1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

New York Times Article about Houston schools

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by SLA, Aug 28, 2003.

?

Did you go to college?

  1. Yes

    28 vote(s)
    84.8%
  2. No

    5 vote(s)
    15.2%
  1. SLA

    SLA Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2002
    Messages:
    3,021
    Likes Received:
    0
    August 28, 2003
    For Houston Schools, College Claims Exceed Reality
    By DIANA JEAN SCHEMO


    OUSTON — At Jack Yates High School here, students had to make do without a school library for more than a year. A principal replaced dozens of experienced teachers with substitutes and uncertified teachers, who cost less.

    And yet from 1998 to 2002, Yates High reported that 99 percent to 100 percent of its graduates planned to attend college.

    Across town, Davis High School, where students averaged a combined SAT score of 791 out of a possible 1600 in 1998, reported that every last one of its graduates that year planned to go to college.

    Sharpstown High School, a high poverty school that falsely claimed zero dropouts in 2002, also reported in 2001 that 98.4 percent of its graduates expected to attend college.

    "Absolutely, positively, no way," said Larry Blackmon, a Yates parent and alumnus who knows graduates without the means or plans to go to college. "You'd get more of an accurate count asking elementary kids if they plan to go to college."

    The glowing figures on students who plan to further their education are part of a broad set of statistics Houston school officials submitted to state authorities, figures that painted a wildly optimistic picture of what has been going on in Houston schools over the past few years.

    A recent state audit of the Houston schools found vast undercounting of high school dropouts. The figures on college plans suggest that on yet a second measure, Houston put forth data that bear small relation to the hard reality most students face.

    The college data, unlike the dropout data, does not affect the Houston school system's performance rankings. It is used largely for research purposes. But critics say that like the dropout data, it reflects a tendency to inflate success by the system that sent Rod Paige, its former superintendent, to Washington, where, as education secretary, he is now the nation's top school officer.

    At Davis High, for instance, comparison with test scores and records from the Higher Education Coordinating Board, which tracks students who enroll in public colleges and universities in Texas, suggested that not 100 percent, but less than half of Davis's 1998 graduates enrolled in the state's two- or four-year institutions of higher education, which generally absorb the great majority of college-bound graduates, particularly from poorer high schools.

    In a written statement, Terry Abbott, a spokesman for the Houston school district, refused to explain the high numbers of students reported to be planning to go to college and said only that the figures came from "surveys of students." Requests for interviews with principals and with Kaye Stripling, the current superintendent, were refused. Dr. Paige also declined to answer questions.

    Some former principals in Houston said they did not know why the data was collected, while others thought, mistakenly, that it was used by parents shopping for schools for their children. Given the emphasis here on judging school performance by statistics, principals said, underlings most likely made up the figures to look good — without fully understanding their use.

    "I'm very skeptical of 99 to 100 percent," said Robert F. Worthy, who stepped down as principal of Yates this spring, after four years. "In fact, I'm almost certain we didn't have those numbers."

    Another former principal, who asked not to be identified for fear of reprisals, contended that lower-level administrators inflated their figures in the hope of attracting the children of active, involved parents. More students also mean more money from the state. On paper, her school claimed that almost all of its graduates were headed for college. In fact, the principal said, most of them "couldn't spell college, let alone attend."

    Not all schools submitted numbers that strain credibility, and some have put forth more modest estimates after years of sky-high claims.

    Parent advocacy groups contend that the district's statistics on college plans — however they are gathered — should rely on some indicator, like transcripts requested or students taking college entrance exams, to have any meaning.

    But George Scott, an online education columnist who has written widely about Texas, said the soaring numbers were no accident. He said claims that most students planned to attend college were of a piece with another claim the state makes — that the majority of Texas high school graduates are ready for college-level work.

    "Why would any self-respecting person allow this to go out when it's clearly not true?" Mr. Scott said.

    To gauge the disparity between the portrait painted by Houston and the reality graduates face, The New York Times compared the district's figures on college plans with test scores and state data on college enrollment.

    While Yates, for example, said all of its graduates in 2000 planned to attend college, only a third of its seniors took the state's most popular college entrance exam, the SAT, reaching a combined average score of 763. According to the state's Higher Education Coordinating Board, fewer than 50 percent of Yates's graduates that year took any credits at state colleges or universities.

    Matthew Rivera, a 1999 graduate of Worthing High School here, said that most of his classmates probably hoped to attend college. But for many of them, the encounter with higher education proved brutal.

    "Getting into college is not hard at all," Mr. Rivera said. "Staying in is hard." Mr. Rivera and two of his friends, Worthing classmates, began college in 1999. Only one graduated this spring.

    A look at scores on tests other than the Texas Assessment of Academic Skills suggests that Mr. Rivera and his friends were not alone in their lack of preparation.

    The year they graduated, the average combined SAT score of Worthing's seniors was 794. When in the 11th grade, the class of '99 scored in the bottom 40 percent of students nationally on the Stanford 9 achievement test in virtually all subjects .

