Man, that must be tough if you want some advice but your significant other can read the thread too... well, you guys obviously need to know how to co-exist with her new revelation. you could start cutting back on meat...my guy used to eat a lot of red meat but he stopped eating that much because he wanted to be more healthy so we just eat red meat a couple of times within two weeks at home and he can choose to eat red meat if he goes out for lunch. we eat chicken mostly and fish as well...i don't really eat that much red meat anyway. i do enjoy a burger and all that... good luck!
Has she ever read Lonesome Dove? Two pigs have a pretty decent role in the novel (which is the finest Western novel ever written, in my opinion). There's a catch, though... Spoiler they get devoured!!! My son declared a few years ago, just before Thanksgiving, that he was a vegetarian, so I can relate to what you're going through. It completely screws up family meals. The rest of us didn't want to be so damned healthy and it was a royal pain in the rear. Exactly a year later, he declared that he was no longer a veggie. To this day, we don't know why he did it or why he quit doing it. I figure that it was either a bet or he was trying to impress a chick.
My sister is a long time vegetarian who married a meateater about a year ago. She cooks any and every meat dish he wants, steaks, chicken, pot roast, et. al I asked her "aren't you grossed out by preparing meat?" her response? "i love him. i'll do anything for him." the fact that one is a veg and the other is not has absolutely no effect on their relationship. surely the two of you can achieve that somehow as well?
that's not true. perhaps you just haven't gone out of your way to help an animal. i've gone out of my way to help save many domesticated pets (dogs and cats), and they most certainly "give back" and say "thank you" (you put it in quotes, too...no, i've never had an actual conversation with a dog!). Moes, I guess I was in a quasi-similar situation to you. My wife basically became vegetarian. It wasn't an overnight thing...she never ate a lot of meat anyway, one of her good friends has been forever, and one day she looked up and hadn't eaten any kind of meat in a couple of years. I know that sound implausible, but it's what happened. I kept eating meat, of course. then, about 9 months ago, I said I'm going to try this no-meat thing. I came to realize a few things: First, I was eating way too much meat. Stop and watch some of your co-workers or friends for a second...or think back a few months ago...how many meals did you have where there was absolutely no meat involved....not very many. The hardest part thus far has been lunch, because there are so few things you can get - even salads, at most places they already come with or really push that add chicken option. Like soups? Well, you're screwed there, too. Oh how I love(d) a good french onion soup - but nope, most are made with some type of chicken broth. Even breakfast...usually bacon, sausage, in some case just steak. People are definitely omnivorous, but I personally don't believe our bodies were designed to eat meat at 80%+ of our meals...we are supposed to have varied diets. I think Americans are some of the worst offenders of this, and I think a lot of it has to do with politics and lobbying. So, the key reason was health. Second, the animal cruelty issue. Unlike most people in the world, I have actually been to a kill and process facility. took a tour, got to see the room where the chickens are killed. now, i'm not squeamish, i didn't yell in protest...i understand, this is how we feed the country/world these days. i took it as educational. heck, the only reason these particular chickens are even alive is so they can be killed and eaten. but at the end of the day, there's no way around it, the methods are cruel. and i was at a highly sanctioned chicken plant. i've heard and seen (on tv/internet) much worse with some cattle plants. Some previous posts have gone into the sentient vs. non-sentient, killing animals vs. killing mosquitos arguments, etc., etc. I think you can argue back and forth all day long on it. I don't hate people who eat meat. I can't even say I'll stay this way forever. But you do what you personally feel is right. I think the current mass produced system is cruel. I don't like it. I don't think you have to hunt your own food, but if I ever do go back to eating meat, I will do my best to know where the meat I'm eating came from, how it was raised, etc. So the second reason was cruelty. Third, as you've already mentioned, there are a lot of solid vegetarian options that you've either heard of but never tried or never even heard of that are great - tofu, seitan, tempeh, etc. And then trying all kinds of new recipes, etc. So third, vegetarian foods are actually good - people should mix them into their diets regardless. Fourth, quasi-related to #2, there are a lot of indirect environmental concerns associated with mass farming in general, and mass animal farming in particular. It's definitely funny and makes you want to dismiss it, but it's been studied and researched...the cow industry is a huge contributor to global warming. So what do I do? Well, one day, after appropriately stuffing myself (and I mean stuffing) with a enormous amount of food and meat at a meal (which really, was a regular occurrence - I'm not overweight or anything but just stop and think about how often you stuff yourself), I just said to myself, this is disgusting, I'm going to stop cold-turkey and see how it goes. So I did. I found that it is too difficult to police all the food you eat, and it is still too difficult for me to be completely vegetarian - so I guess I "half-ass" it. I eat fish. I love sushi. I love fish tacos. I love shrimp. And I needed some filler. Plus all those Japanese ladies who just eat fish and rice their whole lives seem to live till their 110's+, so its got to be healthier, right? But i do try and not eat endangered species, or species high in mercury, etc., etc. I also am not a vegan at all in other ways. I eat cheese, I eat things with creams...but I don't drink milk - I drink rice milk. I feel bad about the cheese thing - how easy we forget that female cows don't just pump out milk once they reach a certain age. They are artificially inseminated repeatedly...and then most cheese have rennet which means babies are slaughtered right away. But I'm not perfect. I'd prefer a better system...but I love cheese! My advice would be keep eating meat but be more cognizant of some of these issues, more aware of what you're eating, where it came from, how healthy it is for you, how good it tastes, etc. If you want to keep eating meat, more power to you. I just wouldn't flaunt it in fb's face or anything.
damn, this is a huge thread. I think it's a cleverly disguised "Here's how to do a Hangout Discussion Thread, you dorks!" thread prompted by moestavern19 getting annoyed with the Feminist bash, bash, bash, flame, flame, flame thread. moes19 just seems too humble and nice in this thread....haha
I am a confused young man eager to gauge the wisdom of the many minds of this board (for once) I can honestly say this thread has been very helpful.
