If Shaq is such a crappy player, then could someone please explain to me why the opponent's game plan was still geared towards holding Shaq in check and letting Wade play one-on-one most nights? His mere presence opens things up for everyone else, there is absolutely no doubt about that. Wade was the best player in the series, but no way in hell is he able to dominate the way he did if the opposing team wasn't so occupied with limiting Shaq. Finally, basketball is a TEAM sport, it takes all parts working together to win the championship. The man has an incredible resume that trumps that of every other big man in the modern era, whether you like his game or not is completely irrelevant, because he CLEARLY got things done and was one of the best all time at it.
Hey I think everyone misunderstood me...sorry I know Shaq is on a huge decline, isn't the dominate center anymore, and wasn't the main reason Miami are the champs. I am not talking about his off court stuff either. It's my perception of Shaq thats changed after Yao came along. I hated his game when he was the MDC but after watching Yao, I realized that Yao needs to be more and more like Shaq. Yao can never match Hakeem's speed or quickness but one thing he can do is use his size to overwhelm opponents. Like Shaq. So this thread is basically a change in my respect for Shaq's game after watching Yao these years and screaming "DUNK IT" everytime Yao touches the ball. BTW, I am not admiring Shaq's current skills in his old age but his prime.
Wilt was playing against alot of skinny short white guys the majority of the time. He couldnt get the same statline today. Hakeem didnt abuse shaq like many like to think. dream used his quickness on offense to his advantage and Shaq used his power to his. Shaq and Hakeem were about dead even in production when they played but dream had more cunning being a veteran and Shaq a rook. Im not saying Shaq was better but he was as close as you get to the greatest center of all time. career 11.8 boards is pretty awesome. Kareem avg 11.2 Hakeem avg 11.1 Charles avg 11.7 Robinson avg 10.6 Ewing avg 9.8 Russel and wilts numbers are inflated. The Nbas worst centers today would have been ten times better than who they played.Thats why every photo you see them in is against some 6-5 chump.
I didnt see Diop,dampier or Hakeem for that matter expose any defensive weakness in Shaq. Hes held his own on the D end for many years. If I remember correctly he played a big part in stopping Dirka from getting a good shoot,or a shot period down the stretch. he was shuffling his feet on the perimeter and forced a bad decision. Freethrows?see the almighty Wilt
Diop, dampier were mainly big bodies to throw at one huge one, Hakeem just steps out 15' and boom, a Shaq defensive weakness.. Shaq doesn't even come out to Yao's 15 footer, and he's no Hakeem when it comes to footwork and speed. Shaq shuffling his feet on the perimeter is a rarity, so rare, I imagine Dirk's already weak backbone collapsed out of sheer shock at seeing the big lummox lumbering around where he shouldn't be(not by rule, by expectation), along the collectively confused perimeter. Shaq has plenty of defensive weaknesses.... Pick and roll, pick and pop, the mid range jumpshot.. Get in the lowpost, good luck moving that huge body around.. However, put em 1v1 no help, against a center light on his feet with a decent collection of lowpost moves, nay, one who can actually dominate under the basket, and a respectable jumpshot, ala Dream or Yao and that negates that.. Need I remind you all the times our own 7'6 300+ Yao left Shaq flat footed on their match ups? Shaq's defense is on par with Yao's face up drives to the basket on the dribble, rare and in spurts.. Only difference is, Yao doesn't because of his size and lack of quickness, Shaq's only excuse is lack of effort.
How is that an awful comparion? Arguing that Shaq relies completely on his size and that he has no skills whatsoever in the post is the same. Why is it that the Currys, Diops, and Traylors of the league lack his ability to dominate? Shaq was an unstoppable offensive force the first day he came into the league. You can make arguments about his free throw shooting and his pedestrian defensive efforts, but to downplay his obvious talent and ability as "being big" is as fallacious as downplaying Olajuwon's talent as "being quick." This isn't an argument about who's the better overall player. I'd take Hakeem over Shaq too, but I'm not going to deny Shaq's greatness. Shows how much you know. Clearly Willis Reed, Walt Bellamy, and all their other contemporaries were a bunch of 6-5 chumps.