    According to state figures, 143 graduates from Worthing's class of 1999 enrolled in public colleges or universities in Texas; 166 did not. That year, however, Houston reported that 95 percent of Worthing's students planned to go to college.

    Mr. Rivera plans to attend vocational courses in radiology this fall, which he hopes will help him land stable employment at a decent salary. He now holds down three jobs, one as a waiter.

    Ashleigh Blackmon, a graduate of Yates in 2002, said she did not for a moment believe all her classmates were planning on college but was not sure her school's claims did any harm.

    "It doesn't mean anything, because who cares?" she said, and then paused. "But it could mean they lie about a lot more of other things."
     
  2. MadMax

    MadMax Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 1999
    Messages:
    73,595
    Likes Received:
    19,939
    if i'm reading this correctly, this is concerning HISD schools only...right??
     
  3. mrpaige

    mrpaige Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2000
    Messages:
    8,831
    Likes Received:
    15
    Of course, part of the problem is the question itself.

    If I ask a high school senior if he intends to attend college, he might honestly answer yes and then not attend college that Fall after high school graduation.

    For all I know, his plan is to attend college at some point in the future.

    I also don't think you can count on SAT tests when many community colleges don't request them. If going to El Centro is my only option, I probably wouldn't bother with the expense of taking the SAT.

    And, I know a good many people who do tell people in power what they want to hear. When I was in high school, there were many people who weren't immediately college-bound who would've told guidance counselors they were college bound because they didn't want to hear the lecture of how important college is or didn't want to seem like someone who wasn't smart enough for college or whatever. Asking people to self-indentify can often lead to a bias in the survey.

    While I'm sure the question was asked that way in order to give a specific impression that's better than reality, I don't know that we can immediately say the schools themselves are lying or massaging the stats.

    But maybe they are (I do know drop out numbers are counted in a very odd way in order to effectively undercount the number of students who drop out).
     
  4. Major

    Major Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 1999
    Messages:
    41,428
    Likes Received:
    15,860
    HISD is having major, major problems with some of their reporting to the TEA over the last several years (especially with regards to dropouts). Their numbers are all garbled - in some cases, purposely, I think. They are in some trouble with TEA right now from what I understand.
     
  5. rimbaud

    rimbaud Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 1999
    Messages:
    8,169
    Likes Received:
    676
    Hilarious...gives me such pride. Too bad only about 35-40% even graduate. Apparently, though, SHS will no longer be a school in a year or so, it will become more like a halfway house or something.

    On a side note, Houston (ISD) was propped up during election 2000 as a success story due to low dropouts and the like. Too bad it was almost all doctored.
     
  6. Major

    Major Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 1999
    Messages:
    41,428
    Likes Received:
    15,860
    On a side note, Houston (ISD) was propped up during election 2000 as a success story due to low dropouts and the like. Too bad it was almost all doctored.

    Yep ... and it all happened under the leadership of the current US Secretary of Education (Rod Paige), who was at the time HISD Superintendent, I believe.
     
  7. rimbaud

    rimbaud Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 1999
    Messages:
    8,169
    Likes Received:
    676
    You are correct on both accounts. Paige has been a loser in just about everything he has done, yet Bush makes him friggen education secretary. It tells you something when HISD teachers responded, "well, at least he won't be here anymore." That, and the district began efforts to scrap the TAAS...yet another year 2000 "success story."

    I am surprised this came out at all, though...it had been known for years. Paige probably doctored school records himself.
     
  8. mateo

    mateo Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2001
    Messages:
    5,953
    Likes Received:
    261
    ...which is why I will bankrupt myself sending my kids to private school
     
  9. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2003
    Messages:
    58,937
    Likes Received:
    36,499
    Bush intentionally appointed Page in order to prove that affirmative action doesn't work...and it doesn't get you votes either.
     
  10. MadMax

    MadMax Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 1999
    Messages:
    73,595
    Likes Received:
    19,939
    i understand that concern..but there are good public schools in this city...schools that send well over 90% of their students to 4 year universities.
     
  11. ima_drummer2k

    ima_drummer2k Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2002
    Messages:
    35,653
    Likes Received:
    7,641
    Yep. Clearly, this is all Bush's fault.
     
  12. Pole

    Pole Houston Rockets--Tilman Fertitta's latest mess.

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 1999
    Messages:
    8,503
    Likes Received:
    2,628
    rimbaud.....did you attend SHS?
     
  13. rimbaud

    rimbaud Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 1999
    Messages:
    8,169
    Likes Received:
    676
  14. Pole

    Pole Houston Rockets--Tilman Fertitta's latest mess.

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 1999
    Messages:
    8,503
    Likes Received:
    2,628
    me too......long time ago.

    Of course, I'm getting senile, so we may have discussed this before.
     
  15. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2003
    Messages:
    58,937
    Likes Received:
    36,499
    yeah, it is.:rolleyes: you're:rolleyes: exactly:rolleyes: right.:rolleyes:
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now