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Pope Francis: The New Tyranny

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by dumbartonbass, Nov 26, 2013.

  1. dumbartonbass

    dumbartonbass Contributing Member
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    I'm not a Catholic, but I do like what Pope Francis is preaching for the most part. His message is more in line with a church for the vast majority of people on earth, not the endowed few. While the Sarah Palin's of the world may not have the capacity to understand his message, this is a message that seems to be giving new life to the Church.
     
  2. B-Bob

    B-Bob my celli weighs a ton
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    The more Christian leaders of any denomination can draw attention to Christ's messages on poverty and wealth accumulation, the better. Bravo, Jesuit Pope. "Society of Jesus" indeed.
     
  3. Dubious

    Dubious Contributing Member

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    this is going to be good, a true paradigm shift in religion and politics

    I wonder if Santorum is going to come around to the teachings of his Pope?
    He was somewhat sane and softened on the Daily Show last week.

    Not Santorum but a leftist Christian, able to take the bully pulpit with the moral high ground, is just the revival Western politics needs.
    You've got to unite the masses against the money or the money will control politics, and for the most part it has no soul.
     
    #3 Dubious, Nov 26, 2013
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2013
  4. MadMax

    MadMax Contributing Member

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    This guy...wow! Love him!
     
  5. underoverup

    underoverup Member

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    He as been excellent so far and is spreading a wonderful message; he is so much better than the last pope.
     
  6. SexyButIgnorant

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    I agree. I like Capitalism with a healthy dose of care for the have-not's.
     
  7. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member

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    When I first saw this thread title I thought it said "Pope Francis: The New Tranny"

    Anyway though this is a good message and the current Pope seems to be following in John Paul II's footsteps of an activist church where he took on Communism to where Francis is taking on Capitalism. Francis in this regard does seem like the anti-Benedicto who seemed to have no problems with wealth and was more concerned with protecting the Church than in activism.
     
  8. B-Bob

    B-Bob my celli weighs a ton
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    That's pretty much on you. :grin:
     
  9. dumbartonbass

    dumbartonbass Contributing Member
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    It took them a few centuries to get a Jesuit, so I think the tranny pope is a ways away.
     
  10. Barkley123

    Barkley123 Member

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    I don't get it, the Catholic Church is one of the most profitable businesses in the world yet he condemns capitalism.

    He says poverty is a problem but names himself after a saint that chose to live in poverty?
     
  11. Joshfast

    Joshfast "We're all gonna die" - Billy Sole
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    Got to start somewhere.
     
  12. bongman

    bongman Member

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    I've always felt that this was the message that Jesus was preaching. Bravo to the Pope!!!
     
  13. Mathloom

    Mathloom Contributing Member

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    I like what this guy says. I still don't necessarily believe he means it. Most of all I don't really believe these types of people are reasonably independent so there's a real danger of buying into the kind of authority that doesn't have a transparent reporting line.

    He's not saying anything we couldn't deduce on our own at this point. No one should change their mind just because this guy says this. He has access to the same information we do.

    But again, it is at least refreshing to hear something so positive coming from him. I like that it re-affirms the wedge between Christianity and greed, something many people even on this board have trouble accepting.
     
  14. Nook

    Nook Member

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    No, with all due respect you do not get it.

    As far as naming himself after a said that chose to live in poverty, I do not see a disconnect. Choosing to live in poverty is different than being FORCED to live in poverty. Further, Francis has come down very hard on other Priests not living in poverty or modest means.
     
  15. Nook

    Nook Member

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    What is your basis for thinking he doesn't mean it? He has lived very modestly for a long time and has been very critical of fellow Priests not living modestly.

    Is he independent? Yes and no. They (Cardinals) will attempt to reign him in, but he has already said a number of things that are not popular with some Cardinals. Pope John Paul II did as well.

    As far as "changing your mind", I don't think that you understand the culture of Catholicism. It isn't a matter of people suddenly changing their mind, it is a matter of redirecting the focus of the Church and using the power of the office to give attention to poverty and disparity. Did Martin Luther King say anything that people didn't already know? Did Ghandi? Really, did anyone other than Christ?.... and even in the case of Christ, there were figures in history that articulated some of his same principles.

    The ability to change the direction of the church at the margins in huge.
     
    1 person likes this.
  16. Barkley123

    Barkley123 Member

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    Again that is contradictory:

    – 'Choosing to live in poverty is different than being FORCED to live in poverty'

    – 'Francis has come down very hard on other Priests not living in poverty'

    So you say people shouldn't be forced to live in poverty and then you praise Francis for trying to force other priests to live in poverty?
     
  17. dumbartonbass

    dumbartonbass Contributing Member
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    He is not trying to force others to live in poverty. In fact, poverty is not the right word for what Francis is attempting to accomplish. How about "modesty?" The concern is that the Church has become too focused on its own ornate culture and possessions at the disservice of the poor. Francis sees this as a contradiction of Jesus' teachings. If Francis sees voluntary, modest living as a means to get closer to the heart of Christ's message, there is no disconnect in his urgings.
     
  18. B-Bob

    B-Bob my celli weighs a ton
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    You are really determined to not like and not get the message, and so be it.

    I'm not debating you, since it seems about as productive as debating DD about Spanoulis, but just for rhetoric's sake:

    * the vow of poverty is not literally meaning to live below the internationally recognized "poverty level." Anyone who conflates the vow with actual poverty is being willfully and purposefully obtuse. I know many Jesuits. They eat just fine, and they have shelter. They also live frugal, non-ostentatious, non-materialistic lives, for the most part.

    * asking Priests to lead by example has made sense to many people since the time of the great prophets. If it suddenly stops making sense to one person in one thread of the internet, I doubt any religious entity will really care.

    * I suppose your idea of Priests "fighting poverty" would be to take a vow of wealth and wear a bunch of gold chains, riding "poped out" cars, etc. That would be very inspiring.
     
  19. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Uhh yeah, actually yes I do. Then again I was raised by Jesuits.
     
  20. Dei

    Dei Member

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    This pope, what a plebeian. I have to share my wealth? Maybe the poor should try finding their own means and not spend their time making babies. The rich don't have to provide the poor jobs. If robots wipe out your factory, boo-hoo, that's progress. It's just another survival of the fittest.
     

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