I think he meant that we would get interest from both of those spots not that we could acquire both of those spots. CK
Gawd almighty! LOL …… ROTFLOL “ Praise be the lord, and sodomy is illegal!!!” “(Oeilpere) morphs (what I he hears) .... ?????” Man … where to start …. where to start … ?? I rarely get the opportunity to play on the net these days …. But … man I have just read the four … FOUR! pages of posts. Great stuff. I love you guys … I really do .. the haters … the friends … the detractors … the denouncers … and the supporters alike. Some quick notes of the top of my head: 1. Argue with the quotes: “If we sell the (first pick) we want a franchise type player” – CD “Give me some choices.” – RT 2. Okay … to clarify: “RT and CD both like Odom. A natural fit here. They will sell the first to get him.” – posted. The point was – would Odom be welcomed, would they consider him involved in a trade. Would they consider using the first to do a trade that would get them Odom plus others? Yep they sure would. Maybe I should have posted they would sell the first to get him. Big difference between what I typed and what I was trying to say. I’ll take the flak on that one. 3. KG – since when did I say KG at all costs? “Kevin Mc Hale wants an arm and a leg, though. Totally unreasonable. And, what hurts us even worse is that we would have to make some awfully difficult moves because of the CBA to get anything done that would involve KG. – posted. I do not support dismantling the team for KG. I may come close to unloading a lot of sacred cows(including personal commitments from RT), but I would not unload Francis, Mobley, Griffin, plus put us in hock for several years (a la Puppies) to get it done. Never said it, never implied it. I also seriously doubt anyone at Greenway would want to become the “Howlers of the South”. “KG is such a trigger name that although he is mentioned ... well ... it is nice to think about and RT is salivating at it ... but it is such a long, long shot folks.” - posted But, to put it plainly, if KG wants to come because frankly his team has less of a future every year, if McHale (et al) wants to unload him and breakout of their major funk, and if it meant we kept the three core members but lost a great hunk of our roster and some (not all) drafts in the next couple of years … mmmmmm, it COULD be done. And RT knows it. 4. Ming #1 – “Ming is being talked up as the next best thing since sliced bread and a 7 foot Nigerian” – posted. Read some of the stuff in mainstream media. Go back and read some of the posts in this thread. He is being praised beyond reason. Crazy stuff! And worse of all, people with whom I have a great deal of respect, are saying they wouldn’t trade Ming for - proven producers, natural allstars and others. And it’s still early! 5. Ming #2 - Ming is all that? And, more? I agree that he MAY become an excellent asset to any NBA team. He MAY become the star of the Rocket’s future. But folks that will not happen this year, nor quite likely even next year. Someone explain to me why the Rockets are off base by looking at all offers avauilable. Why they should not be exploring other obvious and persistent gems on the table? I hope if they do draft him. I hope that he is everything the Rockets fans hope him to be. The problem is that of everything I heard within the last several days … the front office are not as swallowed up by all the hype as some of you here. Mention a young Akeem all you want. Mention a skinflint like Sampson. Those guys earned their bones. A young seven plus footer in a twenty – thirty game low impact league is burning up the competition. Wow! Big Frigging Deal. Okay – now he is talented to be sure. And, you can’t teach height. Fine. But what would he do up against a top tier NCAA team for twenty games. Or eighty plus games in the NBA? He is going to have to handle KG on a baddass night, Shaq when he’s pissed, or even an aging Hakeem hobbling down the floor. If we draft him I hope he does well. But I’ll more than likely be wondering where we would be with Antawn or Marian or Odom or Rashard or whoever. Because I already know what these guys can do. I’ll be reading all the moans and b****ing about firing RT right here, while YaoYo sits on the bench (or worse on reserve) nursing a bad ankle, swollen knee and two missing teeth, ten games in and after our first road trip through the West. 5. The Big Dis – “For the diehard Ming Dynasty Fans: Playoffs and beyond this coming season …. Ming will NOT get us significantly closer this year. Maybe not even next year. Anyone who thinks so … should give up their day job and go back to watching WWF and Maury P.” – posted. “Anyone who thinks that Ming ... who is wrapped in a (NBA "scrawny" a la Bradley) 7 + foot frame ... with very limited contact basketball, and EIGHY PLUS frigging games is going to turn around this franchise needs their head examined. Maybe not even by year two. End of my OPINION.” - posted Anyone … junior poster, senior poster or hyper post-counter fanatic … anyone,who thinks this is a hard hit to a fellow BBS poster … a flame worthy of an apology … the burning catalyst to face off at a hundred words or less … the impetus to moan and groan self-righteously from a pulpit on high …. well, they should wait and listen very, very carefully … wait for it … wait for that large “Pop!” sound. You know that “Pop!” sound. It’s the sound you probably make every now and then … when you pull your head out of your ass. ROTFLMAO – It was fun writing that! 6. This is an observation – “Trading the pick is looking awfully good right now, but it is early.” – posted “It would be nice to get a powerhouse center but there are not any available in the draft(IMHO), and few on the market.” – posted definition: an observative assumption – a culmination of cognitive occurrences and the preponderance of evidence from the viewers point of reference. 7. This is speculation – “Big Spec: 1. The first spot is sold to the highest bidder. 2. We unload a heavy contract. 3. We draft one monster (semi starter) and trade for another two starters.” –posted. “I think that will be the focus. Use the pick to trade it all for a instant starter with NBA experience and use the other lower pick to get a good depth boy at the leftover (3 or 5) position. Then cut some roster slots..” – posted Definition: a speculative assumption – a guess with a degree of probability greater than the opposing view. Cheers … … and try like hell to have some fun in here, okay? PS: Worries Warts - You would be surprised how I got the direct quotes. But you're right some of them were second hand - accross a table and bouncing off the walls with music and dancers in the background ... but clearly from the lips of the tall and the short one. (chuckle)
