President Obama announces that an eleventh-hour debt deal has been reached

My question is where the heck is the Bernanke?

 

Well he has been more than willing to step in before so I don't think he will be absent for long.

 

Central bank meeting next week. I imagine we will get QE3 or some other type of intervention by then. But the ECB is going to have to step up too - they need to figure out a permanent solution to all these European problems.

 

Next week? They should consider meeting earlier.

And is there a permanent solution that doesn't inolve breaking up the Euro?

 

Yes, the fact that they were not in the discussion is a current event and the market is disappointed by that so it is more negative because of that.

Got it?

The sell off today is made up of many things. But it's a loss in confidence, it's the weak economic news combined with the fact that investors now know that there will be no stimulus coming from the gov't in any form based on last week, and that in fact the long term future is all cuts.

Therefore the market, combines with what is happening overseas, is very bearish. It all ties together. To say it's only because of x or y is just not the way to look at the market.

Certainly the fact that we didn't address the economy in the discussion is a strong contributing factor to what we are seeing now.

If you told the market that we were going to have the stimulus extended then the Dow would definitely be performing better. To argue against that is nonsense.

 

follow up again: Guess what, the debt don't matter again according the M-acroeconomist-an in the street:

 

follow up again: Guess what, the debt don't matter again according the M-acroeconomist-an in the sthe street:

Jacob weisberg naile it today - if there's anything that can be shown by all these ridiculous contradictory polls, it's that the general public pretty much can't be bothered to or relied upon to understand the issues....so ultimately what's the point of trying to figure out what they say the want (other than of course exploiting it to get elected)?

 

Exactly. And yet, that's exactly what you attempted to do to make a stupid point that has no basis in fact:

The markets are crashing today because investors feel the spending cuts will result in the fragile economy falling into a double dip recession. DOW down over 300 points.

That's why the bill had to consider those items. Because you now see the repercussions of what happens when you don't address them.

No, it's really not. For starters, everyone already knew about the debt bill and what it contained and didn't contain. Second, the economy was already tanking before this. And third, the UE benefits and payroll cuts aren't done, and still have plenty of opportunity to be extended. The idea that they had to be extended in this bill or the market would crash is utter silliness.

This panic was caused by Italy and Spain being on the verge of crumbling, and the ECB being unable to form a solid policy response to it. The fact that the US is showing signs of weakness is also a big part of it. The fact that UE benefits didn't get extended in the debt ceiling bill is no part of it.

 

Look at Texas. Perry's been crowing about our economy and how we've "managed" the state's deficit crisis, but the crisis didn't hit with full force until this year because of something he is loathe to credit, the Federal stimulus bill. He has attacked it at every opportunity, but that stimulus money kept the state from slashing vital budget priorities like education, social services, and the like. Until now.

What we desperately need immediately, no, yesterday, is another big stimulus package. Does anyone see one coming soon, with the extremists in control of the House? They'd rather burn the house down around their ears, the bloody fools.

 

That is your analysis, but most analysts are saying the lack of economic stimulus or address of the economy was a factor.

In any case, it's your opinion, it's my opinion, and we're just barking at each other at this stage. This is a futile back and forth.

 

thanks major for remaining paitient with some of the ideologues from the left or middle in this debate who refuse to take into account that obama has to work with the other side.

your analysis is appreciated.

 

No, they really aren't.

Except mine is backed up by fact. The ECB just announced a willingness to buy Italian bonds, and the Dow went from -180 to -6 in literally about 7 minutes. This is ALL being driven by Europe.

 

OK, now the Dow has had a 350 point swing in an hour based on the ECB's comments. Please stop arguing that this is being driven by unemployment benefits or payroll tax credits. This is all about Europe and whether it will collapse or not.

 

Indeed.

The ECB is way too conservative (in a monetary, not political sense) and hawkish on inflation. The markets don't believe they will save the Euro...at least not yet.

 

The pentagon reacts as expected and...

On cue:

 

so he calls for tax reform. everyone is going to be happy. i find it funny that you criticized tallanvor's dogma in another thread. that's all i'll say.

 

Osama Bin Laden's goal was to bankrupt the United States through military expenditures.

It worked against the Russians in Afghanistan.

 

Don't get your panties in a wad; I made no commentary - I am simply watching the maneuvering following my minor disagreement with Major:

 

I disagree strongly with Major on the Bush Tax Cut extension. (We actually don't disagree on a great number of issues, although he would probably disagree with that and call me "bizarre" again. No matter. I think he's a weenie sometimes.) At any rate, from where I sit, when that extension business came up and the Republicans used blackmail to "force" the President to extend the largess for the rich, he should have drawn a line in the sand then and said NO. They smelled blood and they've had him back on his heels, reacting to them, ever since. It was a terrible mistake. That extension also happens to be one of the reasons mentioned by the chumps at S&P for their downgrade. In my opinion, that ultimately turned out to be a huge factor behind the disaster "forced" on the nation by the Republicans in the House and the Senate.

 

I agree with you 100%. Obama caved last year to get his Arms treaty through but he really screwed himself over. He should have allowed the gov't to shut down as most people would have backed him on ending Bush tax cut for the rich.