A sad day for idealism... Only positive thing I can say is that I'm thankful that Bush held out this long. Clinton kissed China's ass from the beginning. =============== Mr. Bush's Kowtow Washington Post Editorial Wednesday, December 10, 2003; Page A30 http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A51214-2003Dec9.html FOR THE PAST several weeks, Taiwan and China have been exchanging rhetorical broadsides about how the island's political future might be decided. Taiwan's democratically elected president, Chen Shui-bian, has been hinting that maybe his people should make a democratic choice about whether to unite with China or become independent. Beijing's Communist dictators have replied with bellicose threats to settle the matter by force, no matter the price. Yesterday President Bush essentially placed the United States on the side of the dictators who promise war, rather than the democrats whose threat is a ballot box. His gift to visiting Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao was to condemn "the comments and actions made by the leader of Taiwan" while ignoring the sanguinary rhetoric of the man standing next to him. Mr. Bush had his reasons for doing so -- above all to avoid one more foreign policy crisis during an election year. But in avoiding a headache for himself, he demonstrated again how malleable is his commitment to the defense of freedom as a guiding principle of U.S. policy. Democracy is not always pretty or pure, of course, and Taiwan provides no exception. Mr. Chen has started talking about independence and promoting referendums because he is locked in a reelection battle. Trailing in the polls, he seems to think he can win by producing the same dynamic that helped him four years ago, when China's threats and missile firings in the Taiwan Strait touched off a backlash among voters. Though Mr. Chen favors independence, most Taiwanese do not: Polls show they prefer to maintain the status quo indefinitely. So Mr. Chen cleverly proposes to hold a referendum on his own election day next March asking his citizens not to decide on Taiwan's status but simply to call on China to remove the 500 missiles it has positioned in range of Taiwan and to renounce the use of force. It is, perhaps, a cynical electoral ploy -- something known to occur in other democratic countries -- but it poses no threat to China. Beijing's new Communist leaders, including Mr. Wen, would be wise to embrace Mr. Chen's demands. Without such steps, they will have no chance of persuading Taiwan's 23 million people to accept unification with the mainland. Instead they have fallen back on the sort of primitive threats that ought to cause other democracies to rally to Taiwan's defense. Last week one general predicted an "abyss of war" if Mr. Chen pressed his independence agenda, and in case that was considered a bluff, spelled out the price that he said China was ready to pay, from cancellation of the 2008 Olympics to mass casualties. "We will not sit by and do nothing when faced with provocative activities," Mr. Wen blustered in an interview with The Post last month. It's bad enough that the world's largest dictatorship might consider a nonbinding referendum opposing the use of force to be a provocation justifying war. But for the United States to accept such totalitarian logic is inexcusable. Mr. Bush says his policy is to oppose any unilateral change in the status quo by either side and to observe the "one China" policy of previous administrations. Aides say Beijing has been told that the use of force is unacceptable. But Mr. Bush didn't say that. Instead he swallowed Beijing's argument that Mr. Chen's referendum is somehow intolerable, and he dispatched a senior aide to Taipei to insist that no vote be held. A president who believed his own promise to "favor freedom" would have said yesterday that China's "comments and actions" -- from invasion threats to missile deployments -- were of considerably greater concern than a proposed exercise in voting booths.
From the Houston Chronicle: http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/story.hts/editorial/2283124 Dec. 9, 2003, 9:06PM TREAD LIGHTLY More to China-Taiwan spat than meets the eye Copyright 2003 Houston Chronicle President Bush said the right things on Tuesday when, sitting with Chinese Prime Minister Wen Jiabao in the Oval Office, he proclaimed, "We oppose any unilateral decision, by either China or Taiwan, to change the status quo." Bush was reiterating earlier statements warning Taiwanese leaders against holding a referendum next March, during presidential elections, calling for China to withdraw all missiles aimed at the island and renounce the use of force against it. President Chen Shui-bian of Taiwan said the referendum, widely seen as stoking sentiment for independence, would nonetheless be held as scheduled on March 20. The proposed referendum has wide support in Taiwan, and, say Taiwanese observers, Chen has little choice but to follow through on it. Otherwise, he would be seen domestically to be backing down to mainland China and, in a neck-and-neck, too-close-to-call re-election campaign, it would be political suicide. Bush gave the Chinese prime minister an important political concession by publicly reiterating his warning to Taiwan. Partly in exchange, the Chinese have agreed to talks with the United States on ways to reduce our trade imbalance, which could hit $120 billion this year. However, we hope that the president's private remarks recognized the more nuanced complexity of the situation and urged the Chinese not to press the matter too forcefully. The referendum and the close presidential contest in Taiwan represent a maturing of democracy taking place on the island. The White House denied that Bush's remarks constitute any shift in U.S. policy, which calls for a peaceful bilateral solution. But the very fact that the denial had to be issued indicates there is room for misinterpretation on the part of Chinese leadership. Such misinterpretation could be dangerous. It would be sadly ironic to come to a crisis across the Taiwan Strait in March and look back knowing Washington, while pledging to midwife democracy in Iraq, turned out to have undermined the maturing democracy in Taiwan.
Our commitment to supporting and spreading democracy in the world vis a vis Iraq goes right up to the border of Iraq. I guess that rationale goes out the window.
bush is a guy who sees the world in black and white while our taiwan policy has always been gray. This matter requires careful diplomacy. After that screw up he did on the talk show a few years ago, i can't believe his int. security advisors are still letting him open his mouth on this matter
This is not really about spreading democracy, This is about Bush saying what he needed to say to maintain the status quo between all sides.
