First of all, ease up on the emotions... I apoligize if you're upset by my comments. But, we DID give up prospects. Your argument is that Pupura loves them too much, and doesn't want to give them up. Now you're saying that in this case, it doesn't matter because the prospects we gave up were either not that good, or not going to play for us? IMO, that is when you DO try to trade prospects... are you arguing that he doesn't give up his top prospects? If that's the case, I'm glad he's the GM... I don't want my GM giving up every top prospect the orgnaization has every year. So in the end, the prospects were just alright, not great... and we used them to acqurie an above average major league hitter... what else do you want them to do with the minor league system? Again, sorry if I stirred up some emotions... Its not my preference to get into "heated" confrontations. Didn't hesitate on trading for Huff. Didn't hesitate on trading Buck for Beltran. Didn't hesitate on trading for Wheeler. Didn't hesitate trading for Randy Johnson. If you're arguing that they don't get enough "top-flight" talent in return, I will point out that you have to have top flight prospects to do that... and if you do have those prospects, you better be getting a bonafied all-star in return becuase there's nothing worse than looking at team x giving up future HOFer for a middle releif pitcher (or wondering how good this team would have looked with Freddy Garcia and Carlos Guillen for all these years). That being said, Pence/Patton/Hirsh are good prospects... but none of them are baseball america top-25 prospects that teams who are selling off all-stars look to acquire. Sounds like you're bashing the whole "minor league system" concept here... by saying its essentially a crap-shoot. And yes, the minor league's don't predict mental fallouts or the need for tommy john surgery, which de-railed Ankiel's career. But, as a 21 year old, the guy was DOMINANT. As for the Venezuelan Academy... that produced Johan Santana, Bobby Abreu, Richard Hidalgo, Freddy Garcia, and Carlos Hernandez... MLB started cutting down on the amount of resources teams can commit to their own "private" developments like this. It hurt the Astros, who had a mini-monopoly on that market... now they have to compete like everybody else. Even though I might have missed those articles about "Tim coddling players for fear of said player losing confidence," I never denied that Tim is a big minor league guy. He was basically the main architect in a system that brought us Oswalt, Lidge, Qualls, and Ensberg (and even Berkman, even though he was a no-brainer)... all guys who have been a big part of this team's success. I wanted to know where were the articles that said we missed out on a certain player because we refused to trade our prospects. They do write those... we missed out on Clemens because of Elarton, and we missed out on several deadline deals because Daryle Ward was "untouchable." If we're still doing that now, I'd like to know... because NONE of our current minor league prospects should be considered untouchable. I just haven't seen any hard evidence of that. On this issue, I have to defer the dozens of scouts, minor league coaches, minor league managers, and front office guys that are employed and paid by the Houston Astros. If there's not a player in front of them, why are they still in the minors? Well, maybe they just know more than you, me, or the average bbs poster about when a player can be considered ready for the big leagues. Hirsh certainily looked dominant at AAA... but he didn't once he got up here. Maybe they knew something about that. Maybe Pence's very flawwed swing is just too unsightly for the Astros to take a chance. Honestly, I won't say that all teams are right about every guy... but you said it yourself, the Astros seem to be right about every guy they do promote early. They are wrong on that as well sometimes... they were wrong with Luke Scott last year, and Willy Taveras looks like he may be able to use some seasoning. Where'd you hear that? Why would you think Qualls (who was mediocre in the minors as a starter) would have any more success than Jason Hirsh or Matt Albers? Not to mention that he's still a valuable commodity in the bullpen. [/quote] The Astros spend money when its justified. They don't spend money blindly like some other teams do. The payroll was what it was this year largely because of Clemens. Their name will be in the mix for Soriano, Lee, Willis, and all the other big names out there. I'd say there's a 30% chance they end up with one of them, and that's being a little optimistic. I'd like them to improve over last year as well... I'd like them to compensate for the holes in the lineup (Willy, Everett, Ausmus) with proven bats, as well as compensate for the pitching that needs Pettite/Clemens or equivalents to be somewhat successful. I will, however, be patient... this team is being built around Oswalt and Berkman two guys in their prime, who aren't going anywhere. They should try to be in the position to be flexible year-in, year-out so that they're not locked down with some albatross contracts associated with players who arent' worth it.
