bblock: I didnt mean a good trade for the Lakers. But, now that you mention it, it would have been interesting to see him running up and down the court in that show.
Sampson did not opt out the previous year, the Worthy year, because the Clips and Lakes were contending for #1 pick. RS could not get a guarantee Lakers would get him. So, he stayed in the southern school on the eastern part of the US. Lakes wanted him, expected him to replace Kareem -- who stayed longer than expected (partially because he was broke). The Lakes played McAdoo at the 4, a non-bruiser as many minutes as they played Rambis, the bruiser.
One thing about Ralph: he was usually an entirely different player at the 5 spot; aggressive, dominant, active...until his knees got so bad he couldn't. I really believe that, as lucky as we got in the draft, the two guys we tried to make into Twin Towers were probably both better at the 5 by a long shot, and it lessened Ralph's effectiveness. Still, a nice problem to have, until the knees. Honestly, he could have been great, really great.
I doubt if the Rockets would have traded Ralph to get a lesser center in Bowie (even with the Drexler throw-in). The lure would have been to get Jordan, who slipped to No. 3. And Hakeem verified this trade opportunity in his book (I think?). Of course, this is all monday-morning quarterbacking, so if we are traveling back in time to make the pick, we all know who to pick.
This is what I've always believed. I don't think he was meant to be a 4 at all. He was always more effective at the 5 before Hakeem came to the Rockets and when he often played there during Hakeem's rookie year. If anything, his career was shortened by playing out of position... although we'll never know. I think codell had it right. Ralph had a terrible fall on his back at Boston Garden, getting his legs cut out from under him going up (and he had some hops!) and the guy could go so far up that it was a hell of a way coming down. I saw the game and I remember it being during the '86 Finals, but I could have it wrong. (not the place, but the date) As codell said, the story is that he messed his knees up compensating for his back. It's really hard to research the '86 Finals, for some reason, or we could be certain. The Houston Chronicle's archives are terrible. Ralph was a hell of a player when he was healthy. I remember him getting MVP for the All Star game his rookie year, one of only 2 players to do it (don't remember the other one). He was awesome, and the game had some rediculous score... 140 something to 130 something (something like that ). Man, basketball was a gas to watch back then. The scores for the NBA games were unreal!
a questions for you Rox historians, what prompted the Rox to trade " fo.., fo..., fo..."Moses M; and who did they get for him?
Joe Fan, Before you take acception to my post, please re-read. I am not comparing them directly as players (although their skill sets compare favorably), but rather, was comparing how they changed the stereo type of their positions (7'4'' guy (Sampson) playing the 4 and 7 footers (Garnett) playing the 3).
Ralph was "the player of the century" and I don't think that was too much of a stretch. As codell said, he's a 7'4" KG. I totally disagree with those who say they knew Olajuwon would be better than Sampson coming out of college. The only thing Sampson was clearly worse than Akeem was his personality. Other than that, his tools were all better than Dream. I agree that he sould be playing center rather than PF. The fact that he was with Dream diminished his game. As for the Portland trade, looking back it made sense. But at that time, who would have thought to trade away "the player of the century"? But I have always thought that the twin tower concept wouldn't work. Jordan would have fitted better on that team.
It was a regular season game that Ralph landed on his back while playing in Boston. I did not see that game but I saw a replay on the news of him being carried out on a stretcher. Also do you rembember the comment that Magic Johnson made after Ralph won the All-Star game MVP? He said that if Sampson played for the Lakers that the league could size up a NBA Championship ring for each one of his fingers. I always thought those were pretty strong words.
Deckard, I originally thought the fall occured during a regular season game in early 1987. Turns out we were both wrong: "When we finished, I had to talk to somebody about what I had just seen. I went home and called my brother. I said, `You're not going to believe this, but Ralph can't play." The prevailing theory is that Sampson 's problems began March 24, 1986, when he took a frightening fall at Boston Garden and landed hard on his back and head. He began to experience back problems after the fall and tried to compensate for the pain by changing the way he ran. That altered running style is said to have caused his knees to deteriorate and has left his career hanging by a thread of hope and his own determination. And don't harp on the Chronicle's search engine. I have always found it easy to pull up whatever I need (found the preceeding quote in a min or so).
