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Olidipo and Wall: 55 of our 91 shots

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Rocket River, Mar 3, 2021.

  1. DCkid

    DCkid Contributing Member

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    I've watched him in DC his entire career and he definitely has good court vision. I believe he was like top 3 in assists a couple years in a row for the Wizards, so it' not like he CAN'T create for others. Heck the tapes even exist for this season where he breaks down his man and zips it out to a three point shooter the moment that defender starts do drawn in. Of course it's going to result in a Tucker brick 80% of the time, but it's still the right play. I suspect his assist number stats look a little weaker than they should due to the abysmal shooting as a team, but he's still not passing near enough by about half.

    I mean, without Wall I can't even imagine what our offense would be. There's maybe two other players that can break down their man, and Gordon literally never passes once he's decided that he's going to drive. And Oladipo can barely create his own shot anymore, so how can we expect him to create for others? Really not sure what other option we have at the moment until Wood comes back....and even then it's not like the offense will be going through Wood unless we decide to feed him in the post, which is unlikely since it's not 1995.

    In a perfect World, Wall would have an even split of pass vs. shoot. I don't understand exactly what offensive identity the coaching staff is trying to put in place, but either it sucks or Wall is just ignoring it. Maybe a combination of both.
     
    #61 DCkid, Mar 4, 2021
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2021
    Houstunna and Rocket River like this.
  2. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    Create shots for who...PJ Tucker? Patton? Sterling Brown?

    Let's get real, how many of John Wall's 32-game winning 2019 Washington teammates are better than most of the Rockets roster and would walk in and would have their 2019 selves start for the 2021 Rockets?:

    Beal
    Porter
    Portis
    Oubre
    Bryant
    MF Morris


    I mean he had Ariza, Jeff Green and Austin Rivers on that team! Even freaking Dwight! Those guys are too good to play in Houston now!

    We are horrible - of course Wall isn't able to create shots for this washed-up gang and is getting fewer assists. Of course his usage is higher on a team with an 8-man rotation on some nights.

    I just don't get what people actually expect out of Wall and Oladipo, literally the only guys who are even remotely capable of creating any offense at all, for not ....turnign the ball over to PJ Tucker in the post? Running a 5-out for Mason Jones? The Rockets don't even have players who can come off screens and hit jumpers. Basically Wall and Oladipo can attack teams while they're setting up and that's about it.

    I know there is nothing to talk about becuase the team is terrible. But, pearl-clutching over ruining players ithat we don't have yet is pretty funny. Name one player John Wall ruined. Jan Vesely? Troy Brown? Tomas Satoransky?
     
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  3. Reeko

    Reeko Member

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    u keep naming low usage role players like Porter or scrubs like Vesely, or guys that were off-ball like Beal

    someone like Cade fits none of those descriptions

    Wall was only getting 1 apg to Christian Wood when he was here and everyone was talking about how he was getting frozen out on numerous possessions. What’s Wall’s excuse for that? Wall all of the sudden can’t run PnR with a big like Wood?
     
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  4. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    I don't even get what you're trying to argue man. YOu say we shoudl worry about John Wall ruining and stunting players. OK fine. but look at the evidence. IMO he hasn't really ruined anybody given that you can't name a single player that he allegedly ruined.

    And then I name players who he didn't ruin (either becuase they are good NBA players like Beal, Porter etc or hopeless stiffs like Vesely) and you say "yeah, they're just role players! or play off the ball". Yes, they are. So?

    Finally, this Rockets team is terrible, there is nobody to defer to. I mean, Christian Wood? OK, let me go back and watch the < 100 or so minutes they shared the court together this year? The Rockets most common Wall-Wood 5 man lineup (and actually, most used lineup overall) this year is 58 minutes of this:

    J. Harden | D. Nwaba | P. Tucker | J. Wall | C. Wood

    lol - I see something wrong with that lineup!
     
  5. Reeko

    Reeko Member

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    no, I said stunt a top draft pick like Cade, not all players in general

    someone like Cade should be given the reigns and control of the offense from day 1 and be allowed to do his thing as the floor general...naming guys like Porter and Vesely is not relevant because none of what I said about Cade ever applied to them...Bradley Beal was primarily off-ball running around screens and spotting up with minimal playmaking responsibilities while next to Wall...so basically, also not a player that applies to Cade

    Cade is not some off-ball spot up guy or role player...the type of player u keep bringing up

    so we shouldn’t expect Wall to be able to generate more than 1 apg to a big like Wood
     
  6. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    It's crazy for you to take Beal who not only flourished with Wall but is now the NBA's leading scorer without him and somehow using that as an argument for John Wall ruining young players ..while worrying about a player in teh futue that the ROckets will probably not ever even have.

    When Cade Cunningham comes to the Rockets and John Wall starts taking his parkins space, I'll worry about that, until then it's a silly thing to go back and try to invent evidence for based on John Wall commanding the tank next to Assistant Gunner PJ Tucker, or anythign he did in Washington which has no evidence of what you claim will happen.

    Over a cumulative sample size of about 2 total games they've played on the court together, when James Harden was here? yes I am not worried about that.

    You should worry less, in conclusion.
     
  7. Reeko

    Reeko Member

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    I never said Wall ruined Beal nor even implied it. Not sure where u got that one from

    James Harden had just a 29% usage rate in the games he played this season, but I guess we really shouldn’t expect more than 1 apg to a big like Wood from Wall then with or after Harden
     
  8. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    In the 3 games and 30 minutes they played together? Yeah I'm not worried.
     
  9. Reeko

    Reeko Member

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    more like 10 games played together, but it’s all good...keep chucking Wall and guide the tank
     
  10. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    No, more like 3 games played together, (though you're right, its not 3).

    n the 2 months since Harden Trade, Christian Wood has played in 11 games - Wall played in 4 of those games, 20 something per.

    They probably combined for about 80 minutes on the court. The Rockets went 3-1, the one loss beign the last time we saw Wood play a basketball game.

    FWIW, probably not much, the Wall/Wood pairing is actually the 2nd best +/-player pairing out of 670 or so in the Post-Harden Rockets (+13.8), the only better combo has been the dream lineup of Wood-Kurucs, +19 over 16 minutes
     
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  11. Kevooooo

    Kevooooo Member

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    There can be ball movement and it still end in your two “best scorers” hands to take the shot. Not saying that’s what is happening, just that that data set alone doesn’t necessarily prove a point.
     
  12. Houstunna

    Houstunna The Most Unbiased Fan
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    Wall averaged far more assists in WAS and had a much better AST/TO ratio.

    Did he miss so many layups in WAS?
     
  13. rockbox

    rockbox Around before clutchcity.com

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    He definitely finished better in Washington, but a lot of his assists were the cheap kind. Passing it to Bradley Beal, Gortat, shooters. He didn't create the opportunities that Harden created.

    Washington only broke the top 10 in offensive efficiency once while Wall was there and in most years they were below average including being dead last in his third season. Wall is a walking empty stat sheet. Much worse that Westbrook.

    Think Andre Miller in Cleveland when he led the league in assists except Wall can't shoot as well.
     
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  14. rockets1995

    rockets1995 Member

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    John Wall is a well spoken Russell Westbrook who only Compliments himself and Repeatedly Says he is a Leader and a Franchise Guy.

    Everyone in Houston with the Harden Eyeroll.
     
  15. riko

    riko Member

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    Brick brothers
     
  16. Loki27

    Loki27 Member

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    I am surprised to hear that about Victor.

    Wall has been an arrogant ass his entire career.
     
    ksny15 likes this.

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