McHugh is fine as a 4th starter. He's just nowhere close to where he was last season…and when he sucks, he really sucks. But when he's on, he's very good. The question will be which McHugh we get in the playoffs. He can be the X factor that helps bring home the championship.
Most guys really suck when they suck. Especially #4 starters. Probably most #3's, too. It's mostly the #1 and #2 guys that can muscle through a really. Has happened 2 times out of 22 starts this year for McHugh. Hell, I just looked up Jordan Zimmermann--who has been a stud over the last 3 seasons for the Nats. He has been blown up twice this season also in 22 starts. (No, I'm not counting today when he muscled through 6 innings though he gave up 5 runs.) When he's bad, he's really bad too.
McHugh also has higher upside than most 3rd or 4th starters. He possesses an elite pitch that can carry him. So he is capable of being borderline dominant. He also will not be a free agent until 2020. He has great value financially as well. Last I looked his FIP was in the 3's and outside of two HORRIBLE games (15 runs), his FIP was not far off of last year.
First of all, luck isn't relative to what Feldman got. 2nd, I think most people stopped using wins to evaluate quality of pitching, so I don't particularly care when he did or didn't get a win. The question is, did he pitch well enough? And the answer is mostly yes.
Right, but going into the season, most had the expectation of him being a #2, because that's how good he was last season. As a #4, he's fine, but that's still a let down based on how he was in 2014.
Right. Maybe luck is the wrong word. I used it because it was beyond the pitchers' control. Did McHugh pitch well enough to win? Yes. Did the Astros win? Yes. Did Feldman pitch well enough to win? Yes. Did the Astros win? No. Like the previous poster stated, stuff happens. A W is a W. It doesn't matter how many run you score as long as you score more than your opponent.
I guess I meant "does he pitch well enough to win, independent of scoring?" and the answer is usually yes. But to me, it was "no" in the game you're referencing, but the team happened to pull out the W (irrelevant when discussing McHugh's ability to pitch). I don't think that makes Colin lucky or unlucky. He had a not-great game (but showed toughness, etc.). But usually he has good games. I know you're not really disagreeing--but we're talking about different things so I thought I'd clarify what I meant
That's certainly fair. I think he's pitched well enough to be a #3 on many/most teams, but the inconsistency this year makes him more like a #4 (in terms of where you want him in a playoff series) on a contender. I do like that he's improved his durability at least, which he also had to do. He can still put it all together--based on good stretches this year, the entirety of last year, and the fact that this is really his 2nd year pitching in the ML...I think he can get there.
I think he can too. This year is hopefully a good learning experience for him…seems like when he "settles down", he's very difficult to hit…it's just that in games where he hasn't been on, it's usually the start of games. His endurance and durability are good…so if he can just get to that point where he gets in his groove, we will usually win the game. It's those first couple innings that scare me with him, otherwise, it's smooth sailing.
First of all, i am very happy to see some detractors who laughed at me because i look at spots in a rotation and value them depending where they were. With McHugh my argument was and still is still is that he is not a good number 2 starter, that he was a good number 4 or 5 starter, and i was not happy at all as a number 2. Now i see guys saying what i said before, that he is good as our number 4, great to hear that. If McHugh was so good, why did we go after Kazmir and Fiers??? I always said we needed a number 2, and many laughed, and we got it first with McCullers, but he is a young rookie, so it was great to see Luthnow bring Kazmir and take that resnsability form McCullars and move him to number 3, which is middle of rotation. Lets not forget when our rotation was K, McHugh, Feldman, Hernandez and Wojo What did i say about that rotation??? That we had problems, that Heranndez and Wojo should not be pitching in a good rotation, that McHugh and Feldman should be 4 and 5 and that we needed a number 2 big time. Well, the season changed when McCullers pitched like a number 2 and everyone moved a spot. Now, Luthnow still wanted one more starter, at least, and went after Kazmir, meaning, that number 3 still needed, and with Kazmir, McCullers move to 3. And why Fiers???? I want to see Fierrs pitch with us because i think he is better than McHugh, (less hits than innings plus 9K per 9 innings). Now, my comment yesterday was, Feldman is pitching good, meaning, Fiers and McHugh better pitch good because those last 2 spots is going to be a battle between those 3. And you know what??? After all those moves, ALL starters are doing a very nice job, as competition is making them even better. When the season started i said Luthnow did one great thing this offseason, he prepared this team for COMPETITION. Each spot (except 2b) had more than 1 quality player to fight for the position. Remember that GAttis was tought to play LF, so bringing Rasmus gave 4 OF for 3 spots. CC and Singleton. Conger and Castro. Villar and Lowrie, and the loser to fight it with Valbuena at 3b. When Heranndez was signed, Straily had competition for the fifth spot, remember Obie was suppose to be number 4 but injured. There was a lot of competition. And now, we have a lot of competition for that 4th and 5th spot. I think is going to go Fiers and McHugh with Feldman taking some games from McCullers, but, is all going to be decided by performance. At the beginning of the year i did not like our rotation, and i was vocal with it, but right now, i think we have one of the best rotations in baseball. And guys, believe me, Fiers is good, you'll see.
Yesssss, and that is what is going to happen when you give more hits than innings and a plus 4 ERA, that is McOUch, too many hits. Now, as number 4 or 5, no problem, as number 2, NEVER. The way i judge pitchers, and i may be wrong, but, is my way of thinking, is whip. If you have a high whip, then you are going to have many runners on base and i dont like that. Right now McHugh, Feldman and Fiers are about the same with that number, so lets see the 3 battle for that 4th and 5th spot. And for a number 2, he was really a McOUCH I would like to see his ERA get under 4 My prediction is Fiers outpitches McHugh and Feldman, lets see. Again, the word here is COMPETITION
I think we agree. The difference is, I'm only using #'s in a rotation as it pertains to a playoff rotation--otherwise I don't care (just need them to pitch well, and McHugh does for the most part). My point is that a #4 starter won't pitch in a 5 game series and will usually only get 1 start in a 7 game series. (Sometimes 0, occasionally 2). When the playoffs roll around, you want guys who are consistent ideally. McHugh has the ability to be a great pitcher, but right now he's not a guy who you'd love to start 2 games in a 7 game series unless necessary.
We can always take solace in the face that in 2001, Dave Mlicki was 7-3 with a 5+ ERA and a 1.36 WHIP while with Houston. He had to start game 2 of the best of 5 series against the Braves and gave up 1 unearned run in 5 innings. He clearly outpitched the Astros other two starters that season, Wade Miller and Shane Reynolds in the playoffs.
I said it in a game earlier this year.... but I think McHugh would be a fantastic post-season pitcher. He's faced a good amount of adversity already in his short career... to the point that I don't think he gets phased all that much by in-game pressure (and if anything, seems to respond more effectively when his back is to the wall).
