1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

My experience, please feel free to bash

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by bobmarley, Nov 16, 2015.

  1. bobmarley

    bobmarley Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2003
    Messages:
    6,489
    Likes Received:
    318
    My personal "feelings" are that OUR GOVT should not accept unless there is a better process to vet them. No matter what you are saying there is little to no control over what happens with some of them once they enter the country.

    Now in my "actions" if I was living in the states and our GOVT decides to open up wide and accept refugees of course I would do my best to help and share the Gospel with them as well as try and get to know them. My feelings about what our GOVT should do does not change how I would act toward them once they are in.

    It seems like there is this argument going around that if you are a Christian if you are not for them coming you don't love them. That's not the case. Once they are here I will do what is called of me by my Lord to be salt and light. The same goes for Somali refugees here in Kenya. I have gotten to know several of them and have shared the Gospel with them.

    But back to what they GOVT should do. Check this...

    Alabama Senator Jeff Sessions, Chairman of the Subcommittee on Immigration and the National Interest, has identified at least 26 instances in which foreign-born individuals inside the U.S. were charged with or convicted of terrorism in the last year or so.

    Here's a sampling of incidents from that list:

     
  2. JeopardE

    JeopardE Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    7,418
    Likes Received:
    246
    See, the problem is that most Americans are divorced from the actual experience of immigration into the United States, and thus are prone to assumptions of false equivalence.

    As an immigrant myself, I hear these hysterics about how ISIS will smuggle in terrorists posing as refugees and they just don't make sense to me. The more I think about it, the more absurd they are.

    Listen: it is FAR, FAR easier to visit the US as a tourist than to be an immigrant of any kind. I know, because I've been there. I remember the days when my immigrant petition was ALREADY approved, but I didn't have a green card yet, so every time I traveled out and had to come back in, I would sit for 3 hours in a small secondary processing room waiting to be grilled/interviewed. And I would watch tourists breeze by with a 1 minute "what are you here for, how long are you staying, stamp! welcome" and they head on out -- free to buy some guns and ammo (as easy as they are to get in this crazy land) and shoot up the nearest movie theater if they felt like it. I had lived in the US already for 13 years, and yet I underwent so much scrutiny. Multiple fingerprints, background checks up the wazoo. It took many years before I finally got a green card.

    It would be insanely stupid for a terrorist to attempt to enter the USA as a refugee. Then consider that many of these guys already have French/Belgian/German passports and don't even need to apply for a visa to visit.

    This whole argument is nuts. But nuts is exactly what you come to expect from the right in modern day America, unfortunately.
     
  3. JeopardE

    JeopardE Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    7,418
    Likes Received:
    246
    I'll respond to you too, bobmarley. It's simple.

    There is a huge difference between combating radicalization of muslim immigrants already living in the USA and screening incomings.

    I'd say the first is a much more daunting task for US officials than the second, because they are already pretty darned good at border control (and they got insanely good at it after 9/11).
     
  4. bobmarley

    bobmarley Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2003
    Messages:
    6,489
    Likes Received:
    318
    Have you been through the refugee process before? If not then your own argument defeats your own argument.

    You are mixing up the Syrian refugee process, which isn't a bit different than many other refugee processes before it, with your experience of immigrating.

    I also enjoy your swipe at the 2nd amendment you casually threw into your argument.
     
  5. bobmarley

    bobmarley Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2003
    Messages:
    6,489
    Likes Received:
    318
    Even the heads of the FBI are claiming to not be able to thoroughly vet the refugees that are coming in. Do you think it would be that big a deal to ISIS to throw a handful of recruits into the process and not worry even if they were picked up in the process.

    For example the mastermind of the Paris attack was IN PARIS when the Intelligence community thought he was still in Syria. That is a big problem. Another issue is if the sneak into European countries and get passports and then travel to the US they can get in easy as well.

    I don't think you realize what a massive undertaking vetting 10,000 people is. Let alone the other 100 k they want to bring in by next year.
     
  6. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2001
    Messages:
    43,732
    Likes Received:
    25,661
    That's the easier way. Refugee is one of many points of entry. They have lots of money, and our system tends to open up when money's being thrown at it.
     
