Nice Racism

Got it. Still nothing to contribute.

 

I'm sorry, Ibram X Kendi only USED to think all white people are racist (per his book). He now thinks people are not actually racists, but racist is a descriptor of actions, so in supporting an action or thought that would lead to "racial inequity" you are undertaking a racist behavior. Since all people engage in such activity, everyone is committing racist (and to be fair, antiracist actions).

I noticed you ignored bestselling author and (per the New Yorker) possibly the most visible expert on anti-bias training as someone of note. Does Mark Lamont Hill count? Again, I don't have a list of what people you consider people of note.

I would say it depends on how one defines systemic racism and how one measures what the majority of the problem is.

I have had no problem in finding people to talk to about racism in history outside of educational settings. Aren't we doing that right here on ClutchFans right now?

I don't recall ever even seeing a confederate flag in person, they are not common where I live. You missed the point though. One reason you don't see people waving Nazi flags around in Germany is that there are penalties for doing so, people have been put in jail for it. There are still neo-Nazis in Germany, of course. They just tend not to waive flags that make them easy targets of law enforcement.

No. Apparently when I said they was nuance, you thought I meant simplistic childishness. The purpose of secession was to protect the institution of chattel slavery, and thus it cannot have been said to be a good thing. The reason political elites in the south supported it was for this reason. Most citizens of the south were not slave owners and gained no particular benefit from slavery. The average Confederate soldier was probably a racist (because almost everyone was a racist at the time), but was more than likely fighting because people were invading his country/state. I am sure there are those in the south today that wave the battle flag of the Army of Nothern Virginia because they are racist and want to signal it to everyone. I am sure there are those that wave it as a symbol of rebelliousness and southern pride and don't give a hoot about skin color. I don't care about the flag, it doesn't factor into my life at all. I am part of the 60% that doesn't think anything about it.

If your point is that there is something wrong with the majority of people not caring a whit about a flag that has no bearing on their lives, I don't think it is a good one. I say let people fly whatever flag they want, and think whatever you like of those that do.

 

I wouldn't call him "mainstream". He got fired from CNN.

Yep. But if you want to overlook the wealth gap ...okay. If money isn't that important, let's just reverse that. bwahahahaha.

Again, it isn't that SOME of us acknowledge it sometimes. Did you miss what happened in Charlottesville?

About 6 years ago, I went to Port Aransas for Spring Break. The day I left, I counted 14 confederate flags in a 1 mile drive. I was in Maine a few years ago, saw them flying there. Went to visit a friend with a place on Lake Livingston, his neighbor was proudly flying one. Was watching TV on Jan 6th .... I could go on.

If you are arguing that the sentiment about the confederate flag isn't very strong, well, I don't know what to say about that.

I didn't know flying Nazi flags in Germany was illegal until now. Noted. In America, flying whatever flag you want is protected free speech. I support that. I don't support white supremacists.

...and by doing so, you ignore the racist white supremacy history, undermine any efforts to dismantle the overt systemic racist policies that were enacted, and enable those white supremacist that still exist. ...and I'm arguing that there in lies the problem.

It's not about the flag. It's about white supremacy.

America was founded on white supremacy. The Civil War was fought to preserve white supremacy. That legacy still lives today. It really isn't any more complicated than that.

 

Doesn't the fact that he worked for CNN kind of undercut your point here. You are pulling a no true Scotsman fallacy.

I neither overlook the wealth gap nor think money is not important. I don't attribute the wealth gap entirely to white supremacy, nor do I think it is likely measurable what amount of it is white supremacy.

You literally said, and I quoted: "he point is that functionally speaking, the history can ONLY be found in educational settings."
Clearly that is not the case. Do you think the ClutchFans D&D forum is some rare mythic bird when it comes to discussing history or racism in non-academic circles?

About 600 racist idiots marched with a permit. Instead of ignoring them, people attacked them and in the ensuing violence one of the racists rammed a woman with his car, killing her. Also two cops somehow crashed their helicopter and died. There was a second Unite the Right rally around a year later which was attended by about 30 people. Do you think that incident somehow means Americans don't talk about or learn about racism outside of academic environments? Racism was constantly talked about on national television surrounding that incident itself. People misquoted Trump as saying the neo-Nazis and white nationalists were very fine people. How could you possibly imagine this supports your argument that history and racism are only talked about in academic settings.

You have seen so few of these flags that you can recall counting each one? I imagined they were far more widespread in the south.

In the quoted passage, I was literally stating a fact of my own experience.

I don't think many people support white supremacists. Racism is generally regarded as bad and looked down on in America. People get fired over a hint of racism.

I guess I don't see the connection between caring about a flag and enabling white supremacy. Do you think if we banned the flag like Germany does that white supremacy would end? Would decrease? I don't think it would have any effect.

You thought the flag was a big deal in the sentence preceding.

I would say America was founded on the principal that all men are created equal and endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights, but tragically that they failed to equally apply that principle.

I would say the Civil War was fought to preserve the Union. The south seceded over the issue of slavery, of which white supremacy was a critical component, but the north certainly could have allowed them to leave.

That a legacy of white supremacy lives today is certain.

 

It is interesting, and I do not doubt that happens. I know that when I take my son (who is 8) out with his uncle and he holds both our hands, white people smile at us a lot and will make comments.... we eventually figured out that they thought we were a gay couple. So I don't mind people having an open conversation.... if white people smiling and being overly nice starts to bother some black people, I would want to know. We need more honesty.

 

Only assholes would think smiling at people is a negative thing regardless of the reason as long as they aren't doing it to because you think they are a charity case.

 

OS is probably the number 1 ********er on all of clutchfans. And that's saying a lot. This clown starts thread after thread and is a ****ing loser.

 

Well that is the question isn't it? Some people do not like to be singled out. I did not say that I agreed with the views expressed, only that if that opinion is fairly common, I would want to know about it.... people should be able to have open dialogue over issues, including race.