[Philly Inquirer] 76ers have to knock over Rockets with young talent (UPDATE: 1/13)

Anybody that says Iggy is better than Ray Allen is smoking something.

Ray Allen got the same minutes as Iggy in Seattle, but scored 25-26 pts a game, while Iggy scores 17-18 pts a game.

When Ray Allen went to the Celtics and became the 2nd/3rd option, he went from 26.4 pts in 06-07 to 17.4 pts in 07-08.

Iggy should be scoring 26 pts a night for the 76ers. He is the 1st option on the 3rd worst team(14-28) in the league. He can barely score 18 pts in 40 minutes

 

He's also giving them 6 assists and 6 boards. Those are double RayRay's numbers. Let's not even talk about the defensive end.

 

Ray's numbers went down to 3 rebs 3 asts, when he moved to the Celtics. He was 4.5 rebs and 4.1 asts in his last year. Stats go down, when you move from a less talented team to a team with better rebounders(KG) and another player(PP) that dominates the ball.

 

Why are complaining about how many pts Iggy does not have he is better than alllll of the players on our squad right now without Yao.

 

I'd rather give them Lowry than Brooks. Then, throw in a first round draft pick to the Sixers (2010 protected).

 

So, how many assist would Iguodala get if he was surrounded with guy that could actually shoot the ball??? And I could make the argument that Iguodala would average closer to 20 on the Celtics because he would be getting a lot more wide open looks.......... Do you realize that both Allen's and Iguodala's scoring efficiency is basically the same...and Iggy is playing with Iverson and a bunch of young kids...whereas Allen is 3rd banana?? A man with Allen's skillset playing 3rd banana and just cashing in on wide open looks should have a lot higher scoring efficiency, shouldn't he?

You can make all sorts of "arguments" about who is the better player. But Iguodala is 25 years young, Allen is OLD, Allen is an expiring contract, who is on the downside of his career. I'm not saying IGGY is our answer. I'm just saying if you are trying to make an argument that Ray Allen is a better player, you are wasting time. You can't prove that unless you were able to trade them out for each other, which isn't going to happen. However, I would be willing to bet that Ainge would trade Allen for Iggy right now, if he could.

 

And Allen has a ring and Iggy doesn't. You seriously underrate Ray Allen 25-26 pts a game and overrate Iggy. Iggy is Diaw on steriod. If the Rockets are going to win a championship they need a 2nd option not a 3rd option. Sure, they can chase after Iggy, but don't expect a ring.

 

Nonsense. Nonsense. Nonsense.

 

Ray Allen does have a HIGHER scoring effiency. He has a higher FG%, 3pt%, FT%, TS%, EFG%, offensive rating. The Celtics were able to get their ring. It worked!

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/i/iguodan01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/a/allenra02.html

 

Stop throwing ring out there.. They also had PP and Garnett.............

 

Acquiring Iggy is not about expecting a ring. Trading McGrady is about acquiring assets. Iggy may be a key piece. Just like Allen is just a piece of the Boston juggernaut. I expect a ring if Morey does job and continues to make the right personnel moves and if Adelman does his job and gets the most out of the talent that Morey hands to him. I am not overrating or underrating anybody. Iggy is the better long term fit for this team than Ray Allen because he is a more valued asset around the league. Allen is old nad on an expiring contract. And the discussion is irrelevant anyways because Allen isn't even available in a trade for McGrady. Boston is NOT going to take a chance on a rickety McGrady over what they know they already have in Ray Allen. So, it's a stupid argument. We should be discussing REAL possibilities. Iggy is a real possibility. Allen isn't. If we want to discuss who is the better player, then we should discuss it on a fantasy league message board.

The best players that I have heard of possibly being available are:

1. Chris Paul - doesn't look likely that New Orleans will move him.

2a. Chris Bosh - If he is available, I would bet Morey is trying to get him first.
2b. Amare - doubtful

3a. Iguodala

3b. Caron Butler

3c. Kevin Martin

4. Anthony Randolph??????

5,6,7,.................................................



Allen isn't even on the list.

 

Ray Allen does not basically have the same scoring efficiency as Iggy. It is significantly better. The 3pt shot really increases Ray's overall scoring efficiency.

