Official 2013 Budget/Debt Limit/Obamacare Crisis Thread

Whats funny about all of this is that Republicans went all in and banned earmarks from legislation.

However, that completely backfired since speakers historically have relied on earmarks for leverage over members of Congress.

Now Boehner has no leverage outside of committee assignments which sadly is fairly meaningless since a member of Congress can raise money just fine without sitting on powerful committees. (thanks to super PACs)

 

Yes we see how the government shutdown in 1995 really hurt Bill Clinton's legacy.


Historically battles between the President and Congress usually the President comes out looking better.

 

This time the fight is going to look even worse for the House because they basically let a bunch of nuts ran the whole show.

 

Also, the party that supposedly wants to limit government wasting money cost the economy about $20 billion in GDP. Source In the 90s, the GOP cost tax payers $1.4 billion. Source

Most conservative friends and colleagues disbelieve these numbers. Sadly, I don't think they've learned their lesson. This fight will reemerge in a few months with the same rhetoric and time/money wasted.

 

Thanks Senator Cruz!

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...dnt-exist-democrats-would-have-to-invent-him/

 

Rim, step into their shoes. They are battlefightin' for the American Way just like anti-choice people are defending unborn babies. They don't think they are wrong and they will go down fighting and never retreat.

That's understandable, hell, even defendable. It's the non-true believers in the GOP that can't come around and vote their convictions with the democrats that are the problem. They are the nutless career politicians too scared to lose a primary to actually do their job.

 

David Dewhurst tried to tell you...Ted Cruz once killed a kid.

 

Deal reached in Senate...

http://www.cnn.com/2013/10/16/polit...ign=Feed:+rss/cnn_allpolitics+(RSS:+Politics)

 

Total side note, but Susan Collins just guaranteed her re-election. Her name is stamped all over this deal. She can now say that she's the senator that brokered a deal to save us from default as well as end the shutdown.

Not that Democrats had much of a chance to win that seat but now they definitely have zero chance in hell of ever knocking her off.

 

Thanks to the Republicans for pushing for this temporary delay in the battle -- to be continued in Jan/Feb. Obamacare should piss off enough people between now and then...

 

I don't care what party she's in as long as she's sane and responsible. Collins has typically struck me as meeting both criteria, so more power to her if her state is happy with her.

 

And Cruz pusses out.

Cruz will not delay timing of vote

 

The plan includes a proposal offered by McConnell in the 2011 debt ceiling crisis that allows Congress to disapprove of the debt ceiling increase, which means lawmakers will formally vote on whether to reject of the debt ceiling increase until Feb. 7. Obama can veto that legislation if it passes. If Congress fails as expected to gather a two-thirds majority to override the veto, the debt ceiling would be raised.

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/...iling-default-update-98390.html#ixzz2hu79G8Vl

If the above is true, this is an epic fail by Republican leadership.

 

Bravo! One of your best posts. I don't really see any victory in delaying a battle you started.

 

Have to give it up bigtexxx for his power of positive thinking. I very much doubt that the GOP will be in a better negotiation position when the new deadline comes up.

First, as far as Obamacare goes, the exchanges are a mess right now, but a) chances are they will get patched up enough to be functional, and b) and the vast majority of Americans are actually not going to be personally affected by the exchanges issue because they are getting their healthcare through employer plans, medicare, etc.-- methods that do not require them to actually shop on the exchanges. They'll read about the problems, not be happy about them, but not quite viscerally hating them to demand a repeal or defund come January.

Second, regardless of what happens with Obamacare, I doubt the GOP would want to use the debt ceiling and government shutdown as tools with again to make any demands. The political tactic simply has not been beneficial to the GOP's popularity this time around and doing it a 2nd time isn't going to be helpful to them, either. Any legislation to do anything with Obamacare will have to stand or fall on its own and not be strapped to the debt ceiling or a shutdown. Even if Obamacare isn't popular at that time, the GOP is unlikely to threaten shutdown/default unless the Democrats defund it. They will surely continue fight the Obamacare battle, and the Democrats will continue to say "no" to the GOP proposals and we'll just have to see what the voters have to say come election time.

Finally, if things are as bigtexxx says they are, then why did we go through this crap now? The "clean CR" being discussed by Reid before the shutdown was a short term one anyway. Why didn't the GOP just wait til Obamacare's problems make it unpopular and fight the battle in February 2014 or something?

 

Can someone explain this to me? This is something new that allows the president to veto Congress' disapproval of the debt ceiling raise?

Does this mean, essentially, that from this point forward, congress would need a 2/3 majority to override the presidents veto if they don't want the debt ceiling raised (and the pres does?) Because, if so, this would be huge. Someone correct me if I'm off track.

 

If that is really in there, McConnell just saved the Republicans from themselves. Now they can posture all they want without actually hurting anybody.