Because, Currys, Diops and Traylors of the league are slow and not tall enough.. I wasn't one of the people slighting Shaq's contributions to the game of basketball. And, I don't think people are saying, "Oh, well, he was just big".. If they are.. they have no defense. I think what they're saying is, Shaq was just good 5' in, simply by possessing the freak mixture of big and quick. You have to admit, Shaq essentially made a fabulous career by bullying himself inside, and dunking or tossing in a 2' baby hook before you saw his feet get off the floor. He faced no center as big as him(we're speaking muscle mass, no Stanley Roberts and Two sammiches please), and only faced ONE center that was as quick on his feet but, without the 'big' part. If Shaq had really taken advantage of his freakish ability, he would've dominated on both ends of the floor. I think that's people's biggest beef with the Shaq, and would've forgiven the horrendous free throw shooting, if he had done just that, and the,"it's the 4th quarter of a tight playoff game, ya know what that means.. Have some gatorade, big fella!".
Yes, Shaq did make a fabulous career of bullying himself inside on offense. I simply don't see why people speak of his bulldozing style as if it were a weakness. If any other player had his strength and athleticism, would he even bother trying to develop a game outside of 5 feet? I doubt it. You use whatever works....again and again if you have to. Frankly, given Shaq's strength, I believe he'd have been just as effective against the great centers that ruled the league before he did. You have to keep in mind, he came into the league in 1992 and DID play against Olajuwon, Robinson, Ewing, etc. while they were in their primes. He was more than capable of holding his own against his predecessors considering he averaged 23/14/3.5 and 29/13/2.9 his first two years. All this talk about how Hakeem "dominated" Shaq in 1995 is pure homerism. Hakeem outplayed Shaq, but didn't dominate him the way he dominated Robinson that year or Ewing the year before.
I thinkwhat should be appreciated by Shaq and what Yao must learn is to play through apparent fould because you are the biggest guy on the court. Thats why Yao must get stronger and tougher to be successful in the league. When Smaller guys push Shaq and foul him which are apperent he keeps coming, until this yr Yao would fade away or give up his position. He should neve give up his spot , never fade and keep punishing guys like a you dominant player. Hell i remember when Hakeem played Denver on yr and scored 48 and didn't go to the ft line one time in the game. Yao is learnig and getting stronger and shouldnt never let Diaw,Dirk or Brian Grant ever guard him in the post. NEVER!!!!
No offense- but to compare dream's NBA IQ talent level and anything else you can think of- he towers over Shaq. And yes the Dream did school Shaq- not just dominate ( I think you may be referring to shattering the back board stuff- which IMHO is not basketball) Not saying Shaq is not a dominant force or has his special place in NBA history etc- but to say that he dominated on NBA skill level is just a bunch of ................
Mention Hakeem and anyone else in the same breath on this board and expect someone to take a bit of offense. Never mind that I explicitly stated I'd take Hakeem's career over Shaq's two posts ago. How dumb of me to expect people to actually read my post and understand it instead of simply assuming someone's bashing Hakeem Olajuwon. What the hell does a shattered backboard have to do with anything? I'm talking about the Finals meeting between the two. Our team dominated the Magic in that series (as a sweep would imply), but Hakeem did not dominate Shaq. Neither of them were capable of stopping the other that year. I believe Hakeem outplayed Shaq, but it wasn't domination a la Robinson in the WCF. So you're saying he didn't dominate on the NBA level? Wait...has Shaq actually been playing in the NBDL all these years? Silly me, I should've known better.
I hated Shaq when he was on the Lakers but he has become one of my favorite players since joining the Heat. He never complains about calls and he says some pretty hilarious stuff. "Erica Dampier"- I love that.
Sure would've helped him remain dominate for a few more years. Would've also helped lessening the predictable, "let him get position, wait till he get's the ball, hack em!". And, made him atleast more involved in the 4th quarter of games. The problem has always been that Shaq was dominant, but, he wasn't unbeatable. You can't be 2nd fiddle at the most crucial moment of a game and be considered unbeatable. Utilizing his height, bulk and explosiveness off the floor, defensively, would've worked... again and again... but he didn't use it. Olajuwon is about the only 'great' of those three. Even if he didn't make Shaq lose his jockstrap on the hardwood ala Robinson, you yourself admit he outplayed him.