Pip: Just remember: 1. Ming is not as sure a thing as everyone thinks 2. Picking up two key starter spots for a pick and player is awfullty tempting 3. The front office will do what it takes to get past the first round next year Go to bed!
I believe you made typo in that post spinachman.... Please edit "first" to "third".... Thank you and Goodnite!
If good enough talent isn't borought in, the point is that this Rockets team will never get past the 2nd round. I don't care if they get past the 1st round next season. Just making it to the playoffs in the West is a large enough jump for a young team. Why is there a need for instant gratiffication?
OP- I for one appreciate your posts. Actually, there are a handful of people on this board that I pay attention to. I will let you guess who the others are. However, there is I believe a Rice alumni that means well but sometimes is a little more emotional than normal. He also brings alot to this board. With that said, you have the right to post anything reasonably related to the Rockets. You are entitled, just as everyone else, to write and naturally you have your own biases. You should not have to explain every word. However, you should answer all of my questions!
Just thinking aloud... So a team is willing to part with two key starters for this team? So they have to be front court players. That pretty much narrows it down because Mobley's salary isn't very high to offset much in return. LA and Chicago basically unless we're seriously talking Spree and Camby. Odom/Kandi/Miles or Rose/Chandler/Curry. So basically what one Rockets player matches the salary for two starters and I think ya have your possible trade. Odom + Kandi = Rice Odom + Miles = Cato or MoT which is not likely. Damn I'd love to have Odom and Miles on this team though. Rose doesn't work with another player to trade for Houston and I doubt we're talking Chandler/Curry and Eddie Robinson so I guess Chicago is out. Sprewell + Camby doesn't work with sending one player back. Phoenix is interesting. Outlaw + Marion = Rice It's pretty much Odom/Kandi or Outlaw/Marion. We've tried to get Outlaw in the past from what I recall and I guess we're high on Odom.
i read ALL 5 pages and for some reason i have a feeling that RT/CD is working on trying to get Garnett first. I mean, we have #1. during draft day we can yell out whatever name we want cuz we're in control, but Garnett is something like a puzzle. same gut feeling i had about Griffin last draft day.
Oeilpere, thanks for clarifying (sort of). This post made more sense. One thing (worth pursuing) that confuses me is that about drafting one "monster (semi-starter)" What do you mean by 'monster?' Do you mean a project with high-end potential? By semi-starter, do you mean this year? I like Ming. I think he could be the difference in making this team a championship contender in a few years, not just playoff contender, but championship contender, but by a few years, I don't mean two or three. I know it's going to be longer than that and I say "could" and not "will." I don't know what you mean by turn the franchise around, but if you mean drastically affect the way the Rockets play basketball in a significantly positive way, then yes, I do think he could turn the franchise around. Do I think he's going to revolutionize the position? Ummmm.... no. Do I even think he's going to be the best player on the team? No. In fact, I wouldn't be that he'll be much more than a role player (by which I mean someone the team relies on for specific duties other than creating his own shot, you know, being a go-to guy), but the difference being that I think him being a good role player could actually make us championship contenders. Not now. Not next year, but eventually. I'm glad the Rockets staff are trying to be levelheaded and look at their options. I'd be extremely pissed otherwise. I wouldn't be opposed to a major deal. But I would expect that we get players back in return, who could conceivably also make us championship contenders in time. And I do feel that while we need roster space, dropping Rice's contract (or anyone else's) shouldn't be that high a priority unless dumping such contracts gets us below the salary cap enough to actually sign someone decent. I don't think dropping Rice will do that. I'll have to reread his post, but I think that was the essence of what Will was saying. Yao is a big risk. We know it. And I'm not expecting some fairy tale rise to contention the next couple years. But the potential is there to make us equal to any team in the league. Not Yao himself. But a team of Yao and other core players we have now all living up to their potential. Yes, that's asking a lot. I know I used the "P" word twice this paragraph. I'm not saying Odom or Rashard or Jamison are mediocre players and not worthy of holding Yao's shoelaces. But I do question how far they can take us. I'm talking about upside, not which team would go farther in the playoffs next year, the following year, or the year after. I think those players could help us considerably. I just feel like Yao could potentially make our frontcourt much stronger than they could, even if he might be less talented. I recognize that I haven't seem him play much and am essentially talking out of my @$$. I defer to the judgement of others who are in a better position to analyze him. But I think (hope) the majority of posters who want Yao recognize we're talking about upside that may or may not be fulfilled; we're not talking about a lock for becoming perpetual All-Star except by default because of the lack of talent at his position.
