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[OFFICIAL] Green New Deal Thread

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Os Trigonum, Jan 31, 2019.

  1. tallanvor

    tallanvor Contributing Member

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    GND is not a place.....
     
  2. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    Hmm. I thought it was. Perhaps you could help me better understand Green New Deal, since I don't know much about it. Could you explain what it is?
     
  3. dmoneybangbang

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    I have no doubt that libertarians whose videos you posted, think those things.

    People think crumbling and congested infrastructure sucks, no doubt. The last major federal infrastructure build was under Reagan.

    If you want to talk about how states and municipalities are drowning in pension obligations they can’t afford, then I agree with you.
     
  4. tallanvor

    tallanvor Contributing Member

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    If the infrastructure sucks then why do you tout it as some success of a government run industry? same with our school systems or our police force. Nobody is happy with the way these things are run and you mark them as some proof of socialism's success.

    Can't wait for more systems we rely on to run as effectively as our roads and schools with the all powerful SOCIALISM at the wheel.
     
  5. smokieethabear

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    It seems to me that Democrats (maybe not all) want to pretty much hit the "Reset" button on the teconomy like it's a game. Let's bring everyone back down to a even playing field. All this does is set Capitalism back. Eventually, people that work hard will still move ahead and the income divide will be recreated. Not saying that laziness is the reason behind the income gap, but some folks are just lazy and want handouts and complain all the time. I know luck also takes play in this but that's life. You deal with the hand you got, it won't always be fair. Can't expect to be saved from other people just cause they are more fortunate than you, especially forcefully. I'm not a millionaire or would even be considered rich but I understand it's not rich people's responsibility to take care of me or any issues I may have in life.

    Actually now that I think about it, this New Green Deal doesn't just want to hit reset, it wants to actually destroy our capitalist fundamentals of our economy.
     
  6. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    Don't know about socialism in utilities or if people much like them. Many of the electric utilities are investor-owned, they socialize the risk and privatize the profit -- which btw, is often in the neighborhood of 12-14% and virtually risk-free. That's more like state corporatism than socialism. Nice job if you can get it. The do a great job of being local community partners though and tend to have very high trust from their ratepayers, though people get pretty sour when the power gets cut off for non-payment. There are definitely some more socialist forms though, like Austin Energy or CPS in San Antonio which are municipal, or the Pedernales Coop. But all the big ones -- ConEd, ComEd, PGE, SCE, FPL, Dominion, even the big ones in Texas CenterPoint and Oncor -- all investor-owned.
     
    No Worries likes this.
  7. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    Republicans are really showing the Bronx' freshman House Rep how it's done by shining a spotlight on her - I bet she retreats and no way at all does this backfire on them.
     
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  8. dmoneybangbang

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    They were pretty successful in modernizing and educating Americans. However, they require maintainence and evolution.

    We want good infrastructure and good schools but we don’t want to invest it. All of the sudden all the things that built modern America are ineffective or did we just not invest properly?

    You are misdiagnosing the issue.

    Again... its mixed Capitalism and Socialism. No need to be dishonest about how America is run.

    People seem to hate globalization, yet its a direct by product of CAPITALISM.
     
    No Worries and conquistador#11 like this.
  9. dmoneybangbang

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    State corporatism seems like a very American way of describing the quasi socialist nature of this country and how it was built. How was all the right of way for all the various utilities established?
     
  10. conquistador#11

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    they teach this early on in dual credit Economics. I guess people just forget.
    Shout out to Mrs. Strawman, 12th grade. Students used to say she failed Michael Dell once.
     
  11. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Contributing Member
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    oh it most certainly is. a magical mystical place full of unicorns and rainbows. also a state of mind residing between the ears of the Green Dreamer or whatever you call her ;)
     
    jcf likes this.
  12. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    Utilities are monopolies regulated by the states, so they get a mandate to operate (some would say a license to steal) from the people, ultimately. They get all kinds of public policy accommodations so they can do the things we want them to do. And we want them and we need them. And it really does make sense that at least part of what they do should be a protected and maybe even for-profit monopoly. It doesn't change the fact that 12% of what comes out of your pocket goes into the pocket of some shareholder. I really can't manage to call that socialism. Its not like the USPS, which is a protected monopoly in which no one is taking a profit.
     
  13. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    That's not an explanation of what GND. But since you responded, perhaps you can explain what it is? I keep reading about airplanes and cows, so make sure to include a short bit on those.
     
  14. dmoneybangbang

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    That's fair as it really depends on what you define "socialism" as. State corporatism seems like a euphemism to me personally.
     
  15. Roscoe Arbuckle

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    Or we could advance tech on what other Countries have done and have a goal of recycling nuclear power to where there is 0% waste; a much more attainable goal, IMO.
     
  16. Roscoe Arbuckle

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    why do liberals always feel the need to ignore the "illegal" part of "illegal immigrants" these days? And, yes. Just about every President has said something about better enforcement in regards to illegal immigration. But I'm pretty sure you knew that...
     
  17. tallanvor

    tallanvor Contributing Member

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    Completely agree that socialism isnt sustainable and you run out of other peoples' money.
     
  18. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Contributing Member
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  19. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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  20. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
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    Trump's policies mostly target legal immigrants, not illegal. He and the right use the "illegal immigrant" issue as a red herring to distract away from changes in his legal immigration policies.
     

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