They've had some success, but not as much and not for as long as the Astros did (until 2005, that is).
Again, my response to the post was last OFF season (although the second half of the regular season was exciting as well). The poster was longing for the days of the exciting OFF season. I would think that all the trades and moves they made prior to 2008 was a pretty exciting time regardless of how anyone felt about the moves when they were made.
Pettite turned down the Yanks 10 mil/yr offer.. while that opens the door, I can't see us offering more than that anyway, so it opens and closes the door all at once
that would make for an interesting debate - would you trade the astros for the twins? since 1997, the astros have averaged 86.8 W/YR; won 4 division titles; 2 wild cards; 1 league pennant; are 14-21 (.400) in the postseason (14-25 when you include the WS). the twins have averaged 81.4 W/YR; won 4 division titles; no wild cards; no pennants; are 6-15 (.285) in the postseason (no WS). but the twins also undeniably sucked between '97-'00 (67.5 W/YR); they've actually averaged more wins than the astros (88.3 to 85.8) since 2001, and made more playoff appearence (4 to 3). postseason results, however, favor the astros: astros: 13-12 (13-16 with WS) twins: 6-15 (also 0-1 in "play-in" games; no WS) series wins: astros 3; twins 1 BUT... as the poster stated, the twins did it with a much lower payroll; they lost a play-in game last year; have a better, younger ML team right now and an infinitely better farm system - and they have won 2 WS in the last 25 years... i'm not entirely sure the astros are winning any organizational awards over the twins in a landslide - they've been neck-and-neck with each other the past 8 years and i suspect the twins will make up for '97-'00 over the next 4 years... interesting debate.
Well stated. The Twins are currently in far better position than the Astros. Their history is better, too (some WS titles in there).
Not only that, but the Twins are not in a good position either. They lost Santana. I guess their fans should wring their hands and complain about how the owner just didn't want to spend money he doesn't have.
I wouldn't trade the Bagwell/Biggio era for the same period of time in Minnesota. The Twins haven't been in a WS since 1991. They haven't won a playoff series since 2002. They have rings, though...and close enough in my lifetime that it would have mattered to me.
They lost Santana and then proceeded to win 9 more games the next year, though. They replaced him with good depth and brought up some minor league talent like Slowey - and got Liriano back in the 2nd half of the season. Liriano, when healthy, has actually been *better* than Santana. They also tied for their division. Right now, I think you have to say the Twins are in a better position for the short-term future.
I just assumed he was joking. I mean, Slowey, Liriano, Bonser, Baker, Blackburn at the end of the rotation? Plus Perkins.. that is a rotation I'd be pretty damn happy with. Plus Casilla had a kinda out-of-nowhere year.. if Delmon takes the next step, they will be really good. Gomez was already good last year, and Kubel even showed the potential he was supposed to show a few years ago. That's not even talking about their pair of guys who have been top 5 MVP candidates 2 years in a row or whatever..
Maybe....but they haven't been a serious playoff team since Kirby Puckett was anchoring their lineup.
Close enough? Are you twelve? What a great world series that 91 series was. Morris vs. Smoltz. Extra Innings. I was just a young boy, but I imagine that staying up past my bed time to watch game seven must be reminiscent to what kids in the 50's and 60's must of done in school. the Twins>>>>>Astros in overall history, but of course the astros > the twins in the last decade or so. Everyone in baseball except maybe the Giants have a better short term (2-5 year)/ immediate term future than the astros. But then again the twins were up for contraction only a few years ago. Houston is one of the top media markets in baseball. It depends on the new twins stadium and how much their owner is willing to spend, but would guess, with their revenue the astros are in a better long term position than minnesota.
INcorrect. They are a middle-to-upper-middle market size, compared to other MLB towns. There was a fantastic link about this a few years back, but I'm having trouble finding it. Basically, the "media market" is the number of households with televisions within a like 100-mile radius (I may be off on the size). So, Houston is the 4th largest city in the US, but Dallas is a FAARRR larger media market. Get it? Years ago, when I read the article, Houston was #11, behind Atlanta, among others.
No...but I was a junior in high school. It was still over 17 years ago. That's half my life away. You're right...a tremendous world series.
You're right. Houston is the 11th biggest media market (in baseball) in the usa according to this link (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_television_stations_in_North_America_by_media_market). It's ahead of minnesota and only 3 places behind Boston. But, if that's what is what you are really interested in, then you should know that , with the 11th biggest media market, houston had the 14th biggest payroll last year http://blog.sportscolumn.com/story/2008/4/1/231932/3450/mlb/2008_MLB_Payrolls (out of 30 teams. in 2007 they were 15th biggest payroll. http://blog.sportscolumn.com/story/2007/4/9/1367/60158m). Since 2000 it has had a new (taxpayer funded) ballpark as well.
"Market-wise" they fell right into step since LA, NY and Chicago each have 2 teams and each of those teams have higher payrolls. That moves them up 3 places.
Three or four years ago I did a study of this throughout McLain's tenure, and the Astros were above 11 about half the time and below 11 about half the time. But bobrek's point needs to be taken seriously--I didn't take account with my little five-minute mini-study. Yeah, them and half of baseball. Your point was?
By my count only 4 of the 13 teams ahead of Houston ( only 1--the national's ballpark--was built since houston opened mmp) in the media market have played in a "new" ball park. Not quite half. But what do you think? Does Drayton need a new taxpayer funded ballpark to compete?
