1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

My Age Requirement Proposal/Workaround

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by emjohn, Jun 9, 2009.

?

Allow a very few HSers to go direct to NBDL and increase college commitment to 2 yrs?

  1. Yes!

    7 vote(s)
    15.6%
  2. Maybe?

    7 vote(s)
    15.6%
  3. No way

    15 vote(s)
    33.3%
  4. I'm confused

    16 vote(s)
    35.6%
  1. emjohn

    emjohn Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2002
    Messages:
    12,132
    Likes Received:
    567
    I rarely hide my disdain for the farce that is NCAA "student-athletics" when it comes to major programs.

    I'm sick of the deceit and fraud, of the phony SAT scores, the lower standards for admission, the under the table pay, the continued fraud to keep the player academically eligible, etc. I'm well aware this does not apply to even 80% of players out there. My focus is centered on the very few. Those that would NEVER attend college otherwise - not for a lack of means, but a lack of desire and/or a lack of aptitude. The ones that don't stick around long enough to declare a major, the one & done prepsters that went to 5 high schools and are only going to college because it's the NBA Draft's unofficial SAT.

    I'm equally perturbed at the NCAA's happy exploitation of unpaid (sorry, room & board & sham education paid) cash cows. It's not out and out slavery, but it's still a greedy exploitation.

    Currently, the NBA flatly refuses to allow players to jump into the league from high school. I understand their concerns - general maturity (financial and on the court), the wash out rate, the perceived disincentive it gives for hopefuls to bother academically in high school, etc. All valid. But why disallow a LeBron James or Amare when they can perform at an All-Star level out of the shoot?

    This year saw Brandon Jennings break the ice and jump to Europe to get around the NBA's age requirement. Personally, I applaud him. Tennis players are free to cash in once they're ready. Golf players as well (burn out in both sports duly noted). In neither case are the prodigies forced to go through a make-believe college education first.

    We don't force soldiers to go through a couple of semesters of colege before sending them to front lines and die. Don't look me in the eye and tell me that basketball players can't shoot hoops for cash unless they take Intro to Modern Journalism first.

    I also don't feel that the pretend student athletes help the NCAA. Yes, obviously the most talented guys in the world draw ratings - but aren't the 1&Doners hurting the sport? People that love the NCAA and loathe the NBA will always talk about it being about more "pure", about seeing players pour their hearts out for the love of the game, about seeing real team play instead of the NBA's iso-ball. The 1&D's eat away at that. They aren't interested in being coached, they're interested in gaining exposure and impressing pro scouts. Programs get sanctioned when it comes to light that a player was being paid and/or faking half his test scores.

    There's more than enough talent in college if you remove the 1&d guys - you're only looking at 3 to 5 guys per year. You allow programs to be more cohesive, you increase team emphasis, there is increased continuity year to year, etc.

    What I propose:
    The NBA and NCAA agree that players that sign a college commitment are ineligible to enter the draft for two years. No other changes to the age requirement (i.e. 19/one year out of HS)

    The NBDL hosts a summer camp/summer league where accepted applicants (high school sophmores, juniors, and seniors) are provided room and board but not pay and remain college eligible. The camp advises players as to their readiness for the NBDL or NBA.

    The NBDL is permitted to try out and sign draft ineligible players, minimum age of 18 or 17 if graduated HS. Only one such player may be signed per team per year. Signed players are free to sign agents and pursue marketing deals while in the NBDL. Signed players may enter the NBA Draft one year out of high school if they choose.
     
    1 person likes this.
  2. Prince

    Prince Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2009
    Messages:
    5,375
    Likes Received:
    161
    Allow them to join or get contracts but to be able to play in the regular games, they need to be of legal age.
     
  3. emjohn

    emjohn Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2002
    Messages:
    12,132
    Likes Received:
    567
    Cliff Notes version:

    Allow the NBDL to sign a restricted number of high schoolers (no more than 1 for each of the 16 teams) that aren't looking to do college and are pro ready.

    College players must stay in school for 2 yrs minimum instead of 1.

    Players have an opportunity to be paid for their talents, unlike in the NCAA.

    The number of recruiting and academic violations/shenanigans in the NCAA decreases.

    The NBDL talent base increases and becomes more worthwhile to go see.

    The NCAA becomes more team focused.

    Prepsters that make the leap to the NBDL receive better training for the pros, including life maturity while living the minor league lifestyle.

    It's a baby version of the baseball model, and I think it would be of great benefit to all 4 parties (prepsters, NCAA, NBDL, NBA).
     
