Official 2013 Budget/Debt Limit/Obamacare Crisis Thread

Any yet where are your complaints as the GOP CLEARLY played politics with all of this? Got it. Democrats are never allowed to play politics, even though playing politics is the only thing the other side does. You are a tea party shill.

The GOTP shut down the government, and then a few of them went up to WWII vets at the WWII Memorial and started making a scene because the site was closed, citing the Normandy invasion etc. That was the most clear cut, sleazy political thing I have seen in a long long time. It seemed to work, though, as it's got all the usual suspects around here frothing at the mouth.

Listening clips of Fox News hosts talking about the battles of WWII in order to smear the president is downright absurd. It would be hilarious if it weren't so offensive.

 

Great post Bob.

This is right out of the GOP playbook. Draw as much attention away from the train wreck that is their party as possible.

 

The legislative process gives power of the purse to Congress so not 'extortion of our democracy' or whatever the hell that is suppose to mean. Congress is doing as they are suppose to do. Obama is demanding Congress give up this power and rubber stamp everything he wants funded.

Not sure you know what a democracy is.

The Senate has voted on one bill in the past few weeks as opposed to the House's 26. The House seems to be doing their jobs.

in what way has the GOP played politics with this? Most those Congressman where voted in to stop Obamacare and they have even compromised that and offered that it only go unfunded for a year. Even if they did, your argument would still be 'YEah OBama is wasting taxpayer money to **** taxpayers to try and make the Republicans look bad, but Republicans play politics too'. See how stupid that sounds?

 

Typically, a democracy means majority rule. Like the majority in the House that would, currently, vote for a clean CR. Or the majority that reelected President Obama by more than 5 million votes in 2012. Or the majority of Americans who voted for Democrats in the 2012 House elections, only to lose out to gerrymandered districts.

 

no it doesn't

 

This was a law that was passed, signed, affirmed by the Supreme Court and a national election. These congressmen are the problem and they can all go to hell. This sect of the GOP needs to be crushed. Unfortunately, they gerrymandered the districts so well that they are almost invincible, so it's going to be interesting.

It is all politics. They have been doing it for YEARS.

 

So because it was passed you think Obama has the power to decide how OBamacare is funded? Congress loses the power of the purse in this scenario? whys that?

This is fairly standard bullying. Either rubber stamp what we want Congressman or we are gonna punish American people by wasting their taxpayer money inconveniencing them.

 

Boehner could end this tomorrow by bringing a clean CR to the floor. You should call his office and demand he do so.

 

you assume I want it to end. The only thing I want to end is Obama's waste of taxpayer money to inconvenience taxpayers. The House has been trying to stop that alrdy.

 

And I thought that was a US policy all along. Silly me.

 

Then you are part of the fringe and should be ignored.

 

Any other laws you want defunded?

 

LOL! HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA! You have no grasp on what's happening and your post doesn't represent anything at all that has happened especially relating to the shutdown.

Obama has not demanded a rubber stamp to everything he wants funded. All he's asked is that congress fund the govt. at the same level of the sequester which is far from everything Obama wants funded.

Please don't move the goalpost and talk about crap that has basis in the reality of what's been happening.

At least if you want to be taken seriously, because the stuff you're posting isn't serious at all primarily because it doesn't deal with the facts.

 

Convenient edit. How do you reconcile the fact that Republicans control one-half of one branch of government but see fit to paralyze the entire thing? What do you think about the fact that 5 million more Americans voted for Barack Obama than Mitt Romney? That Democrats received 1 million more votes for the House in 2012? That the Supreme Court voted 5-4 to uphold the Constitutionality of Obamacare?

It seems like democracy has spoken. You're the one looking to subvert it.

 

Exactly.

This is my last post to you on the topic, tallanvor, because however much we disagree, I do not think you're a troll. (If I'm wrong, congrats, you got me.)

Extortion is threatening to do an entity harm in an area unrelated to the topic you actually want to influence. "Give me the money or I let the train run over this damsel in distress." Period. Coercion is a mild form, and extortion essentially raises the stakes to violence. If you prefer to say the house GOP is using coercion and economic damage to the whole country is not violent, so be it. I call it extortion (as have others), and I see it as no exaggeration.

To change Obamacare, there is an existing path. Use the legislative process to address Obamacare. Don't threaten the basic functioning of government to address something you have failed to rally the votes to influence. Otherwise, where does this end?

If the house GOP was successful to make some changes this way, where would it end? Why would any group ever settle for anything less than exactly what they want? Why would they try the tedious legislative work of compromise when they can just hold a gun to the weary head of the whole government? Is that the way we want our government to work, lurching from "crisis" to "crisis" for everything from health care, to gun control to abortion, to foreign policy, and on and on? (rhetorical questions all)

 

what edit?

paralyze? 83% of the government is operational. And they control half of the power of the purse. so that is how.

What do you think of all the Congressman voted in to stop Obamacare?

government still functions just fine and they have used the legislative process and then did rally enough votes to influence, that's why they own the House.

Because you live in a democracy and people can vote politicians out. These people were voted in to do this.

 

Oh, you're cute. The majority votes are there, including moderate Republicans, to pass a clean CR. An intransigent minority is now holding up the rule of the majority of the House. Is that how this works?

Good for the Congressmen who voted against Obamacare. Good for them if they want to actually pursue changes to it through legitimate, legislative means. Good for the majority of Americans who voted to reelect the president in what was, largely, a referendum on this law. Good for the majority of the Supreme Court who upheld it. Typically, 51% approval means the other 49% loses and doesn't get to throw a fit until they get their way.

Hypothetically, would you be ok in a reversed situation where a Democratic House refused to fund the government or raise the debt ceiling under a Republican president unless broader access to abortion or universal background checks were made legal?

 

This mindset is what Boehner is trying to deal with -- unfortunately he is too weak of a leader to reign in the fringe radicals that are destroying the republican party.

 

He doesn't really understand the precedent for the future. He thinks this is the last stand to save the country. He doesn't understand the potential consequences of record setting filibusters and one banch of government being able to shut own the government to get whatever it wants.