I should have shown the stats instead of posting the link.

I'll look at the current season.
Ray Allen / Iggy
FG% 45.6 > 42.5 (+2.1)
3pt% 34.7 > 32.0 (+2.7)
FT% 89.6 > 77.8 (+11.8)
TS% 57.3 > 52.8 (+4.5)
EFG% 52.5 > 46.9 (+5.6)
[/B]


It could be said that the stats are incomplete based on a half season.
Here are last year's full season stats.
2008 - 09
Ray Allen / Iggy
FG% 48.0 > 47.3 (+0.7)
3pt% 40.9 > 30.7 (+10.2)
FT% 95.2 > 72.4 (+22.8)
TS% 62.4 > 56 (+6.4)
EFG% 57.5 > 50.7 (+6.8)
[/B]

 

That's the goal and you got to do whatever it takes. Ray Allen was a fantastic 3rd option. People keep trying to say he wasn't that good because he had PP and Garnett. Well, he's a 3rd option. He isn't supposed to be better than them.

 

n/a

 

He is not a 3rd option who ever was hot at the time got the most shots.. Simple enough. 123 213 321 whatever combo... They are all allstars. 3 allstars = championship no matter what.
I'm not knocking Ray Allen.




They had a beast team.

 

I was originally replying to Leebigez who was asking about the Rocket's chances of winning , if Iggy was acquired and that he was a borderline all-star. He seemed to imply that Iggy would be the 2nd option with Yao.

I was showing that Iggy would not be the 2nd option of previous championship teams actually. He said that Iggy was better than Ray on the Celtic's championship team. He still would have been a 3rd option, if it were true. PP and KG would be #1 and #2.

 

That!

Why do people always assume that the "upcoming trade" has to be "the last one" or a "homerun"? It's not checkers, it's chess. We are talking multiple moves here people. It's about maximizing one's assets. Morey has done a good job at this point at developing assets to flip them for better players. It's a process.

To me if we can get Iggy for Tmac without giving up other assets then I don't see a reason not to.

 

Instead of just pulling stats out you wazoo, why don't you watch the games. What did allen do against atl in the playoffs? What did he do vs cleveland when he was abused by wally? Do you think they would've won the ring without KG the first year? How many times was allen in the lotto with lewis before he was traded? My point is allen is a better shooter than iggy, no one will argue that. Not many people that has ever played in the nba could shoot like allen,but what else does he give you? Exactly nothing. Iggy could be a 2nd/3rd option on a ring team. You bring up the lakers or spurs as examples, but Gasol is a big man. Iggy is just as capable playing 2nd banana on a team like la behind kobe as pippen was behind jordan. Jackson would kill to have a guy like iggy that can do everything on both ends. Parker is a really good player, that doesn't mean he's better than iggy either. On the spurs, parker wouldn't be the clear number 2 either and i think thats what you're really missing. Iggy is probably not the franchise player, no one will debate that, but as a #2, i think you jjust don't now basketball.

I've had this debate before, its much harder to score on poorer teams. All you shots are under stress, you're the focus every single night. and it takes alot of energy. Kenny Smith used to say it all the time that with the kings,it was a hard 17, but with the rockets, it was the easy 17. Thats because other good players require attention vs all eyes on you.

 

Why is there even a debate about this? How can anyone who watches basketball claim that Ray Allen is better than Iggy?
Ray, in his prime, was probably a better player, but it's not close right now.

 

Houston:
1st:Ellis, Bosh, Biedrins OR
2nd:Bosh, Curry, Biedrins, Maggette

Toronto:
1st:Maggette, Curry, Ariza OR
2nd:Ellis, Ariza

Golden State:
1st:McGrady, Scola, Hayes OR
2nd:McGrady, Scola, Hayes

I'd do that in a heart beat.

You can bet Llull and even our 1st round will be involved.


Which do you do? I'd do the 1st deal, but i want the second scenario with a 4th team. I'd rather have a chunk of cap space at the end of the season with Bosh and Curry.

If we could find a 4th team hence Cleveland to take on Biedrins and Maggette for scenario (2) i'd be after Shaq or Illguaskus and just let him expire. Let's remember that LeBron tried to recruit Ariza before he signed here.