Maybe I kind of strategically made this thread when I knew she wouldn't be close to a computer for the next couple of days.
Nice quote... but isn't the fact that he's examining himself and his principles evidence that he's not "avoiding" the moral questions on at least some level? First. Is he trying to "win"? I don't think so... and that's the irritating part of the vegetarian argument. "We're right." You asked philosophers and lawyers, huh? whoopee. Newsflash, there's a food chain... and people aren't the only meat-eaters on it. Yes, there are moral debates, but the whole "We're right" angle, again, isn't the way to convince the masses. Second. I don't think he's implied he DOESN'T honor her choice. I think, rather, that he does, and it's giving him reasons to consider his own dietary habits... shouldn't that in itself show that he does honor her choice? I agree that he should either accept his reasons, or make a change, but starting off by saying he's "wrong" because vegans, vegetarians, philosphers and lawyers say so makes that a condescending point glazed with your opinion of "what is right." Third. I don't see where he is "Pushing" his inability to defend his habit on her. Conversely, I think he's examining his feelings about the matter due to her choices and certain revelations on his part. For a meat eater, this would have to be part of the process if one does indeed set out to make a conscious change. I don't understand that criticism of him.
You are very natural to eat meat. Humans are at the top of the food chain, and eating meat comes naturally. You can try and eat free range and organic things when cooking at home, and appease her by cutting back even though you aren't cutting out. Most of the free range and organic stuff is not raised in the prison camp like conditions. If you feel a little insecure about while eating out and munching a burger, then just go on the offensive and rub it in about how good it tastes. Make sure that it is light hearted. Also if she cooks vegetarian stuff for you, just eat it. Just don't cut meat out of your diet entirely
I am for the killing of defenseless animals and eating them bloody and rare. Animals do not have souls. Reference: http://www.siliconvalleywatcher.com/mt/archives/2008/11/friday_watch_al.php
Recent studies have proven plants have feelings, too In response to, "Vegetarians have reasons for why they don't eat meat" (Dec. 8), perhaps Mr. Zufall should update his research before claiming that vegetables and plants are incapable of feeling pain and not subject to his scruples regarding eating sentient beings. Researchers from Michigan State University have discovered that plants have a rudimentary nerve structure, which allows them to feel pain. According to the peer-reviewed journal Plant Physiology, plants are capable of identifying danger, signaling that danger to other plants and marshaling defenses against perceived threats. According to botanist Bill Williams of the Helvetica Institute, "plants not only seem to be aware and to feel pain, they can even communicate." This research has prompted the Swiss government to pass the first-ever Plant Bill of Rights. It concludes that plants have moral and legal protections, and Swiss citizens have to treat them appropriately. The Penn State Vegetarians Club would do well to investigate this data before claiming to be superior to those of us who do not subscribe to the idea that eating meat is morally wrong. http://www.collegian.psu.edu/archive/2008/12/09/recent_studies_have_proven_pla.aspx?print=1
Jane: Never mind about your brain, Oliver, brains are overrated. Many plants don't have brains. Have you thought about that? Oliver: Many plants? Jane: What? Oliver: Many plants don't have brains? Jane: Exactly. Oliver: Jane, no plants have brains. Jane: Yet they have their own wisdom. Oliver: What wisdom? Jane: The wisdom of plants. Oliver: What wisdom is that? Jane: It's very deep, Oliver, it's very spiritual. It's so typically planty. Oliver: You are making this up. Jane: No, I'm not. It's a philosophy. I follow a lot of philosophies. It's one of the things people really notice about me. Oliver: So, you follow the philosophy of plants? Jane: I'm a committed vegetarian. Yes. Oliver: Really? Jane: It's a life choice. Oliver: So let me get this straight, you believe in a wisdom and a philosophy of plants? Jane: Yes I do, Oliver, I absolutely do. Oliver: So you eat them.
I usually agree with what you say but not this time. MT19, if you stop doing something that is perfectly acceptable in this world that you enjoy as much as you say you do because of a minority opinion because of some phase your fiance is going through because she read a book, please lop of your junk and hand me your man card now. Because some radical minority groups believe that eating meat is murder, does not mean you have to do it. It's something you have done forever. It's something she has known you like to do forever. Her even guilt tripping you about eating meat is stupid and should not be tolerated.
Go vegan on her. Cut out all dairy in addition to meat from your diet. Tell her that keeping a pig or any other animal as a pet is cruel. Take her to a PETA protest and throw pig's blood on a designer fur coat. Eventually, she'll get so sick of it all, she'll dump you and you can go back to eating meat in peace.