  7. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2002
    Messages:
    34,922
    Likes Received:
    34,238
    I hope you all realize that screening Syrian refugees and finding ISIS sleeper cells would both be easier than changing mr marley's mind on any topic whatsoever or even getting him to see your points of view, right? But do carry on.
     
  8. bobmarley

    bobmarley Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2003
    Messages:
    6,489
    Likes Received:
    318
    I like this, haha.

    http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/u...-honduras-with-fake-passports/article/2576672

    U.S.-bound Syrians detained in Honduras with fake passports
     
    #88 bobmarley, Nov 18, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2015
  9. CometsWin

    CometsWin Breaker Breaker One Nine

    Joined:
    May 15, 2000
    Messages:
    28,028
    Likes Received:
    13,046
    Is that a joke? Seems like an awful selective view of when that should be the case.
     
  10. Kwame

    Kwame Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2007
    Messages:
    5,756
    Likes Received:
    333
    You haven't done a scientific study or any type of real research on this issue. What you have provided us is anecdotal at best. States always have legitimate security concerns, but it seems like your rhetoric is couched in xenophobia/Islamophobia. Restricting immigration and closing borders wouldn't seem to have prevented the bombings in France. The mastermind of the attacks in Paris was European having been born in Belgium.
     
  11. bobmarley

    bobmarley Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2003
    Messages:
    6,489
    Likes Received:
    318
    While anecdotal, heck I even put it was my experience in the thread title, it doesn't change MY mind on this issue. Please tell me more about being xenophobic and Islamaphobic, because that is an argument that will not affect me, I know how I feel about others. I chose to love others so much that I have moved my family to developing country to train local Christian leaders and help them establish new churches. So because it wouldn't have stopped one attack, it won't stop any others, got you, great evidence.

    Seriously some of the talking points that the opposition have are so shallow and reheated it is down right shameful.
     
  12. bongman

    bongman Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2002
    Messages:
    4,213
    Likes Received:
    1,411
  13. bongman

    bongman Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2002
    Messages:
    4,213
    Likes Received:
    1,411
    Romans 12

     
  14. bobmarley

    bobmarley Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2003
    Messages:
    6,489
    Likes Received:
    318
    Are you saying this is how the GOVT should treat the refugees?
     
  15. okierock

    okierock Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2001
    Messages:
    3,120
    Likes Received:
    186
    Making certain you screen the bad actors from the refugees is "good" for the rest of the refugees.
     
  16. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2002
    Messages:
    46,550
    Likes Received:
    6,131
    What should Zeus do?
     
  17. bobmarley

    bobmarley Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2003
    Messages:
    6,489
    Likes Received:
    318
  18. Deji McGever

    Deji McGever יליד טקסני

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 1999
    Messages:
    4,012
    Likes Received:
    950
    I think what's lost in all of this is that Syria is one of the most secular countries in the Middle East, and many of these refugees are educated and from the civil service. They are fleeing religious extremists to come to the secular US, where they are seeing doors slammed by America's self-righteous and hypocritical Amen Brigade.
     
  19. okierock

    okierock Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2001
    Messages:
    3,120
    Likes Received:
    186
    The left sure does like to deal in absolutes...

    Making certain (to our best ability) that we are not bringing terrorists into our country seems like a fairly reasonable path to me. The opposition to the refugees is just a lot of people questioning the system to make certain we are doing everything we can to keep our citizens safe. This is a pretty important role of government.

    The left and the media just want to make it about hate and racism and bigotry and any other divisive idea that will keep our citizens divided and weak.
     
  20. bobmarley

    bobmarley Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2003
    Messages:
    6,489
    Likes Received:
    318
    Some estimates have been nearly 77% of refugees are young able bodied men. Their country is experiencing a civil war and is filled with extremist organizations from all sides not just ISIS, and we that want to be sure we are not letting in people who may harm American citizens are somehow xenophobic bigots. Right up the rules for radicals playbook. The problem is people have grown old of the rhetoric of the left and the outrage machine they push. This is a National Security situation.

    Well said...
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now