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Obama/Clinton Tension

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by A_3PO, Jun 28, 2008.

  1. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    Sabotage is a harsh word for me to use. Vanity Fair had a bitter account of 2000. There was tension coming arising from Hillary's Senate bid and the competition for presidential resources, such as fundraising and free press opportunities that came from the Executive stump. Gore's camp claimed Bill found a way to make the presidential campaign about him even when Gore was trying to distance himself away from the President.
     
  2. A_3PO

    A_3PO Member

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    The tension between the camps ain't going away any time soon no matter what Obama and Hillary say in public. It's still early.

    http://nytimes.com/2008/07/09/us/politics/09debt.html

    July 9, 2008
    Obama Donors Aren’t Rushing to Aid Clinton
    By PATRICK HEALY

    A prominent donor to Senator Barack Obama recently sent an e-mail plea to other supporters, asking them — for the sake of Democratic unity — to write checks to Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton to help retire her $23 million in campaign debt.

    Some of the replies are unprintable, given the coarse language, the donor said. A sampling of others included:

    “Why would I help pay off debts that Hillary amassed simply to keep damaging Senator Obama?”

    “Gas prices are up, the markets are in turmoil, my kid’s fall tuition bill is coming soon. Writing checks to politicians I don’t like is not at the top of my list.”

    “Not a penny for that woman. Or her husband. Or — god forbid — Mark Penn,” a reference to Mrs. Clinton’s former senior strategist, whose firm is still owed several million dollars for work that included aggressive attacks on Mr. Obama.

    As Mr. Obama and Mrs. Clinton prepare for their first joint fund-raisers to benefit the Obama campaign, in New York City on Wednesday and Thursday, their two camps are straining under the weight of continued resentments, recriminations and feelings that remain raw since the long primary battle.

    Mr. Obama has asked his top donors to help raise money for her debt, and so far they have come up with less than $100,000 (though more in pledges), Clinton campaign officials said — a “paltry sum,” in the words of one.


    Several Obama donors said in interviews that they were balking at Mr. Obama’s call for help because they believed Mrs. Clinton accumulated most of her debts after she had lost any mathematical chance of winning the nomination and was hanging on only in hopes of an Obama collapse. The idea of helping her now — and lining the pockets of Mr. Penn, a reviled figure in the Obama camp — is galling to them, they said, especially at a time when they say any available money should go to defeating Senator John McCain and the Republicans in November.

    While no other presidential candidate has ever amassed so much personal and campaign debt en route to losing the nomination as has Mrs. Clinton, both Clinton and Obama donors say the larger problem for Democrats is that if the Obama camp is seen as unhelpful, Mrs. Clinton, her husband and their supporters could prove something less than a force for unity.

    Among the complaints from Obama campaign officials is that Mrs. Clinton’s expectation for help has been a moving target; in other words, it is unclear how much money from Obama supporters will be enough to satisfy the Clintons. Even Clinton officials and donors were at a loss to specify a number, saying only that Mrs. Clinton was helping Mr. Obama with the understanding that he would do more for her.

    “There is no lack of emotion among some supporters of both candidates, but what I think the sensible elements of good will are trying to achieve is debt relief for Hillary consistent with getting Barack elected president,” said Steven Rattner, a New York investment banker and leading fund-raiser for Mrs. Clinton, who is working with both camps to help Mrs. Clinton retire her debt.

    The bitterness in the Clinton camp about the primary battle is well known, but several Clinton donors and campaign officials said a deeper issue remained unsettled: The belief — or, perhaps, the perception — that Mr. Obama and his aides are half-hearted in their efforts to help Mrs. Clinton and include her top donors on his leadership team.

    Some of them griped that major Clinton donors were not being invited to crucial fund-raising meetings; were not being made to feel that they would receive credit for helping Mr. Obama win in November; and were not being given titles within the Obama campaign. An Obama aide said it was still early in the integration process of the two campaigns; he also added that the Obama operation was not as title-driven as the Clinton operation, which had various donors serving as “chairs,” “co-chairs” and “Hillraisers.”

    Clinton donors and campaign officials say they remain surprised — and, among some, offended — that Mr. Obama has refused to ask his entire list of donors, more than 1.5 million people, to send $5, $10 or more to chip away at Mrs. Clinton’s debt. (Obama officials said they did not want to distract their donors for the main task at hand, raising money to defeat Mr. McCain.)