BTW Deckard and Crash: Here is the full article. Good read, for a Blinebury article. Brought back alot of memories: Sampson 's hope for tomorrow By FRAN BLINEBURY Staff SACRAMENTO, Calif. - There are nights when his wife and daughter are asleep, the house is dark and the only sounds are the click and whir of the VCR as Ralph Sampson sits with the remote control in his hand, pushing the buttons and staring at the images that flicker across the screen. He watches a 7-foot-4 figure go up to the top of a backboard with one huge hand to spear a lob pass and spike it through the hoop. He sees the man dribble along the right baseline, spin left under the basket and come out on the other side to scoop in a layup off the glass. He looks with eyes widened at those long legs taking such graceful, easy strides across the midcourt line, then finishing a fast break with another resounding slam dunk that would send a bolt of electricity through the crowd. He can hear the roar. "That was me?" he asks the darkness. "Yeah," he says, hitting the rewind button. "That was you.' Then. Now, Ralph Sampson 's days are filled with silence. The stillness of an empty gym punctuated only by the chirp and squeak of his sneakers on the polished floor. He shuffles from side to side. He works on pivoting and changing direction. He moves forward and back , concentrating on bringing his knees straight up to his chest. Then, the biggest trade Two years ago today, the Rockets sent Sampson and Steve Harris to the Golden State Warriors for Sleepy Floyd and Joe Barry Carroll in what then was regarded as the biggest NBA trade of the decade. Since that time, Carroll has been shipped to New Jersey; Floyd has lost his job as the Rockets' starting point guard to 36-year-old John Lucas; Harris has been waived out of the league. And Sampson is learning to run all over again. If there is anything sadder in sports than watching an aging athlete whose skills are slowly eroding, it is to see youth struck down by injury . This is supposed to be the prime of Sampson 's career, and yet, at 28, as excess baggage on the roster of the Sacramento Kings, each step is loaded with questions and every day is filled with the knowledge time is running out. He says the pain is gone now. But that would be the pain in his knees, which have had arthroscopic surgery three times, not the ache that comes from watching the videotapes and remembering the way things were. The moves that used to be so easy and so fluid are now unsure and embarrassing. He can't jump, he can't cut sharply, he can't do much of anything except tiptoe around as if barefoot on thin ice. If you were watching him on the floor under game conditions for the first time, it would be hard to imagine he was an All-American in college and an All-Star in the NBA. McCray shocked by deterioration "Last summer, we got together to work out one day in Houston,"recalled Rodney McCray, again Sampson 's teammate with the Kings. "I had heard a lot of different things about his physical condition, but I was shocked. I mean, I remember what he could do a couple of years ago. He was a great player. "When we finished, I had to talk to somebody about what I had just seen. I went home and called my brother. I said, `You're not going to believe this, but Ralph can't play." The prevailing theory is that Sampson 's problems began March 24, 1986, when he took a frightening fall at Boston Garden and landed hard on his back and head. He began to experience back problems after the fall and tried to compensate for the pain by changing the way he ran. That altered running style is said to have caused his knees to deteriorate and has left his career hanging by a thread of hope and his own determination. Sampson works out on his own now, ever since making the decision to go on the injured list Nov. 25. He is following a program intended to build up his strength and agility, designed by Bruce Frankie of Phoenix, Ariz., a personal trainer. "When they traded for me and brought me here back in October, what I heard from the Kings' management was that they only wanted me to be able to play to 75 percent of my ability and they'd be happy,"Sampson said. "They said if I could just stand in the middle, block a few shots and get the rebounds that came to me, they'd be better off than they were before, and it's all they asked. "So I tried that, but I found that I wasn't happy that way. I don't want to be just part of who I was. I want to be the whole player again.' Just how much of a player the whole Sampson was is the subject for another debate. But let it be said the Rockets have not had anyone post the numbers of a healthy Sampson at power forward since he left. In fact, even in his crippled state this season, Sampson has blocked more shots (11) than Otis Thorpe (five). "I really don't think much about that situation," Sampson said. "I'd say that personally, I don't have any bitterness anymore about the way they handled me or who took my place. My ill feelings are about the way they broke up our team after 1986. I don't think they gave us a chance to get healthy again, or we'd have won a championship. Look what's happened now.' The truth is, Sampson is difficult to know. Never beaming with a smile on the floor or quick with a quote in the locker room, Sampson has left himself open to detractors. They toss around such labels as uncaring and without heart, perhaps revealing much about their own prejudices and ignorance of the game. During the past two years, they have hooted derisively at a man hobbling on bad legs. Quit, they tell him. Sit back and collect the more than $2 million a year you've got coming for three more seasons and live off the interest. "I've slammed doors in the faces of people who've suggested that," Sampson said. "Financially, I could definitely do it. But I don't want to wake up someday 10 years from now wishing that I had tried to make it back . "There came a time when I had to ask myself two questions: "Did I want to play? The answer to that was a definite yes. "Can I play at a high level again? I've gotten closer to that answer in the last few weeks, and I believe it's yes. Because I've had stretches now where I'll have two or three real good days in a row in my workouts. I'm able to jump and move and have no pain. "But I have to break through from one level to the next. It's a slow process.' There has been no clamoring from the sideline. The Sacramento fans have directed their wrath at Pervis Ellison, the No. 1 pick in the 1989 draft, who suffered a foot injury and is probably out for the season. Letters to the local papers suggest changes in personnel and moves in management. No one even mentions Sampson anymore. They regard him as part of the past, and he thinks only of going back to the future to a time when he can play the game instinctively again and not have to take lessons to do something as basic as walk or run. Can he make it all the way back ? McCray just shrugs, and you know it's a long, long road. Sampson sits on the bench in street clothes during home games, slaps backs enthusiastically and comes in early the next day to begin another solitary workout in an empty gym. Then, there are those nights when he turns on the VCR and stares at the pictures that appear on the screen. The reason he looks at the tapes is to study his old running style, to try to recapture former habits. But there are times when he just can't help watching the games. There are the games against Sacramento in the 1986 playoffs. The Denver series. The win over the Lakers when he hit the winning shot in Game 5 at the Forum. Two years and a lifetime have passed. "Sometimes," said Ralph Sampson , "it feels like yesterday. At other times, he just hopes for tomorrow.
