Artest should start imo. Battier isn't anywhere close to the offensive player Artest is, and guess what? Offense is where we've struggled. We really need offense on the floor next to Yao and T-Mac, but more importantly, a guy who can create his own shot.
I think a lot people under rate Ron as a passer. He's shown a great passing touch and he seems to look for Yao a lot under the basket. Most of Yao's easy dunks have come from defenders collasping on Ron and he dumps off the ball to Yao under the basket. Plus being Ron's a good 3pt shooter so teams won't be able to sag onto Yao and double Mac. Ron can also play the post and give Yao a chance to shoot from the elbow which is what Rick is trying to get Yao to do more of. Starter or coming in off the bench Ron will get most of the SF minutes this season and he should because he's our best player at the position.
RArtest for 6th man award imo. I would also be curious as to see LScola off then bench (even though I believe him to be a better all around player then CLandry). Scola can tend to play a better post up game while Landry tends to be a better completer (put backs and such).
You are CORRECT in YOUR observation! Battier who doesn't need the ball as much should be in the starting line up, instead of Artest.In this way Scola can play more efficiently. and T Mac can resume command of the starters.
I don't think we got Artest for him to come off the bench. I think there will be enough ball to go around becasue of the way Rick style of play is. Look at Boston big three did anyone of those guys come off the bench? No. And look where it got them, I believe we can do the same thing.
You're right, I see Ron trying to find Yao all the time during the pre-season. However, is that what you want? Ron should be the go-to guy off the bench. I want tmac, yao, and artest to always be efficient when they are given minutes. instead, if you start all three, you will see 10-12 minutes go by without one of them scoring.
Boston also had nowhere near the overall firepower we have offensively. Who played alongside those Big 3? Perkins? Rondo? Posey? PJ Brown? We have to mesh our Big 3 with Scola, Landry, Alston, Barry, Battier, Brooks, etc... For the sake of balance and getting those most out of each of our Big 3, I do think having Artest coming off the bench would be our best bet. Our problem last year was NOT our [healthy] starting lineup. That group has developed great chemistry together, and allows us to get Yao and T-Mac very involved and going early in the game. A about the 8:00 mark of the first quarter, we can bring in Artest. Early in the 2nd quarter, when we sit T-Mac and Yao, our 2nd group will FINALLY have a big-time scorer and leader, with Landry, Barry, Brooks and whoever else giving him even more ammunition. When the game is on the line, of course we'd roll out T-Mac/Yao/Artest at once.
I don't really see any potential problems down the road...I think our offensive production can mimic the 1991-92 Warriors. This is the offensive production from their top 5 scorers.... 1. Mullin - 25.6 2. Hardaway - 23.4 3. Marciulionis - 18.9 4. Owens - 14.3 5. Higgins - 10.2 92.4 PPG ----- If you look at our roster, we have 3 players averaging atleast 3.5 APG (T-Mac 5.9, Alston 5.0, Artest 3.5) In theory, it wouldn't be far fetched to project an offense like this.... 1. Yao - 24.0 2. Tracy - 22.0 3. Artest - 17.0 4. Scola - 14.0 5. Alston - 12.0 89.0 PPG imo, this ^ seems pretty realistic.
It's not really about having the most weapons out on the floor at the same time. We can't have an overloaded frontline and then come back in the game with a mediocre 2nd line. If we 2 balanced out lines our overly improved bench can come in and punish the opposing team's bench. Has anyone observed Artest's, Tmac's, Yao's and Luis Scola's body language when they are not getting the ball or even passed too. You can see that they are frustrated by not getting to shoot or touch the ball for like 5 minutes. Then they would just start to stand and watch like i saw Tmac stand and watch artest or Yao shoot. I feel the most for Luis Scola because we are paying him chump change and he was the best power forward from Europe and we brought him over to rebound, lick Yao's balls, and defend. It is just not right to treat him like this. My proposed starting lineup is: PG: Rafer Alston SG: Tracy McGrady SF: Shane Battier PF: Luis Scola C: Yao Ming The reason for adding Battier is that he is a unselfish player who doesn't mind not getting touches. We have 2 x Three point threats in Alston and battier. Superstar shooter in Tracy. Best Power forward of Europe, durty worker, defender, scorer Luis. And God Center Yao Ming, who can score down low. Bench Lineup: PG: Aaron Brooks ("Jamaican Blaze") 3 point shooter, slasher SG: Brent Barry ("Oldman" 3 point shooter, pg) SF: Ron Artest ("Ron Ron" tough as nails) PF: Carl Mandry ("Mandry" nuff said) C: Chuckie (whatever)
I disagree. I don't think our firepower is all that great outside of Tracy and Yao. Sure sometimes our role players can have a nice game ever now and than. But I think we need Ron in that starting line-up to help Tracy and Yao out with the scoring load. That was one of our biggest problems last year we couldn't score that well when we needed it most.
