 lover, your a Sony fanboy. There's no middle ground for some people here.
whoa whoa whoa slow you role. . . that man may coach a small college basketball team somewhere . . . and that is all that matters Rocket River
I am interested. My searches haven't turned up a lot of useful information so far. I've been using Firefox and OpenOffice on my Windows laptop for over four years now, so I don't think it's going to be very different on Linux. With wireless keyboard and mouse, and hooked up to a HDTV, it could make a great living room computer.
Hmmmm... just did a tiny bit more reading on PS3 benchmarks in Linux. Someone did some "platform neutral" benchmarking on the PS3 using linux, I believe comparing it to other PowerPC (IBM) processors. Apparently unless an app is designed to take advantage of the SPEs in Cell, the PS3 only uses the base processor alone in Linux, which benchmarked somewhere like a higher end G4. That's kind of disappointing. Still enough for web browsing and such. But if the developer kit has been out there since last fall, have some people optimized software for the Cell, or made special applications for it? Media apps could get an immense boost.
Here are probably some of the better threads I've seen about Linux on the PS3: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=129437 (giant general thread started at launch) http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=144383 (slightly newer thread, some updates on the latest developments) The basic impression I get is that it is decent enough for basic apps (web browsing, word processing, some emulators, etc.), but stuff like media playback (specifically HD-media playback) needs some work. Part of it is figuring out how to get the SPEs to help (and help effectively), and part of it is that Sony isn't allowing access to the RSX GPU, so there's no hardware acceleration. I'm not exactly sure what the latest on that is. BTW, I think Wi-Fi wasn't supported at first, although I think it is now supported in Yellow Dog Linux and I believe Ubuntu, which is nice I guess. I was able to find more threads, but they were about specific things (how a certain distro of Linux works with PS3, homebrew development on Cell, etc.), or they more or less repeated stuff you can find in those threads. I can still look for more if this isn't enough though.
In a previous life, I had to deal with Sony and PS1 development tools and I can tell you for a fact that developing for the PS1 was a pain in the butt. I heard the PS2 was only slightly better even though Sony made an effort to make it easier. I remember when the cell processor was being announced that one of the biggest features was there were going to be good development tools for it. I guess even with the tools, the system is still very difficult to optimize for.
No, it's not the board, it's pretty much just you. You're one of the few unabashed hardcore fanboys from any side. Which is why you're such a magnet for criticism.
I had a nice essay written until my Dell crashed with the blue screen of death for the 100th time. IOW - I'm never purchasing a Dell laptop again. I'll get to the skinny if I can remember what I wrote. My OP was to point out DD's statement to be untrue. He said Sony is always difficult to develop for. My reasoning is, if Sony did nothing to help their developers (1st, 2nd, 3rd) they wouldn't have been successful the previous two generations. I guess what he said is true, their systems are more difficult to develop for vs Nintendo/MS/Sega. How difficult, I wouldn't know but some teams have pulled off some amazing feats on their hardware. -I'm gonna hit reply before my laptop dies on me again I interpreted his always difficult to develop for as Sony doesn't help third party developers. I reread my original post and I admit I didn't explain things the way I imagined it in my head. I apologize if it came off as fanboyish.
I think that's your perception as much as anything. As you say in your last post, you came off a little fanboyish earlier on. Everybody does at some point... it's hard to argue about this stuff without coming off as an apologist for one system or the other at some point in time. The truth is, I don't think there's a clear answer... or why would people still be arguing about it? For myself, I bought a PS3. I was on the fence for a looooong time. Finally, the firmware update that allowed upscaling of old PS1/PS2 games tipped the scales. The fact is, I have about 30 old PS1/PS2 games that I absolutely love, and I'm probably never gonna get rid of a lot of them. If I went with the 360, I would've had to buy a new PS2 anyway, because my old one's on its last legs. So my cost savings on the 360 would have been very little when you add in the price of a PS2. Add in the fact that the PS3 can not only PLAY all my old games, but also make them look BETTER, and I'm a happy guy. It sure doesn't hurt that PS3's wireless controllers have rechargable batteries by default, either. Buying batteries for all his 360 controllers all the time drives my brother nuts. And PS3 has Tekken 6. I love Tekken. But what if I didn't have all those old PS1/PS2 games I wanted to play? Then I'd go with 360 easily. In general, it seems to me like games look as good or maybe even slightly better sometimes on the PS3, but the framerates almost always seem to be equal or better on the 360. For myself, I'll take better framerate over better graphics every day of the week. Oh, and online support on the 360 owns, of course. And it has Gears. Gears rules. Each system has its advantages... it just depends on which advantages you care about more. For me, backwards compatibility and upscaling were the overriding factors in my buying decision.
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Much thanks for the help RC. I'll start reading up. Maybe I'll dive in and get a PS3 and HDTV set after the price drop that Sony says they aren't planning.
