1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Oakland Relocation

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by Marshall Bryant, Jul 22, 2021.

  1. MadMax

    MadMax Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 1999
    Messages:
    74,361
    Likes Received:
    21,604
    Was it? My recollection (which may be off) was that they had attendance issues for years before they finally moved. I may be way off on that, though.
     
  2. mtbrays

    mtbrays Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2007
    Messages:
    7,911
    Likes Received:
    6,800
    From what I've read, the 1994 strike really killed the team and the fans were bitter about losing their best season ever. They also played in one of the worst stadiums in the league (built for the Olympics, not for the Expos) and the Canadian economy at the time had no appetite for funding a new one. MLB also allowed Jeffrey Loria to buy the team, not invest any money into it, and then sell it back to the league (and then win a World Series with the Marlins). Finally, MLB took over the team, forced them to play games in Puerto Rico, and wouldn't allow them to do the same minor league call-ups that everyone else got to do during a pennant race. MLB pissed on the market for 10+ years before moving them to DC.

    It's not unlike what they've allowed to happen in Oakland. The difference is that Montreal is a huge market with the economic ability to support a team compared to Oakland which is a pretty small city whose footprint is cannibalized by the Giants.
     
    MadMax likes this.
  3. Scarface281

    Scarface281 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2009
    Messages:
    8,552
    Likes Received:
    3,179
    The thing about the Bay Area is there's a lot of strong subregional identities, and Oakland/East Bay is one of them. There's about 3M people on the Oakland side and despite attendance they love their As. But what has happened to Oakland is more than just it losing its sports teams. There's been a huge cultural shift, especially in the last 15 years with the movement the tech industry caused. A lot of things that made Oakland Oakland disappeared (aside from crime but I digress).

    The people that moved to the East Bay/Oakland the last 15-20 years don't care about Oakland. SF/Peninsula is the money side. Why the Warriors left. They want to be more associated with the SF brand and people look to SF cultural things/sports. And those that cared about Oakland moved to inland CA or left the state entirely. The military used to have 4 or so bases in the East Bay alone and all have been shut down since the 90s, and those people had become hardcore Oakland people.

    Montreal is a bigger market at 4M people and is a standalone city that doesn't have to share any shine, so they have that going for them but I feel like if Montreal was truly viable market for the MLB to move back to right now the As would have been in consideration. It's better for them to be in a market half the size of Montreal, albeit a semi-glamorous one. Vegas is like a desert Miami at this point.
     
    mtbrays likes this.
  4. Joe Joe

    Joe Joe Go Stros!
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 1999
    Messages:
    24,339
    Likes Received:
    14,432
    Baseball fans in Austiin would welcome a team. Not sure if there are enough of them.
    MLB probably would love having a team in Austin.
    Longhorns have a lot of pull in Austin. If there is an Austin team, it won't be in Austin. Not being in/close to a downtown has been a problem for several teams.

    Round Rock Express was great for me when I worked in Austin and the team was affiliated with the Astros, but I worked in North Austin. Going north and south use to suck in the Austin area and probably still does such that I just don't think an MLB team could work that isn't in Austin. Regarding San Antonio, I just don't know if they have the potential corporate backbone Austin does.
     
    jim1961 likes this.
  5. mtbrays

    mtbrays Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2007
    Messages:
    7,911
    Likes Received:
    6,800
    Awesome post. Having some familiarity with the Bay Area, I think you're spot on. For both Oakland and Montreal, the issues were not as simple as "fans stopped going" because there were a lot of reasons why fans stopped attending.

    I think Las Vegas is a talisman for all of the leagues. Here is the metro population of all areas with at least one team in each of the big four leagues:
    • New York: 19.6M
    • Los Angeles: 12.5M
    • Chicago: 9.5M
    • Bay Area: 7.7M
    • Dallas: 7.6M
    • Philadelphia: 6.2M
    • Miami: 6.1M
    • Washington: 5.5M
    • Phoenix: 4.9M
    • Boston: 4.4M
    • Detroit: 4.4M
    • Minneapolis/St. Paul: 3.7M
    • Denver: 2.9M
    Las Vegas' metro population is 2.2M and its chief economic driver is an industry that none of the leagues would touch 10 years ago. I don't think MLB is putting a team there to build a strong homegrown fanbase; they probably want to be there to attract a large number of visiting fans to every game (thus the lowest-in-the-league capacity for the stadium) and lean even harder into gambling. It's crazy to think that the NBA is going to be the last to the Las Vegas party considering they broke the seal with the All Star Game 20 years ago.

    This is also an argument for why Houston (7.1M) should have a hockey team ;).
     
    MadMax and Scarface281 like this.
  6. Buck Turgidson

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2002
    Messages:
    88,802
    Likes Received:
    87,786
    Hit the MGM sign, win a free stripper?
     
  7. jim1961

    jim1961 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2010
    Messages:
    18,124
    Likes Received:
    14,174
     
  8. Kemahkeith

    Kemahkeith Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2018
    Messages:
    1,512
    Likes Received:
    2,363
    Now that's some between inning entertainment.
    James Harden would be your 1st season ticket holder.
     
    jim1961 likes this.
  9. marks0223

    marks0223 2017 and 2022 World Series Champions
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2007
    Messages:
    11,322
    Likes Received:
    16,116
  10. Hank McDowell

    Hank McDowell Member

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2002
    Messages:
    6,354
    Likes Received:
    10,247
    God I wish Vegas was getting an expansion franchise instead...
     
  11. juicystream

    juicystream Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2001
    Messages:
    29,539
    Likes Received:
    5,661
    I remember like MadMax, but looking back at the attendance, it was basically meh, but went disaster with a terrible team and talk of relocation. Arguably better fan bases than Miami or Tampa. Really hard not to blame Loria and can't believe how he conned his way into millions by basically exchanging the Expos for the Marlins, and then a billion selling the Marlins.
     
    mtbrays likes this.
  12. RKREBORN

    RKREBORN Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2006
    Messages:
    10,209
    Likes Received:
    11,270
    The A's should move to Houston so there can be 2 teams that disappoint me nightly!
     
  13. tinman

    tinman Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 1999
    Messages:
    99,516
    Likes Received:
    42,208
  14. MadMax

    MadMax Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 1999
    Messages:
    74,361
    Likes Received:
    21,604
  15. Buck Turgidson

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2002
    Messages:
    88,802
    Likes Received:
    87,786
    This is going pretty much exactly as I expected.
     
    MadMax likes this.
  16. tinman

    tinman Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 1999
    Messages:
    99,516
    Likes Received:
    42,208
  17. Xerobull

    Xerobull You son of a b!tch! I'm in!
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2003
    Messages:
    33,999
    Likes Received:
    31,774
    Astros relocating to Oakland?
     
  18. Hemingway

    Hemingway Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2016
    Messages:
    6,741
    Likes Received:
    8,950
    And it’s even more of a cesspool of criminals than it ever has been. Rey difficult to have your fan base take their lives into their hand for such a terrible franchise. As a kid I pulled for the ra8ders because of their cool uniforms.
     
  19. MadMax

    MadMax Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 1999
    Messages:
    74,361
    Likes Received:
    21,604

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now