Crane isn’t going to tell Dusty no if Dusty wants to come back. He knows the consequences. So does Dusty It will definitely be in dustys hands
I finished watching it and I think it's very fair. It is an unvarnished look at the Stros of the past decade but it's definitely not a hit piece. The Astros Edge while they say the sign stealing was part of it was more about the very efficient application of analytics and new technology to the game of baseball. The piece does acknowledge that other teams were also engaged in all sorts of sign stealing too, that this was widely done throughout baseball and leaves an open question about how much other teams might've been cheating too. Besides the Ben Reiter the reporter who narrates the piece and also the one who predicted the Stros 2017 WS champions back in 2013 the peace mainly focuses on Jeff Luhnow, video coordinate Antonio Padilla, and Tony Adams the Stros fan who quantified the extent of the trash can banging. There's also a fair amount of input from SI writer Stephanie Apstein who was the target of Taubman's rant about Osuna, Tom Verducci and former commissioner Fay Vincent. One of the more interesting parts of it was Tom Verducci's view that the Astros represent a sad and dark period of baseball. Not so much for sign stealing but about the ruthless efficient drive to win. First off when has there not been a ruthless drive to win in MLB or other major league sports and if this a dark period what about the Steriod era, the Black Sox, how big market big money teams like the Yankees could screw over smaller market teams? You can not admire what the Stros did but to say this is a historically dark era for baseball while ignoring all of the other dark eras seems overblown. I feel very much like Adams and the many other fans interviewed at the end of the piece. That yes it wasn't a good thing what the 2017 Stros did but neither was what a lot of what the rest of the teams were doing. The team of the last few years isn't that 2017 team and the organization has changed quite abit. For those who complain the Stros are some pure data driven machine they've won a WS with one of the oldest school baseball managers currently in the game. That still doesn't change that the Astros will continue to be hated and tarred for years but it is H-Town versus Everyone!
I agree. I think any period of baseball had serious negative aspects. I bet Verducci doesn't consider the 1950's a dark period of baseball, but look at how the Yankees robbed the Kansas City A's blind in route to their dominance through the early 60's. I don't think Verducci added enough context to how hardwired cheating is in MLB.Cheating has always been part of baseball from Bobby Thompson's homer (at the time called the shot heard around the world) to Gaylord Perry to arguably the best baseball player of all time in Barry Bonds and one of the greatest pitchers of all time in Roger Clemens. Basball not only had a steroids and hgh problem, they had a dexedrine problem for decades, as well. I think the documentary might have put the outrage surrounding the cheating scandal into more context with the prominence of social media in our discourse, as well. The format and platform of social media means that scandals like this are more likely to fester and stay alive than those in the past. Ultimately, I think the '17 Astros will have to wear the scandal because Fiers talked and most clubhouses never have. I also think that winning last year validates the organization, even if it shouldn't have needed to.
Full transcript of the documentary: https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/documentary/the-astros-edge/transcript/
Just watched it, always a good laugh when people they interviewed don't understand what the rules were at the time, what the MLBPU is and what the commissioner could and couldn't do. Otherwise, not much I didnt already know about. They missed a chance to use the Duke university study to actually answer the qustion they asked which is how much did it help? It didn't. Those professors used science and data to show it didnt help. Would've fit nicely into the doc.
I went to Tony Adams site a while back but it is funny that they only used the trash can 12% of the time total. Glad to see Beltran and Cora get thrown under the bus. Beltran is a coward for trying to deflect and blame the org.
Not sure how common knowledge this is about Maris 61 HR season but very interesting: "Incidentally, it was later found that the Yankees stole signs from the bench that year, specifically having the help of pitcher Bob Turley and his distinct whistle; Tony Kubek noted that the stealing was so good that Turley wasn't allowed off the bench even when he got hurt, and he estimated that Mickey Mantle hit 50 home runs due to Turley."
the whole "culture of doing anything to win" narrative Reiter was trying to push is utterly stupid Beltran had an idea to use video to steal signs, and other players and Cora/Hinch went along with it (partly because Beltran is a legend). They already had the the legal video feed. All they had to do was set up a monitor near the dugout. It didn't require Luhnow to be involved at all, and I can totally believe he knew nothing about it.
Watched it today and an interesting documentary. Some of it was stupid (players whining about the Astros ending their fledgling careers). Some of it was a bit accusatory. Most of it pretty good though. Astros were not doing things that other teams didn't commonly do. They were singled out. Blah blah. They were more than good enough to win without cheating. What bothers me the most to have the Astros be a part of the witch hunt as the only team to do these things. Oh well. **** the haters, let's go win us another ring this year.
I wish I cared about this sport, because it is one of the greatest runs ever and the best in the cities history. And I'd trade it all for one more Rockets championship.
That's pretty funny, if i had the option of a rockets title or one more astros WS, it's astros WS and it's not close
