OKC's Westbrook ft. Paul George & Carmelo

Harden has already said that he would be fine coming off the bench (he played starter's minutes anyway) if they gave him the max.

Westbrook may be inefficient and stubborn, but that is what years of coaches being fine with his playstyle will breed, kinda like the typical super althetic/elite playmaking guard with a borked jumpshot, it was good enough to dominate lower competition, so who cares?

Don Nelson got Baron Davis to play in a system, Eric Spolstra got LeBron ****ing James to buy into a system, Larry Brown's "Iverson Cut" didn't get its name for nothing! Westbrook should be either running pick-and-rolls or cutting to the rim on almost every single play, like a smaller Giannis but with better court vision. Lackluster coaching breeds bad habits, and the fact that Westbrook has always been given free reign with no effort to force him into a system, says volumes about himself and his coaching.

To further push my point, Westbrook's best season came in 2015-16, when he averaged only 23 per game on the lowest amount of shots since 2010-11 excluding the season where he only played 46 games. He averaged 10.4 assists that year on the best assist/turnover ratio of his career. Westbrook finally seemed to be tamed and using his abilities to do what he's best at, beating defenders and attracting heavy help defense. This was all reflected inhis highest WS (14.5) and WS/48 (.245) of his career.

Then Durant left and the offensive system turned into organized stat-padding, which I think was forced upon the coach by an ownership group desperate to resign Westbrook while staying in the headlines.

 

Westbrook is teflon. Any warts in his game get explained away as "At least he is TRYING."

Media looks at Westbrook's energy on the court and "mean faces" (mean faces = he is serious about winning). They use these elements to explain away everything. As they say "don't confuse activity with achievement."

It is plain as day that the KEY to OKC is Steven Adams. Getting Steven Adams involved.

 

The Thunder caught in a 4 way tie for record in which they fall to 9th would be hysterical beyond belief. I mean, we would absolutely have to check in on @DreamShook. Could he survive that?

 

In the 2003-2004 season, Kobe had more WS, a higher WS/48, and a better BPM than Shaq. Shaq was still the more efficient offensive player, but his defense by that point regressed to where he could not leave under the basket, something Detroit took advantage of with Rasheed Wallace, Kevin Garnett the round before, and Tim Duncan the round before that.

 

I've been injecting these OKC L's straight into my blood stream all season. if the Thunder drop out of the playoffs, it will be the purest most potent L of the season. A concentrated shot of schadenfreude to my pancreas. I wouldn't survive it.

 

Just imagine a world where the CP3 + Harden marriage flamed out as pathetically as the OK3 have so far. There would be at least one article every single week dismantling Harden's inability to show up for big games, and how Chris Paul isn't really a winner. Hell, there are people who STILL firmly believe those things even though we've literally curbstomped the entire league this season. Westbrook is the Teflon Don when it comes to criticism, both within the Thunder organization, and in the media.

 

They didn't win the championship that season. Shaq was clearly the best player during the first three championships. That's not to say Kobe wasn't great in his own right, but Shaq was finals MVP all three years.

 

Shaq was better from 1996-2002, I'm not disputing that.

I am saying that Kobe was superior in the 2003-2004 season.

 

So...

is this experiment, to date, an argument that talents < fit and match ? I remember Myers (GS's GM) argue it's fit and match while Morey argue it's talent. Seems like Morey is wrong.

 

when did morey argue talent by itself is the only thing that matters? he most certainly takes into account fit when taking into account possible signings

 

Westbrook is perennially overrated, seen as top 5 when he's around 10-15ish. George is a 8 win player disguised as a 12 win player, Melo is old and washed up, and Adams can only do so much. On top of all that, no real depth and a shitty bench will produce a high-40s win team.

 

Oh well yea, probably, although he was ass in the finals. But that was definitely the start of Shaq's decline.

 

This could be very much the case. Real talent is less than the perceived talent that nearly everyone thought would make OKC a contender. Though I would said PG is very talented while carmelo is not even as good as EGordon.

Can’t remember the clip now. Host asked the question. GSW gm went through a long speech on fit. Then money said “talent, talent, talent.” Doesn’t mean it’s only about talent, but talent > fit.

 

ill probably just wait til you can actually find the clip to see if you're possibly misunderstanding. but DM has always been the one who covets talent yes. that should be obvious for anyone trying to actually win but fit being just as important with that talent.

 

i agree on fit as important (if not MORE important)... that is why i remember this. I'll try to find the clip.

EDIT: found it

I got the order wrong. @ 1:20, start from beginning

http://www.nba.com/video/2017/09/26/20170926-open-court-talent-vs-fit

 

Which is why the next year he turned a 42 win Heat team into a 59 win team that would win the championship in his 2nd season with the team....meanwhile the Lakers after the loss of Shaq went from being a 56 win team to a 34 win team that faded into irrelevance until Pau Gasol became their best player.

 

TheMightyMo of Shaq. How many years did he wait til the season for easy (sic) off-season repairs? He took crappy care of himself, physically and as a teammate as he got older and blew his chances for GOAT.

The match-up of All-Time that would have piqued my interest: peak Shaq v peak Wilt.

 

I dunno, "peak Wilt" was only "peak Wilt" because the league didn't have much big man talent. The only other decent center at the time was 6'9 (though he was billed at 6'10). IMO the only prime center battle I'd be interested in seeing would be prime Hakeem vs prime Kareem.

 

Either you didn't watch Wilt or our opinions diverge significantly.