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[Official] Marins @ Astros

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by Castor27, Aug 18, 2009.

  1. gucci888

    gucci888 Member

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    Anybody know if the roof is gonna be open tonight?
     
  2. juicystream

    juicystream Member

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    Explain what happened in 2007. He struggled early as the closer, and was removed from that role. Pitched great for two months after and got reinstated as the closer, then started struggling again. Are you saying he was hurt, got healthy, and got hurt that year?

    http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/gamelog?playerId=5102&year=2007
     
  3. juicystream

    juicystream Member

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    He should. Hawkins I would imagine would be a B.

    See what I posted to The Cat. Clearly injury is effecting him this year, but I don't understand when looking at 2006 & 2007.
     
  4. The Cat

    The Cat Member

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    Lidge first hurt his knee in May, but tweaked it and made it worse after the All-Star Break, and it was bad enough that he had surgery immediately when the season ended (why the Astros let him pitch 2.5 months on a knee that needed surgery and for a team far out of contention is a mystery I'll never understand).

    http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3044674

    And it ended up being serious enough that he needed a second surgery on the knee the following spring training with Philadelphia. As someone who worked with the team that season, I can promise you -- from about August 1 on, the guy was basically walking on one leg before and after games. He lived on cortisone shots and ice... it wasn't a good situation. But most of the media had spent so long regurgitating the tired, old "mental" angle that they ignored what was right in front of them.

    And it's completely misleading to say he started "struggling" when he was re-instated as closer. Look at his game log:

    http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/gamelog?playerId=5102&year=2007

    He went back to his role as closer when he came back from an oblique injury (separate) around the break, and starting July 20, converted his first six save opportunities in a span of eight days, all when he was under an enormous microscope. If he couldn't handle the pressure, why didn't it happen then? The answer (and I can tell you first-hand from being in the MMP clubhouse) was that his knee got progressively worse and worse, to the point where he eventually started compromising his mechanics. And when you're a guy like Lidge with only two pitches, even slight mechanical alterations mean a lot because the hitter doesn't have that many pitches to guess between.

    As for the beginning of that season, it was two weeks -- way too small of a sample to draw conclusions. You can make any reliever look bad if you focus exclusively on a sample that small. Mariano Rivera had an ERA of 10.57 for that exact same month (April 2007) -- I think he's alright.
     
  5. BrooksBall

    BrooksBall Member

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    That just looked r****ded. Wow, Tejada, wow.

    Put that in the mix with the error against the Nats. The impact isn't the same but still...
     
  6. BrooksBall

    BrooksBall Member

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    One way or another, we find ways to give up 1st inning runs lately. Sickening.

    This time it took a Miggy error and a blown call at 1st.
     
  7. SamCassell

    SamCassell Member

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    We've had the Lidge discussion before. You make a big deal about the 8 days that he pitched well in July, but say that two weeks in April is too small a sample size to know anything. Which is it? 8 days is enough to draw conclusions, but two weeks is not?

    What about this - April (closer) 5.79 ERA. August (closer) 5.11 ERA. September (closer) 5.23 ERA. Enough sample size?

    But it doesn't really matter whether you call Lidge's problems mechanical or physical or mental... the bottom line is that he's either really really good (2008) or awful (2009) way more any other player I can remember. Whatever the issue is, you just can't count on consistency from the guy. And that's not what you want from a closer. Not the kind of guy you want to be paying $25 mil to over the next two seasons.

    And Chris Simms has a career QB rating of 71.2 in almost 500 pass attempts. He sucks, too. :p
     
  8. BrooksBall

    BrooksBall Member

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    Maybe the Japanese will pay us to take Matsucki back. They were jizzing all over the place about his 2,000 hits so who knows...
     
  9. BrooksBall

    BrooksBall Member

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    Hunter is simply deceptively strong.
     
  10. BrooksBall

    BrooksBall Member

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    Wandy with masterful execution of the fake bunt.
     
  11. The Cat

    The Cat Member

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    It's not just the eight days in July -- it was the preceding three months or so prior to that as well in which his performance was similarly dominant. No, it wasn't ALL in the ninth inning, but if he wasn't able to handle the closer's spot from day one due to mental pressure (what people claimed about the first two weeks of April), why wouldn't the same be true when he returned to the spot?

    I'll agree on that. I think it's because he only has two pitches, but little things like nagging injuries and mechanics have a far bigger impact on him than they do most pitchers. I don't think Brad Lidge is an all-time great closer; I have no delusions of grandeur. I just know the "mental" case is hogwash, that's all.

    I know you're joking around, but... take out numbers from his first two seasons (when almost any QB will suck, come on, you know it takes until year three to truly grow into the NFL QB position) and his numbers are a whole lot more respectable. :)
     
  12. BrooksBall

    BrooksBall Member

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    Why was Wandy watching the ball and not Dave Clark? Did Clark fail to have him prepared before Berkman came to the plate? A team that can't score runs can't afford so many little mistakes. The score should be at least 5-1 right now.
     
  13. BrooksBall

    BrooksBall Member

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    We are so stuck with Matsui. He is just awful.

    Our current 7-8 hitters are actually worse than the often maligned Everett-Ausmus duo.
     
  14. Zac D

    Zac D Member

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    Even with Cy Wandy on the mound? :cool:
     
  15. BrooksBall

    BrooksBall Member

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    Wandy's been great so far tonight. I was talking in general. Some silly stuff on the basebaths over the last couple seasons.
     
  16. BrooksBall

    BrooksBall Member

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    That's the Wandy curve we know and love. Impressive bounce back game against a smokin' hot offense. The Marlins have 10 hits or more in their last 15 games. 18 is the MLB record.
     
  17. BrooksBall

    BrooksBall Member

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    Wandy is totally locked in.

    I know changing the past changes the future but Wandy's only difficult inning started with a Miggy error and involved a blown call at 1st.

    Since the 1st, Wandy has given up 2 singles (1 was an infield single) and no walks.

    The Marlins need 8 hits to keep their streak alive. I wouldn't rule it out.
     
  18. Cowboii

    Cowboii Member

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    Come on WANDY!
    Give me this complete game!
     
  19. BrooksBall

    BrooksBall Member

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    And just like that... no outs, 2 on, tying run at the plate in the form of Hanley Ramirez.

    This Marlins team just don't quit.
     
  20. Cowboii

    Cowboii Member

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    Fk COOP!
    I hate him, i swear to god i hate him.
     

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