Where did he say you *couldn't* post your misguided drivel? You can post it, he can call it misguided, and I can tell you that it's mindless drivel. It's all within our rights on this fan forum. So may I suggest, although you certainly have every right to, that you stop the gratuitous whining.
Bags was the driving force in the payroll with Clemens. Yes, the 'stros will be in the mix, but 30% positive does appear to be optimistic. They must patch the line up holes as well as those in the starting rotation. As every year, or so it seems, the Astros have a bunch of nice players. They need a couple of killers. Clemens is a killer but if he returns (here or Boston, as talk seems to be implying that is where he would return for one last stand) it is likely to be another 1/2 season go. Bigg will be back and he needs to start well enough to get 3,000 by 4th of July so that he can finally be eased out and into his well earned rocker. Can they rely on a bounce back by Ensberg? Can they rely on a continuation by Luke? Can they rely on a 140+ games of Ausmus? Can they expect any of the young arms to produce in the rotation? Everett is value -- but not without enough punch in the line up to protect him. Long term big $$$ pitcher signings scare me as they historically do not pan out any where near the duration of the contract. I anticipate St Louis will be strong again/still (their slide was not prologue IMO). I keep hearing the Cubbies will load up. Cincy is less likely to contend in the Central. The Astros must be proactive to compete in '07.
i disagree. i think it is prologue. after 162 games, that's what you are. they were a pretty mediocre team. they have zero starting pitching past carpenter. not a lot of good arms available in free agency. edmonds is getting older and it shows. i think they're sliding. they need renovation to be where they've been.
Suppan gone? Rolen healthy? Isringhausen healthy? Duncan for real? Marquis gone? Wainwright in the rotation? Mulder healthy? Edmonds done? Any help on the farm? They have as many, if not more, major questions entering the offseason as the Astros do.
Cards are an organization and team I pencil in annually to reach October. Pujols and Rolen and LaRussa are good starting points. Yes, they have ? ? ?'s but I have (regrettable) confidence they'll find answers. They always seem to. Cubs always seem strong April 1. They usually become bearish too soon as they swoon almost every year.
how long has it been since the Cards have had this many questions going into an offseason? good organziation...but that doesn't guarantee anything.
The Cards have had TWO "second chances" when it seemed like their day was done. As 2001 hit, and McGwire seemed to be winding down, and the Cards best years behind them.... Albert Pujols showed up from NOWHERE. They miss the playoffs in 2003. As 2004 came about, and Matt Morris was in decline, Chris Carpenter suddenly becamse a cy young pitcher out of NOWHERE. This year, they should have missed the playoffs... but lucked out to be in a division with even worse teams. They're going to have to improve in a lot of places... watch for Wainright to go into the rotation and become a dominant pitcher.
The same self-proclaimed "Best Fans in Baseball" who want to run everybody - LaRussa, Jocketty, & Rolen are at the top of the list - not named Pujols or Carpenter out of town yesterday.
There is no whining at all. Nick made his opinion about what I said, i simply let him know that his opinion wasn't the end all be all, but thats the problem too many times on the bbs people think that their opinion is the only right one. I simply pointed out that anyone at anytime can post whatever they wanted, even $hit-stirrers like yourself who jumps in and posts his opinion. Don't mistake the obvious for whining.