    “The Obama effort hasn’t yielded much, but we hope it will increase,” said Alan Patricof, a top Clinton fund-raiser and family friend.

    “I think most people — I can’t say everyone — thinks that helping Barack is the best way to get help from the Obama camp to help retire her debt, which is a major source of concern for her right now,” Mr. Patricof added.

    Mrs. Clinton owes an estimated $12 million to consultants and vendors, like Mr. Penn; she also lent her campaign more than $11 million. That $11 million is listed as a debt, though Mrs. Clinton has told her fund-raisers that she does not expect them or the Obama camp to repay her.

    Clinton campaign officials estimated that the millions owed to Mr. Penn and his team was by far the largest part of Mrs. Clinton’s debt, though they emphasized that the money was not only going for Mr. Penn’s time but also for the services provided by his colleagues and his polling and strategy firm. Clinton officials said they could not provide a breakdown of those amounts.

    “We’re focused on the vendor debts, especially the Kinkos, the truck drivers and the small-business folks who helped us along the way,” said Jonathan Mantz, the Clinton campaign’s finance director.

    Orin Kramer, a leading Obama fund-raiser, said he was working with other members of Mr. Obama’s national finance team, like Frank Brosens and Alan Solomont, as well as Mr. Rattner, Mr. Patricof and other Clinton donors to deal with the debt issue.

    The negotiations between the Clinton and Obama camps are so delicate that it is one of the issues being managed by Robert Barnett, the high-powered Washington lawyer that Mrs. Clinton asked to help structure a political relationship between them for the general election.

    According to several Democrats who have spoken to Mr. Barnett, he has counseled the Clinton camp that honey will work better than vinegar in the debt talks. But Clinton donors say it is an open question whether the Clintons believe they should play hardball — signaling that they will not rally enthusiastically behind Mr. Obama unless he does more on the debt situation — or appear agreeable with the expectation that the money will ultimately come through.

    A crucial test will come at the fund-raisers in New York this week, both sides said. Mr. Obama is expected to ask supporters there to help Mrs. Clinton, and Clinton donors said they were hoping for a great deal more money to come in from people heeding his call.

    The New York events are on behalf of the Obama campaign, his aides said; Mrs. Clinton will not receive a cut of the take, but rather, in theory, benefit afterward from Obama donors who decide to help her. Mr. Obama and his wife have each already written checks for $2,300, the maximum donation, to Mrs. Clinton.

    “Senator Obama and his staff and his supporters are working very hard on debt relief for Senator Clinton, and will continue to in any way that works best,” said Bill Burton, a spokesman for the Obama campaign.
     
  3. glynch

    glynch Member

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    I think this whole tension between the camps thing is overblown. There is really only one camp, the Democratic, Obama camp. A certain percentage of the Hillary voters won't vote for Obama, but the only Hillary camp left is a few of the big money contributors and Hillary campaign staff.

    Though I voted for Obama, I always thought that Hillary received a lot of unjust criticism, much of it based on 20 years of right wing slime.

    However, I can understand how many Obama supportera would not be happy about helping Clinton pay off her debt, a lot of which she ran up after she realistically had no chance.

    I think the Obama camp is wise to leave this repayment to the big money folks if they are so inclined
     
  4. Major

    Major Member

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    This is an under-discussed aspect of this campaign going forward. Nothing to do with the Obama/Clinton tension stuff, but Obama's campaign is financed by a lot of small donors who've been giving what they can. As the economy slides into worse and worse conditions, it seems like this could really affect Obama's fundraising ability. His entire campaign is premised on the idea of having oodles of money to compete in 50 states, have plenty of staff in states like Texas, blanket the airwaves, etc.

    He might not have quite as many resources as he's currently planning on if things keep turning down in the economy. Giving $200 in January was much different than doing so in July.
     
  5. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

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    What does it say about the democratic state of affairs when the Obama camp has to literally bribe the Clinton team, through the form of paying off their campaign debt, to get the Clinton team to help them out? Talk about a forced friendship right there...

    Hilarious to read the Obama voters' responses to the request to help raise money for Hillary. Hardly team players... typical and not surprising...
     
  6. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    Doesn't he have 300 million plus in his warchest? He could raise 1/3 of that going into the general and call it a good effort.

    I'd be pretty disappointed if his campaign managed to land in debt considering that McCain has no chance of overspending him.
     

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