  4. juicystream

    juicystream Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2001
    Messages:
    29,375
    Likes Received:
    5,513
    The minimum age for the NBDL is 18 already. HS players can choose to play one season there before joining the NBA. David Stern said it is an option for players that do not go to college.
     
  5. Omer

    Omer Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2006
    Messages:
    3,933
    Likes Received:
    56
    Pretty unique/innovative idea but a bit complicated.

    Nicely thought up though.
     
  6. Honey Bear

    Honey Bear Contributing Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2006
    Messages:
    5,102
    Likes Received:
    555
    Golf and tennis are not team sports where the development of one player affects the entire organization. If you're looking at exceptional players like Amare and LeBron who are physically ready for the NBA straight out of high school, one year of college is a time where they can work on their game and look forward to as an experience.

    Watching NCAA basketball is for losers who want to equate American values to a team sport. No guy is bigger than the team; know your game and play within it; play hard and never give up; take advantage of the opportunities given to you; etc. It's not fair to keep top-flight individual talents oppressed for 2 full years, 1 year is a good amount of time to let them develop their game while giving them a taste of college life.
     
  7. emjohn

    emjohn Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2002
    Messages:
    12,132
    Likes Received:
    567
    Obviously I didn't know ~ THANKS!
     
  8. smoothie

    smoothie Jabari Jungle

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2001
    Messages:
    20,716
    Likes Received:
    6,945
    beat me to it!

    but my question is why do we see an increase of high schoolers go overseas rather than the nbdl? i can imagine it's only for one reason. money. they get paid to be a pro overseas in regular season games that are more meaningful than nbdl playoff games.

    how much is an nbdl contract worth? is it a flat rate, or is there a minimum and a maximum a player can earn?
     
  9. Samar

    Samar Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2003
    Messages:
    1,407
    Likes Received:
    8
    You seem to be doing a good job of taking in to account everything but the most important thing. What do the players want?

    You are a guaranteed top 10 talent in the draft coming out of high school, but you have to wait a year. What do you do?

    A) Spend a year in the D-league where you get paid near minimum wage to play against other relatively talented players, BUT you get no EXPOSURE. You are a no one to everyone but NBA scouts. Not to mention you have to get a 2nd job at McDonalds. Since no one knows you, they aren't going to just pay you to smile on camera.

    B) You go to Europe. Alright, now you are getting paid. But you have ****ty facilities. You have a little more exposure than the D-league, but most people, even in Europe are not going to know who you are.

    Oh well, at least you get to play and develop your game, right? Wrong, you are now playing behind talented players who have been there for a while and know the system. So unless you are the next Lebron, Amare, KG you are not going to be getting much playing time. Coach is trying to develop the players he knows will be around next year, not waste time on you.

    C) You are a conformist and don't care about working for "the man" or getting exploited, so you choose COLLEGE. Oh wow, you have great facilities. The school is spending millions on your training and development. You are getting plenty of playing time. A few rookie mistakes? Don't worry about it, just play through them. As long as you work hard and try to develop your game, you are going to be out on the floor.

    The next game, you hit a game winning shot. Holy crap, you are on SportsCenter! Everyone is talking about the new guy at (insert school) who is playing great. You are becoming a household name. Next, hot girls that used to think that you were SLOTH from the Goonies are coming and talking to you. Inviting you to their sorority parties.

    The next day you get invited out with a booster for a dinner so expensive that it matches a months grocery bill. He asks you to come over and play PS3 with his kids, they have every game known to man. If you can keep a secret, he might even let you "rent" out one of his nice cars from his dealership. If there is $5,000 in the glove box randomly, just take it, no questions needed.

    What happens if the boosters at the school are legit, and they don't make it rain for their players? You come from a poor family, I guess you have to get a job like the other kids that come from humble backgrounds to pay for expenses. Wait, you don't have any. All your books, tuition, housing, and food are paid for.

    So for one year: you played hard, partied hard, drove nice cars, slept with every hot slut in school. If you made it out without a VD, you have just lived 90% of America's dreams (yes, i have done in depth research for that statistic :rolleyes: ).

    What do you choose?
     
  10. Omer

    Omer Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2006
    Messages:
    3,933
    Likes Received:
    56
    Stunning storytelling.
     
  11. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2002
    Messages:
    56,641
    Likes Received:
    48,727
    Typically how many players skipped college and headed straight to the NBA prior to the new 1 year in college rule ?
     
  12. Samar

    Samar Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2003
    Messages:
    1,407
    Likes Received:
    8
    deleted
     
    #12 Samar, Jun 9, 2009
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2009
  13. DrNova411

    DrNova411 New Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2008
    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    Just make sure you go to Big State University.
     