First of all, ease up on the emotions... I apoligize if you're upset by my comments. No emotions friend, I always get fired up when I talk Astros baseball. But, we DID give up prospects. Your argument is that Pupura loves them too much, and doesn't want to give them up. Now you're saying that in this case, it doesn't matter because the prospects we gave up were either not that good, or not going to play for us? IMO, that is when you DO try to trade prospects... are you arguing that he doesn't give up his top prospects? If that's the case, I'm glad he's the GM... I don't want my GM giving up every top prospect the orgnaization has every year. Semantics. Purpura has that tendency as did Hunsicker to hold on to prospects too long, and IMO I think their coddled. So in the end, the prospects were just alright, not great... and we used them to acqurie an above average major league hitter... what else do you want them to do with the minor league system? Your minor league system is your lifeblood when building your team, but that doesn't mean holding on to every single one. If you're truly looking to make a run now, then you have to be willing to part with even your top flight prospects to acquire talent to help you win now, not later. Again, sorry if I stirred up some emotions... Its not my preference to get into "heated" confrontations. No emotions here. Didn't hesitate on trading for Huff. Didn't hesitate on trading Buck for Beltran. Didn't hesitate on trading for Wheeler. Didn't hesitate trading for Randy Johnson. How many deals had Purpura made before the Huff trade? The Astros needed a stick in the worst way and got one, desperate times call for desperate measures. Wheeler was acquired because another arm was needed in the bullpen. Buck and Dotel for Beltran... need I say more, that was a steal. Johnson was for the stretch run and a good trade even if it was just a rental. If you're arguing that they don't get enough "top-flight" talent in return, I will point out that you have to have top flight prospects to do that... and if you do have those prospects, you better be getting a bonafied all-star in return becuase there's nothing worse than looking at team x giving up future HOFer for a middle releif pitcher (or wondering how good this team would have looked with Freddy Garcia and Carlos Guillen for all these years). Where did I say not acquiring "top-flight" talent? The Red Sox look foolish now that they traded a 3B named Jeff Bagwell for Larry Andersen, but at the time they were trying to win and at that point he showed little power. Just like we look foolish for letting Johan Santana get away in the Rule V draft. When you make a trade you can't view it in hindsight That being said, Pence/Patton/Hirsh are good prospects... but none of them are baseball america top-25 prospects that teams who are selling off all-stars look to acquire. So now Baseball America dictates who major league teams look at in trades? I'm sure when teams call asking about players on the roster or in the minor league they are sure to see where BA ranks the prospect. Sounds like you're bashing the whole "minor league system" concept here... by saying its essentially a crap-shoot. And yes, the minor league's don't predict mental fallouts or the need for tommy john surgery, which de-railed Ankiel's career. But, as a 21 year old, the guy was DOMINANT. Ankiel was lights out in the minors, got to the majors and fell apart mentally. You started listing guys like Wood and Prior who haven't paned out yet and to ask the Cubs where they'd be if they had well ditto for the Redbirds and Ankiel. As for the Venezuelan Academy... that produced Johan Santana, Bobby Abreu, Richard Hidalgo, Freddy Garcia, and Carlos Hernandez... MLB started cutting down on the amount of resources teams can commit to their own "private" developments like this. It hurt the Astros, who had a mini-monopoly on that market... now they have to compete like everybody else. Thats where money is the name of the game. Now is the time scouting comes in and chooses which players the Astros need to try and sign. Even though I might have missed those articles about "Tim coddling players for fear of said player losing confidence," I never denied that Tim is a big minor league guy. He was basically the main architect in a system that brought us Oswalt, Lidge, Qualls, and Ensberg (and even Berkman, even though he was a no-brainer)... all guys who have been a big part of this team's success. I wanted to know where were the articles that said we missed out on a certain player because we refused to trade our prospects. They do write those... we missed out on Clemens because of Elarton, and we missed out on several deadline deals because Daryle Ward was "untouchable." You answered yourself on that one. Read the newspaper watch the news and you'll hear Purpura make the statement that the Astros aren't interested in mortgaging their future (prospects) for players. Don't act like its never been said. If we're still doing that now, I'd like to know... because NONE of our current minor league prospects should be considered untouchable. I just haven't seen any hard evidence of that. Just becasue you think no one is untouchable doesn't mean the team feels that way. On this issue, I have to defer the dozens of scouts, minor league coaches, minor league managers, and front office guys that are employed and paid by the Houston Astros. If there's not a player in front of them, why are they still in the minors? Well, maybe they just know more than you, me, or the average bbs poster about when a player