McGrady should come off the bench so he can impose his will on everyone else's second-stringers. It would also be easier for him to disappear in the fourth quarter while sitting on the sidelines.
Let me rephrase really. I don't care who starts, but Artest should get significantly more minutes than Battier.
What is this? The whole point of getting a guy like Artest on the team is to get easier shots for Yao, Tmac. Did Boston start one of their big 3 on the bench? No Artest will help the Rockets score early on in the game, he will bring energy and wake Tmac and Yao up, yu can't start him on the bench...
I think most people are missing the point--Because we have so much more depth, it matters a lot less who starts (whatever lineup is working best can finish games--adleman has displayed flexibility in 4th quarter lineups--novak Vs sacramento last year, for example). I also think it's useless to debate who should start until we see a little more of the team in action. We haven't had any version of our regular season starting line up out there in the preseason because of shane and T-macs injuries and alston's...legal troubles. There are advantages to either battier or artest starting...I'll list them here based upon the arguments brooksball and others have been making: Advantages to the Yao/Scola/Battier/T-mac/Alston lineup -Battier is a more deferential player (shares the ball better), which mitigates potential "Not enough ball to go around" issues --allows Artest to be first option of the bench which maximizes scoring opportunities for Yao, Tmac, AND Artest (by reducing overlap in playing time), -spreads the floor better (Battier is a career 39% 3 pt shooter; artest, 33%, which would leave...wait for it..RAFER ALSTON as the best 3 point shooter in our starting lineup) --Artest is the more flexible player (being more able to play small forward) and is thus more valuable as a bench option -And, as a bonus, this lineup did win...um...22 straight games last year. Don't rock the boat. Advantages to the Yao/Scola/Artest/t-mac/Alston lineup -Our offense was too predictable last year--teams knew we were going to Yao or Mcgrady. Artest in the lineup keeps the defense honest and gives more legitimate scoring options. -Artest is far, far more dangerous than Battier with the ball in his hands, making our offense extremely dynamic and, if the offense is run correctly, makes the offensive potential of this lineup pretty much ludicrous. -Allows Battier to anchor a 2nd team that already contains scorers (Brooks, Landry) and provide the court spacing/offensive intelligence to allow the young guns to operate. -avoids potential locker-room issue of Artest being offended by not starting To be honest, I can't really say which of these i like better. Both have a lot of advantages. I will say this--we are lucky to have the opportunity to make this choice. The other reason I won't make up my mind yet is that we have an extremely intelligent coach who makes these decisions for us. Rick responds to what is happening on the floor and isn't afraid to experiment. So how about this: We wait until we see both of these lineups in action (which we will, either because Rick changes starters or because lineups will shift throughout the course of an individual game) and then decide what works best. As fans, we are looking towards june--honestly, i know we're all excited, but which lineup we trot out in late october against the thunder doesn't really matter. We'll see what works. Rick will get it right. Right now, i'll just kick back, relax, and realize that the fact that we have to make this choice is a beautiful, beautiful luxury that any other team in The Association would kill for. /rant
I've been saying it from the day we got him. artest looks at his best when he is the go to guy. there is noway he will be the primary optioon with mcgrady and yao there. best solution is and allways will be is bring him as a super 6th man.he can still get a ton of minutes off the bench but more importantly he will be the main offensive option of the second unit. that way he would get the offense ran through him. it will also mean we wont will into a hole when mcgrady sits like we allways do. He Will also help landry by drawing double teams meaning carl and other bench players will get better looks. battier just brings nothing off the bench.
well, to stir things up, why not put back hayes back on the starting line-up. You will have Yao, Hayes, Ron, Tmac and Alston. You have Battier, Scola and Landry coming into the 2nd unit.
I have noticed and commented on this in a few threads. Scola does not have an ego or a superstar complex. He hasn't complained I dont think he's the type to pout around about his role. Though he does seem to come "alive" when he's counted on more in the scoring, when he can bark at teammates and be the guy to call on, etc... Put Landry or Hayes as the starter then, bring in Scola as the spark or the guy to finish the game. Landry's game is constant I'll dunk on you 3 times or I'll dunk on you 19 times no matter the minutes or period in the game. Still, whats to fear? Put all the talent in that you can and bust some heads, mop the floor with opponents. We can worry about balance after putting up a 19 point lead by the 2nd quarter on people.
I don't know about starting, but Artest is light years better than Battier; not even close. You are comparing an All Star to a "glue" guy. I wouldn't mine seeing them on the floor at the same time on occasion. Both are excellent defenders.
