Pakistan to execute Christian mother who verbally insulted Muhammed

A lot of crap happened in Catholicism. Witch burning, etc. Fortunately (while still having many, many flaws) the catholic church has moved past medieval times, for the most part. We are talking about today. Why is it your reflex to point fingers at other religions? Does it make any of the flaws of your religion any better?

 

Can I pretend to be Muslim somehow and just go visit it? I mean...how do they check?

 

What does that have to with anything???

 

Oh, they check.

I was stopped at the entrance, asked my name, had to show my passport to confirm my name, and then had to recite several passages (in Arabic) from the Quran.

 

I had to do none of that, I just walked right in prayed took some pictures, walked around the area because I got lost. Stumbled in front of the walling wall and there was a soldier standing there with an Assault rifle guarding it and it was required to go through a metal detector.

I guess it depends on what day of the week it is

 

So I cannot be a Muslim without knowing Arabic?

(my Muslim friend told me the same thing you just did)

I'm wondering...what would happen if they stopped me (I wouldn't be able to grow a full beard, so I guess I'd stand out a bit...but there must be some people from Malaysia or Indonesia who can't either) and I wouldn't be able to "prove" that I am a muslim...what's the worst thing that could possibly happen?

 

Absolutely nothing.

Just like your comment that "words...at times...may justify execution" has absolutely nothing to do with anything.

 

I don't know Arabic either. These were memorized passages that I know the English translation of.

 

the reality of a thread. Half the posts have nothing to do with the topic on hand.

 

There is a lot of debate about this. You don't need to know the language itself, just the verses in Arabic.

As to why it has to be Arabic, the explanation is that the pre-Islamic (Jahiliyya period) Arabs needed Islam the most and because they spoke Arabic, that was the language chosen. Had it been the Chinese who needed Islam the most, the Koran would be in Chinese. Because of the importance of getting the exact meaning down, the initial language of transmission has to be kept.

The debate is, once someone understands the exact idea from the original Arabic definition, can a person pray in their own language as long as it doesn't change the idea?

Also, this is all BS about how to prove you are a real muslim to another human being. There is only judge (God), and only he can answer that question. Being Muslim has nothing to with hair on a chin, dressing like a bee-keeper, or speaking in a guttural language. It is internal reflections in one's mind about the nature of the universe and why/why not we're here.

The above is similar to how the Catholic church was viewed by the Protestants in the 16th c. This idea of emphasis on superficial customs or appearance, not on actual ideas.

 

Agree 100%.

 

They would turn you away and not let you enter.

 

Thanks for the interesting post.

But I wouldn't even understand the question...or would they ask me in English if they realized I don't speak Arabic, and I could just recite some memorized verses in Arabic, and they would let me in?

 

Like I said earlier, I went in December 2009 and was not asked by anyone to prove that I was a Muslim, maybe it has changed since I went a year ago but when I went I had to do none of this. Hope this sheds some light on your question.

 

Thank you.

So - what do you think is the appropriate punishment in this situation:

Someone intentionally and being fully informed says "Muhammed was an illiterate pedophile and an idiot".

What do you think should be the sentence?

 

Whatever the constitution or laws of the country says the punishment should be.

 

So you think in that case, if it happens in Pakistan, the death sentence is appropriate. Thank you.

 

That would probably work for their bureaucracy which goes to show you how idiotic and un-Islamic this all is because these are all superficial practices without corresponding internal reflection.

Some Muslims think they can get by praying 5 times a day (most don't even pray this many times) without understanding or even being sincere about what they say (75% of people I know). But you have to mean it deep down, and if you don't, your prayer doesn't count.

Again, this religious problem is not unique to Islam. I've seen this in dozens of religions throughout history where a small group with an agenda of power and fear enact fake measures like these to mold the greater ignorant masses to fall into lockstep without questioning the spiritual value of the practices. Luther and Ignatius of Loyola asked these questions centuries ago yet we still see this in 2010.

The more things change, the more they stay the same..

 

Opium for the masses...

 

Ya but the leader of Pakistan has said that this is preposterous and has halted this. Thank You.