can be considered ready for the big leagues. Hirsh certainily looked dominant at AAA... but he didn't once he got up here. Maybe they knew something about that. Maybe Pence's very flawwed swing is just too unsightly for the Astros to take a chance. Apparently its you who knows more than I do about baseball period since my opinions are misguided and circumstantial. Honestly, I won't say that all teams are right about every guy... but you said it yourself, the Astros seem to be right about every guy they do promote early. They are wrong on that as well sometimes... they were wrong with Luke Scott last year, and Willy Taveras looks like he may be able to use some seasoning. Where'd you hear that? Why would you think Qualls (who was mediocre in the minors as a starter) would have any more success than Jason Hirsh or Matt Albers? Not to mention that he's still a valuable commodity in the bullpen. Something I heard thrown around amongst friends that have ties to the team. Could be drivel, could be true. The Astros spend money when its justified. They don't spend money blindly like some other teams do. The payroll was what it was this year largely because of Clemens. The payroll was highly inflated due to Clemens (12 million), Bagwell (17 million) and Pettitte (16 million), and I do believe Kent was due one of his payments this year. Their name will be in the mix for Soriano, Lee, Willis, and all the other big names out there. I'd say there's a 30% chance they end up with one of them, and that's being a little optimistic. Sounds like an arbitrary number thrown out there, but I won't call it "misguided". I'd like them to improve over last year as well... I'd like them to compensate for the holes in the lineup (Willy, Everett, Ausmus) with proven bats, as well as compensate for the pitching that needs Pettite/Clemens or equivalents to be somewhat successful. I will, however, be patient... this team is being built around Oswalt and Berkman two guys in their prime, who aren't going anywhere. They should try to be in the position to be flexible year-in, year-out so that they're not locked down with some albatross contracts associated with players who arent' worth it. Sounds like a recipe for winning to me.
No, you said: In other words, "Waaaaa! Waaaaaa! I can post whatever I want you meanie!! Waaaaaaaaaa!" So are you willing to admit that you're wrong (because you are)? Then why do you expect it of someone else? Thanks for calling me names, but you were whining, whether you want to admit or not. It is you who has mistaken whining for the obvious. Nick accurately called your opinion misguided. You responded with the whine above. I responded with the obvious: In other words, don't take this so seriously. I'm just clowning around, and you're just whining.
On 610 this morning, Lance and John were asking Justice about his columns... John said he would have no problem trading for A-rod. Justice continued his assumtion-filled drivel about how detrimental A-rod would be to a clubhouse. John then said Jeff Kent was known to be a bad clubhouse influence before he arrived. Justice then sung Kent's praises from high heavens... said that "when nobody was looking", he used to help the young kids out, and get mad after every at bat he didn't come thru on (apparently he feels A-rod is incapable of emotion, and is a lesser human being than Jeff Kent). John and Lance were like "A-rod a worse person than Jeff Kent? Really?" Justice, now realizing that he may have made some generalized assumptions there that may or may not have been true, then goes to the other reason why you shouldn't get A-rod... "You would have to give up Roy Oswalt, Chad Qualls, and Brad Lidge... at least." John and Lance, wondering what Justice has been smoking this morning, are like "Really? What about a 3-way deal with the Marlins... you give them Pence and Patton, and Dontrelle goes to NY." Justice, suddenly with a optimistic tone in his voice... like he had never heard of a possible 3-way deal before... was like, "really? Pence/Patton?... (mulls it over, knows it might work)... well, the bottom line is that nobody in the Rangers clubhouse wanted to be friends with A-rod after he left." (I don't know if Richard could name 3 guys in the Rangers clubhouse, let alone talk to them in the last week to get their sentiments on A-rod). All in all, not bad for our over-hyped sportswriter, and the "cough" #1 morning crew in Houston sportsradio... basically, an "in-depth" discussion with conclusions that a couple of 13 year olds could have come up with.
Are you kidding? He's the "best" name-dropper in recent memory. Which is precisely my beef with the Chronicle. These guys have both a college education in journalism and access to the game and the people of the game (hence the name-dropping) far beyond what the normal guy has. For this reason, I expect FAR MORE from these guys than the same whiny subjective bullcrap I can get at the water cooler at work or droning on AM610 or 790.
Were you listening when Lance Berkman came on later in the morning? So basically he wants the Astros to focus on pitching (and resign Andy for instance), because they can bring all the bats they want and it won't mean squat if they don't get pitching. When asked about A-Rod, what he thought of him or would he mind if the Astros traded for him, he said Lamb was the only one he knew who'd played with him and Lamb only had good things to say about him - or, er, no negative things to say about him. My memory is crap and I've botched that but basically I got the feeling he wouldn't mind having him.