Hakeem and Shaq are more similar than dissimilar. Both are the most physically gifted centers, probably basketball players in general, since the 80s if not longer. Since the 80s (maybe before) there has been no individual who is 7 feet plus who carries 300lbs plus easy who moves like Shaq. He is the strongest skilled player of his generation by a mile. Now in the Dream, we have never seen a 6'10-11 guy who is among the strongest players in the league (not as strong as Shaq, but stronger than 90% of his opponents) who had guard like quickness and reflex. Both of them also refined their back to the backet offensive games to maximize their phenom natural abilities and became the best players in the league at their peak because of it. So yes, my own opinion is Shaq and Hakeem have a lot more in common than they have differences. Just because Hakeem was quicker (but Shaq was still very quick for a C), Shaq was stronger (but Hakeem was still very strong for a C), and Hakeem developed his low post game further out doesn't discount that. Basically Wilt, Hakeem and Shaq are probably the most physically blessed big men to ever play, just their mix of strength, size and quickness were different. But don't discount all their natural abilities to being absolutely central to their success, we are not talking Ben Wallaces. I don't make a big difference in their BB IQS. Both players certainly had enough BB IQ to work to their strengths and lead their teams to lots of championships. But Hakeem was no Bird, Magic, Stockton or Barkley in court vision--we saw this against Seattle, but Hakeem did kill you in combinations of individual skill and raw athletic ability just like Shaq did in his prime.
They are drastically different players with drastically different styles. Shaq is much bigger, stronger, and has quick leaping ability. Yao has more touch, more finesse, and his lower body is much more strong than his upper body. While he has improved in this area, he's never going to be the beast that Shaq is. Thus, he'll never dink on people as Shaq does. We should all stop expecting it. It just won't happen. Yao has his moments, he has his nasty dunks, but he also has a beautiful array of post moves, some really nice creativity, and a great midrange game. Hey, he can shoot free throws to boot. But yet we grimace at a lack of "Shaq-like" dunks and intimidation. If we had Shaq, we'd grimace at his lack of shooting touch, his lack of any effective post move (besides a jump hook) and his free throw shooting. A fadeaway is largely effective, especially when you are a tall player, because it's almost impossible to block. A fadeaway shot does not translate to being passive, unathletic, etc. A fadeaway can be a very aggressive move, and a very demoralizing move to the defense, who can't touch it. It's not used as a matter of NEED. No, mostly, Yao doesn't NEED to shoot a fadeaway over a smaller player. But Yao has a great fadeaway. He should use it early and often. Hakeem used this often. Ewing had a nice fadeaway. Dirk has a beautiful fadeaway. I hate to mention is, but Karl Malone had a very effective fadeaway. So did MJ. No matter who was on them, they often went to this staple move. I think we got a glimpse of Yao's mean streak in the last quarter of the season. He can shoot fadeaways ALL DAY long with Earl Boykins on him if he'd playing like that. Yao will never be like Shaq, he will never play like Shaq. He will never have 24 inch biceps.......he will never bring a goal down, or break a backboard. But hopefully he will break the backs of his opponents.....his own way.
It's not a black issue. It's a Shaq issue. The man has a history of coming back from the off-season pudgy and out of shape, at least by NBA standards. To his credit, he didn't do that this past off-season... so that criticism is no longer valid unless and until he comes back at the start of this coming season pudgy and out of shape again.
Shaq didn't have a reliable jumpshot because he didn't need one. He overpowered players on the post through power and brief flashes of speed. Early on, his jumpshots were lower percentage and ugly, ranging from a baby hook and a snake looking throw after a spin. He was quick for a guy his size, as evidenced by burning lanky centers like Bradley and the quick dunks against coaches who used Hack-a-Shaq. Also, his court vision and passing was underrated. He knew how to feed his teammates on the double and he wasn't that bad rebounding the ball and throwing it for the fast break. It's why role players side with a center like Shaq or Hakeem. He makes them famous whereas a guy like Wilt would've taken opponents on by himself. You can't really fault the work ethic with a guy of his size and the numbers he gets. A 300 pound 7 footer is rare in a league supposedly led by quickness and finess. People make it sound like he was supposed to dominate, like Stanley Roberts was supposed to dominate out of LSU, or maybe Pig Miller was supposed to dominate on the court like a buffet. Sure, he hovered around being overweight by staying around 320 pounds in the offseason, but getting those numbers he got makes the feat even more impressive. As for the competition, it has to be considered with his legacy, but it isn't his fault in particular. Anyways, I wasn't a Shaq fan until I saw the Lakers play every season since the Jones-Van Exel-Ceballos era. His help defense is limited because of his bulk (the reason his teams would get swept on the pick and roll), but the effort was mostly there. His play exemplified the concept of teamwork in the NBA. He'd cry and joke in the press, but on the court you'd want him to be on your side than the other.
