Want to feel better about the Rockets current situation? Go to the Soncis message board. Those poor fans are furious. Many have denounced their "fandom" with the team and all want to physically hurt Wally Walker.
Would you choose Payton/Mason over Mobley/Cato if you would not be able to pay Payton the money he will command in free agency this off season? There is a SERIOUS gamble here! Remember, the Bucks are for sale, they are trying to watch their wallet. If Payton walks then all you have is Desmond Mason. Mobley and Cato are signed for a number of years. Mobley at a decent rate and despite Cato's somewhat large contract in terms of NBA Centers his contract is right in line with the average for NBA centers. Remember, the Bucks starting center is Jason Caffey for goodness sakes! Now, don't get me wrong, if I felt comfortable that I could re-sign Payton, I make the Sonics deal hands down! No questions! But the risk of him leaving, makes me really wonder about this deal for the Bucks. Chris
I'm sure the $9+ million salary slot he'd leave behind if he doesn't resign with Milwaukee is still more valuable than Cato + Mobley
I'd have to say the Sonics got the better end of the trade even though they are going to be lotto bound for a few years. They ended up with the younger(tho less talented) star. If the bucks had managed to get a big man somehow, or even spree, I think they would have ended up significantly better. But they didn't, and I don't think they are going to do anything in the playoffs. Kidd did feast after he was traded to the east tho ... hmmm.
1. Bucks don't need Mobley. They have Redd who is younger and cheaper. 2. They need a post scorer or defensive stopper. Cato is neither. Sorry I just see things in Bucks' presepctive. You can't just throw trade proposals who benefit ourselves but not help the other team. I don't quite understand why they would deal Ray Allen for another PG and swingman either. If I were them, I would definitely demand a scoring big man in return but I guess there was just none in the market.
Hey I heard that Bucks would have serious cap space (they cleared some cap space during the Glen Robinson trade) if they choose not to resign Payton. So it would give them great flexibility. Not to mention adding a promising young player in Desmond. It's certainly better than locked up with a SG they don't need and an overpaid center who can't score.
I remember a game last week Cassell voiced some unhappiness with Karl about not being in the game last in the 4th. Anyone else see that? Wonder where Cassell will be next season.
Seattle also gets the Bucks draft pick this year providing it's between #4 and #18. Mason is more of a SF then SG. Sonics still have Rashard Lewis, Radmanovic, and Brent Barry who all play SF. Ray Allen is a pure SG, period. I'm not sure what Milwaukee is doing, though this deal should signifcantly improve their defense and increase their playoff chances this year.
Did I say that or are you purposely misquoting me to defend your statement? Pull up the numbers. Steve Francis averages about .5 more assists than Cassell yet plays about 10 more minutes. He also turns the ball more and takes more shots. I don't know what you consider a "ball hog" but if you use it to describe to Cassell, it could easily apply to Francis as well. But of course you only throw a fit when people use the double standard on Yao. Typical.
So if he is not as good as Francis, then your whole post has no point, thanks for clarifying. If he is a better player, he will take more shots, he has the ball more. And what double standard are you talking about, yes I do get annoyed that people treat Yao like God on this board and Steve like crap, so what, I like Yao, I don't write negative posts on Yao, as a matter of fact the only player I have written a negative post on is Mo Taylor, and I haven't lately because he has stepped up his game. I choose to defend Steve because the treatment he gets on this board is ridiculous, especially considering the effort he plays with night in and night out. Get over it, the fact that you choose to attack my opinion on the Rockets in the NBA dish forum about something that has nothing to do with the Rockets, shows that you are the one with the problem, not me.
First of all, Im attacking you based on your comments about Sam Cassell. Sam Cassell was clutch and he was a great Rocket. He's not as physically gifted as Francis but he could score on anybody. The fact you labeled him a ballhog is ridiculous when you are constantly defending Francis against some of the same accusations. They are both PG's with similiar games and similiar scoring mentality. If youre going to criticize anyone, at least have some consistency.
I am being consistent, I don't think Steve is a ball hog. I think people who say he is a ball hog are wrong. Ball Hog is a subjective term. I consider Sam more of a selfish player because of actions like last week, when he complained to a reporter on national TV after a win against Dallas about not being in a game. Have you ever seen Steve do something like that?
Oh cmon. Cassell is an intense competitor and so is Francis. Francis has had his own faux pas with the press, especially his comments about Dallas. Frankly if Steve Francis did not complain about not playing, Id be somewhat disappointed. As far as ball hog, there are times when Francis drives into a lane with 4 people surrounding him, that's a ballhog.
Look, Steve led this team to 45 wins 2 years ago with a lineup of Mobley, Shandon Anderson, a broke down Hakeem, and Mo Taylor. They only lost one game to Eastern conference teams. Last year, they only won 28 games because he missed most of the season, a season that started off well, until the Migrane problems started. Are the Rockets playing great ball, no, but they are adjusting, and Steve is adjusting to Yao, he has been the man on the team since he's gotten here, and now finally has to learn how to play with another top notch pro. Is he having a problem adjusting, yes, is he a ball hog no, he is adjusting, its the first friggin season he has with Yao, and currently they would be in the playoffs, so everyone needs to get off his case.
I am not throwing out trade proposals to benefit just the Rockets. I have been clear with why the Bucks would consider such a deal. To address your points... 1) The Bucks would need Mobley if Allen was traded. Redd can be the starter but Mobley would be the 6th man. Desmon Mason basically will fill the same role here. The Bucks knew that if they traded Allen they needed to get a guard/swingman in return. They got that in Mason and would have gotten that in Mobley. 2) True, they DO nedd a post scorer but they ALSO need a post REBOUNDER which is what Cato can do. They also need a SHOT BLOCKER which Cato can do. Cato won't score points but he can rebound, block shots and plays decent post defense. He would help the Bucks here tremendously. It would be ideal for the Bucks to get a post player but one was not available. However, to get a solid defensive center like Cato would be a good start. I am not saying that the Bucks should have taken a Mobley/Cato offer. Just that it makes SOME sense given that they need rebounding help. So from the Bucks perspective that is why the deal makes some sense for them. Is a Mobley/Cato offer for Allen a stretch? Probably. We get back a bit more, but sometimes desperate teams make trades that aren't always level. On the otherhand, if the Bucks are just trying to slash salary (for the impending sale of the club and luxary tax purposes) then perhaps the deal isn't for them. And as for Cato being "overpaid." This has been put to rest many times. For NBA centers Cato is making the average. What does this mean? It means that for the most part NBA centers ARE ALL overpaid. That is just the reality. Everyone overpays for height. So by comparison a team would be getting their monies worth with Cato's current production on the floor. Chris
Good trade for the Bucks, not only do they get a great vet in GAry Payton, but they also get a rising star in Mason. The Bucks are going to be fun to watch, and watch out they might make it to the NBA Finals.
I hope so. I'm going to be rooting for the Glove and the Cowboy all the way. I still can't believe that the Sonics traded Mason. Trading Gary was awful, but somewhat understandable. However, I think Mason is going to be a star in this league. He has all the tools. Freakish athleticism, and ever-improving jumper, and a good head on his shoulders. This guy is going to be good, and even if Gary does leave, he will be the cornerstone of the Bucks franchise for years.
ZRB, You can't tell me you wouldn't trade Mason for Allen and a 1st round draft pick. Since that is what this trade boils down to for the Sonics, who knew they stood to lose a 34 year old GP in the summer, for considerably less. The Bucks did make a good deal, but it hinges on keeping Gary in bratwurst land for the remainder of his career. This was a win-win deal, imho.