To the Batmobile? As I've said, there's NO ONE you could get in return with the potential of Ming. NO ONE. There's NO ONE that can boost buzz about the Rockets more than Ming. A billion fans in China, all the extra hoopla that goes with the #1 pick going into a new stadium, a boost from the local Asian population. The Rockets have ALREADY used the advertising with that ad about the last time we had the #1 pick in the Chronicle. To me, Ming just fits. Business wise, if all things from China are clear (a big if, but not 7'6'' 300 pound big), it's a no brainer. #1 overall, a big foreign center, fan buzz, merchandising possibilities, etc. Playing wise, again-we have a big hole to fill at center. We have no big man that can pass. We could use some more interior defense. We like big men that can shoot...talk about fulfilling all categories. I certainly don't pass on Ming so we can still have SF/C holes, and get a FOURTH guard under 6'4'' that dominates the ball. I'd trade Ming, and anyone else outside of Francis, Mobley, Griffin for Garnett, but I doubt that's a possibility. Other than something insane like Curry/#2 overall for Ming and starch, no one else that'd possibly be available is worth the risk.
This is a telling statement and is very true because no other player is even close to Ming when it comes to a potential pain in the A$$. This is the part that really gets me. Winning sells. Anything Ming brings to the table that doesn’t have to do with winning is BS and shouldn’t even be considered by anybody but Rockets admin. I sure hope the bean counters aren’t making personnel decisions. This is what it’s all about, Ming and his ability to play NBA basketball. This guy that you hype that can pass, shoot, play defense and fill our “big hole” at center sounds great, but I have yet to see it. The guy I saw had trouble with a college center that won’t be drafted. And who is going to fill the big hole at training camp, or the big hole in our team’s chemistry. I think we really need to improve on our HYPE here because if we spend the #1 pick on a guy with all the baggage that Ming comes with he better be a hell of a lot better than the guy you are describing. P.S. I hope Rudy and CD won’t have any problems trading Cat or Griffin for Garnett.
oeilpere, praise be the lord!! "ROTFLMAO – It was fun writing that! " It did didn't it!! I thought so! Yeah,,,that's my popeye!!! Talk about dismantling someone with out even mounting them by name...Only popeye can pull that off!! Best I can do is enjoy dissing on your "apology" request in October--Mr Over Sensitive--and your Garnett thing...maybe you can explain that again. BAM!! I love your writing. When the hell are you going to dis us personally, by name this time. That is just not fair. we still have to see a game together. Forget the scoops; this bbs is about scooping the ones you meet. Right! watching basketball..... watch One game with me!! I'm buying!!
Relativist I pretty much agree with all that you say. My problem, is using the top pick for a "good role player". If Kevin Garnett, Elton Brand, Eddy Curry, Vince Carter, Odom or Miles even, available in this draft, would Ming be given as much consideration? Maybe it's just the Romance of the first pick, but I don't want to hear "With the first pick in the 2002 NBA Draft, the Houston Rockets select a good role player"
<i>But, to put it plainly, if KG wants to come because frankly his team has less of a future every year, if McHale (et al) wants to unload him and breakout of their major funk, and if it meant we kept the three core members but lost a great hunk of our roster and some (not all) drafts in the next couple of years … mmmmmm, it COULD be done. And RT knows it. </i> Ok, I'll ask for a third time, give me an example of a potential Garnett deal that COULD be done and is even remotely realistic from all parties point of view. I'd especially be interested in one where we keep "the three core members". I'm not seeing any deal that we could offer that wouldn't be terrible for Minnesota and be worse than what a dozen other teams could offer.