Bush is doing his best to mediate. He's obviously awful at foreign affairs, but he's doing the right thing by trying to reduce the tension. We don't need for anything to happen there. We're already busy in the middle east, war on terror, and North Korea. The last thing that we need is joining a military conflict in asia in which the opposition has nukes. In addition, we wouldn't get any support especially now with how the rest of the world despises us.
USA should defend democracy at all cost. Sending two carriers will scare the crap out of Chinese. Nobody can win a war against USA.
Without China, the U.S. economy would collapse. They make almost everything we have -- from shoes to TVs. The U.S. is not about to challenge China on this. China could invade Taiwan and rape all the women and children, and Bush would ask if they need to be fluffed. That's the price of "globalization" -- economics comes before anything else. I'm not saying it's right or wrong. But that's the trade-off.
actually, given some thought, i think its obvious that spreading democracy is no longer a priority to the US as much as security is. Something tells me that bush's comments has something to do with the fact that he wants to maintain a good relationship with China, not as much for the economy, as for the negotiations on North Korea to go smoothly. i think its pretty obvious that bush is more scared of non-western people developing WMDs than the economy and national debt having problems.
The spread of democracy should be done in peace, by force is always last resort. If the USA wants to help China in the process of democratization, to support Taiwan independence is the least thing she should do. For average Chinese who desire to see their country remains to be intact, seeing their country being dismembered by two democracies without their consent will make them like democracy less. To maintain status quo works towards China's democritization process, also, it brings peace.
If anything good is to come of the Taiwan/China situation, at least diplomatically speaking, it's not going to happen under Dubya.
Lil, You should remember that is was Clinton that sent the 7th Fleet into the Taiwan Straits in '95. That doesn't sound like ass kissing to me. Not really. Other countries would eagerly replace the PRCs contribution to our material needs. The PRC, however, WOULD collapse. We control the market and they don't control the supply, so although there would be economic ramifications for us, our economy would hardly collapse.
Sorry, does anybody see Lil post something about basketball? He is such a genius "democracy"mania and I am so impressed.
What did Thumper's father say this morning? "If you can't say somethin' nice, don't say nothin' at all."
It's more proof that......I know many of you will shudder.....that GWB is really a pathetic president. Have some courage man! Change the stupid policy. Allow Taiwan to become an independent state without the threat of a forced reunification by the Chicoms. That's on top of all the dumb stuff promulgated by this awful admin including today: -Tom Ridge favors some kind of "legal" status for the illegal immigrants here. "Legal?" They got here illegally!!!!!! More stupid pandering to the Hispanic vote. Let's just continue to allow our borders to be leakier than a sieve. Let's just let the Mexicans invade and turn our economy into a colder Mexico, shall we! -Also the Bush admin is considering paying Social Security benefits to........Mexican citizens who worked here illegally! Let's reward them for flouting our laws with a handout. -Signing that awful campaign finance "reform" bill into law, then expecting the Supreme Court to overturn an obvious assault on the First Amendment. The Supremes went weak-kneed and now, there will soon be no First Amendment because the political elites will find a way to further tie the hands of any would-be challengers. -Signing that dreadful prescription drug "benefit" for every single last oldster. Yeah, my kids don't mind paying for grandpa's Viagra and being strapped with decades of debt just to buy the votes of the wizzened. I hate to agree with the libs, but GWB sucks! He may call himself a compassionate "conservative" but he is no more a conservative than a pig is a horse.
U.S. social security benefits for Mexican citizens! Reward them for breaking the law, shall we?! link Tom Ridge wants "legal" status for illegals. link[/URL Reaction mainly from the great Tom Tancredo, one of the few in Washington with the balls to fight for enforcement of our immigration laws. link ]
oh wow, i really i did shudder when you said that. are you alright? anyway, freedom is not on bushies agenda, i think thats clear. he is concerned about security and interests and it is in the US interest to keep the situation status quo. seriously, until taiwan can offer the US something China cannot besides another useless democratic ally like our dell tech support in India, theres little reason to support taiwan asides from preventing china from expansion. help them because they are a democracy? cold war Ipol is as old as the 80's that we left it in. we don't care. we really dont care. the image of taiwan in our congress are all those videos of their representatives fist fighting each other in session, I know Lil will cringe, but many American representatives see Taiwan as an "uncivilized" democracy, regardless of what happens outside of those media highlights. as much as we say we love to spread democracy around the world, i think that was more clinton's agenda than Bush. GW just wants to make sure that no one will ever hurt us. Now if Taiwan really wants to get noticed, they should covertly get some nukes, and threaten china if it attacks them, while also threatening the US if it doesnt defend them. that will get bush's attention. Until then, when he thinks asia, all he thinks about is the north korean threat, and as of now, our most important ally is China, followed by south korea, japan and russia. taiwan is not a card to be played, they are not a threat, they have no leverage. until they do, this administration won't do jack.
No, I'm quite all right. Bush does suck. How can you claim to be one thing, then do another? I'm glad I didn't vote for him, but I don't think the conservatives like his leftward tilt.
Geez, we still don't understand that GW's job is not spreading democracy to other countries, if that's the case, we would be trying to change the Saudi/Jordan etc... governments. His job is to protect American interest, and he is trying to do that with this China/Taiwan problem. And the best case scenario is to stay status quo. So americans can still buy the cheap toys made in china in Wal-mart and computers/electronics made in taiwan. While american companies have access to both markets. Why have only one trading partner when you can have both? Also by showing China this admin still has some leverage over taiwan, which can be used in the NKorea issue. When it comes down to it, only self interest matters for each country.