  14. Samar

    Samar Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2003
    Messages:
    1,407
    Likes Received:
    8
    Talent that is NBA draft level out of high school is probably going to get his pick of schools.
     
  15. leebigez

    leebigez Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2001
    Messages:
    15,540
    Likes Received:
    618
    My proposal was this, every high school player can be drafted, but they have to spend either 1 yr in the nbdl or 2 yrs in college. So if a player wants to play pro ball after his senior yr, he will be drafted by a nbdl squad or he has to attend college for 2 yrs. That's would allow guys to do what they really want to do and that's ball. Those guys drafted into the nbdl would get redrafted the next season into the nba draft. America is so duplistic. Parker,diirk, yao and others have been playing pro hoops since 16 and no one seems to have a problem. I know its a racial thing more than anything.
     
  16. Malcolm

    Malcolm Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2008
    Messages:
    1,190
    Likes Received:
    34
    Allow as many who wants to go to the NBDL as wanted and then you can put the two year commiment for college. No age limit use the NFL years after graduation rule. Therefore kid smart enough to graduation a year early he should be able to come in a year early.
     
  17. emjohn

    emjohn Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2002
    Messages:
    12,132
    Likes Received:
    567
    I hear what you're saying, and it's true, I'm not taking into account what those players want. Because what they want is hurting the NCAA. That scenario is exactly what just led to Tim Floyd resigning. Is that good for the game?

    OJ Mayo serves as a good example of the type of player that I'd like to see removed from the NCAA. 2 High Schools and a couple of minor incidents, goes to USC (allegedly paid to do so), allegedly is being taken care of by an agent that he dumps, is fun to watch (21-12) but the team does not go far in the conference tournament and is upset immediately in the NCAA tournament. Mayo leaves, and now the team is very likely to get hit hard by the NCAA. Is that worth it?

    Sure Mayo is fine with that, but I don't see how that's good for the game. I also think that illicit pampering of recruits and 1&doners helps create uncoachable headcases. How much maturity did Mayo gain from his time at USC? How willing was he to listen to anyone not handing him stacks of money?

    I do have to call myself out - it was dumb of me to start the thread and not know that:
    age requirement for NBDL is only 18 already
    salaries for non-NBA players in the NBDL is a pathetic $25k (on the upper end)

    No wonder the D-league has zero appeal to a Brandon Jennings.

    I'd still want to see a college commitment mean two years before becoming eligible for the draft to squeeze out the OJ Mayos, even if that means Europe is the only real option.

    What about reworking the NBDL draft pay scale? Top selection is capped at $400k, second at $300k, third at $200K, fourth at $100k? It's not much of a cashing-in, but it's probably enough to keep the top guys around if they don't want to go to school for two years. The jump in payroll *should* be offset by increased attendance - wouldn't you be interested to go watch Brandon Jennings this past year if he were playing for (or against) Austin's team? If John Wall got selected by Anaheim?

    The NBA gets their best possible look at these guys before the draft: seeing them against true (if bottom level) NBA talent, in NBA schemes, working with NBA coaches. Wannabe an uncoachable headcase? You better believe that plummets your stock in the draft.

    Again, agents can go ahead and sign them, providing additional cash legitimately.

    Not counting foreign youngsters:
    2005: 9 (3 first rd)
    2004: 8 (all first rd)
     
  18. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    124,570
    Likes Received:
    33,560
    Why restrict it at all?

    Just let the NBDL sign the best players available including all kids 18 years old and up.

    DD
     
  19. emjohn

    emjohn Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2002
    Messages:
    12,132
    Likes Received:
    567
    I think the trick is that the NBA is being ridiculously strict on payroll to keep the league financial viable. NBA teams pay the salaries of their players sent down, and that leaves the NBDL on the hook for less than $250k a season in player salaries.

    The WNBA should have died years ago, but they survive like cockroaches thanks to the chokehold the NBA keeps on player salary caps.
     
  20. kaleidosky

    kaleidosky Your Tweety Bird dance just cost us a run

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2002
    Messages:
    15,084
    Likes Received:
    1,352
    i like the 1 HSer per NBDL roster restriction...or at least SOME #.. because it allows the NBDL to actually work to develop guys like it's meant to.

    Otherwise, you'll see them give up quickly on guys and always go for "high potential" 17 (if they allow it) and 18 year olds. If they don't show anything in the first year, they'll be dumped for another prospect.

    I like that guys have been able to hone their games a bit and find their way into the league..
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now