Man, he really could, couldn't he? I think I read somewhere that he had a 36" verticle. That's incredible for a 7'4" 230 lb. center. Thanks for finding that stuff... I don't know why I always have trouble with the Chronicle's search engine. It makes sense that the fall took place when it did. I knew it was in '86 and saw him fall. I don't see how he didn't miss more games than he did. Maybe the fact that he played at such a high level after it happened had a lot to do with his later problems. No one who watched him play could question his heart. Especially knowing that. Ralph was one of a kind. Healthy for a reasonable length of his career, he would have been a legend, a lock for the Hall of Fame. Now, he's just a legend for those of us lucky enough to see him play in his prime. crash, Easy... those not around back then just don't understand how he was looked at while at Virginia, when he was drafted, and his first 2-3 years. The whole Yao hoopla pales in comparison.
Two thoughts: #1: He didn't have a "go to" low post move like (H)Akeem's dream shake. This was not a fatal flaw, but somewhat limited him from having those incredibly dominant stretches. I see the same problem with Garnett to some degree. The reason he never developed a post game in college was that he just dunked on everybody. #2: He had a constant facial expression that is perhaps best described as an infinately more subtle version of the Cato scowl. Because of this, he was often described as showing no emotion and that was later extended to having no emotion or lacking passion. In general, he got some of the worst treatment for a rookie in NBA history. After all, how many other rookies can average 20-10 (21.0 ppg & 11.1 rbg) in their rookie year and have a sizeable number of people consider them a disapointment?
Deckard, I was actually looking at that SI Cover and trying to roughly figure out what his vertical was. Id say 36" is not far off. I know he could touch the top of the backboard though. Ive watched the Rockets since 81, but was fairly young and only started watching because my dad's business had season tickets. I remember that Ralph was the player that really made me start paying attention more closely. I started taping games shortly thereafter (still have a box of them on Beta). Regardless, because I didnt get into bball until late in Ralph's rookie year, I was never able to gauge the hype that he received I take your word that it was comparable to Yao's hype and can definitely see that. Ralph was more of a freak of nature than Yao is (sorry Ralph lol). Out of all the possible big men coaches that have been suggested for Yao, I thought Ralph might have been the best choice, if only because their height and skill sets were so comparable.
Codell, you said Sampson could reach the top of the board, do you know if Clyde could do that in his prime time?
It has been documented that Clyde once dunked on a 12 foot goal. Not sure exactly how high the top of the backboard is from the ground, but I would say that he probably could have.
Ralph was my favorite player while he played here in Houston. The Rockets won around 15 more games when Ralphie arrived. That ranked up in the top of how much a rookie impacted his team. If Hakeem had any dribbling skills, he would have played power forward and not Ralph. Hakeem's dribbling skills were a hair better than Eddie Griffin's though(Hakeem's early career). Hakeem was so raw his shot had not developed quite yet. It is one thing to leap and grap a quarter from the top of the backboard - it is reported that Ralph could jump and HANG onto the top of the backboard! I read numerous times that Ralph had a 36" verticle leap. Chuck Nevitt blocked a Ralph hook shot in college. They had to raise the rims to 11' at Sterling HS because they kept getting bent downwards. Clyde was the only one to still be able to dunk on them IN HIGH SCHOOL! Ralph's fall in Boston ruined his career. Ralph made an allstar game and was hurt so Tom Chambers went in his place. Chambers = MVP that game ... Ralph invested millions in "Heavy Rope" and lost every dime of his investment. Ralph was better that Steve Stipanovich. How many three time college players of the year have there been? Three, Ralph , Bill Walton and Cheryl Miller. Word.
thank you guys for the info. i know clyde once won a dunk contest in which he was able to dunk on a 3.65 meters goal (sorry, i am chinese, only metric). he is my favorite bball player. i like him more than any other players including yao. I became a rocket fan in the 94/95 season and i freqently came here in the late 90's i thinks. it is really a good place for the rockets fans.
