Morey: "McHale will experiment with Asik at C and Dwight at PF"

just curious, how many pf out there will actually eat dwight for lunch when dwight's guarding them?
how many pf can really outquick, outjump or out whatever dwight?

 

It's just training camp for crying out loud. There should be experimentation occurring during this period, and in the pre-season. Rockets will need to try different sets to see what they can do against teams during the regular season. Of course, I wouldn't suggest Asik playing PG but Beverley might have enough tasmanian devil in him to play center. He would be closer to the opposing center's knees.

 

(Without accounting for the opposing team's linueps they went against)

The article also says that the defensive boost still overcomes the offensive shortcomings and its a net-positive outcome.

Which is basically all that matters in the end - in the limited time together does the lineup do better than the next team

Just it remains to be seen if it is just "decent" or if there's BETTER lineups

 

I think the main thing is would Asik WANT to CHANGE his approach from playing center to adjusting to power forward. (I think Asik would be the better power forward of the 2.)

Though Asik has already pouted about his starting role being taken away. Now he has to play a position he's not used to so it accommodates the new guy coming in.

And even without that, its even more brain drain and mental work on Asik going away from his natural comfort zone and having of 2-3 extra dimensions of basketball and having to overtrain. Just to only play HALF his usual time and just so he might get traded anyway.

Superstar Dwight Howard might need to be the last-in "new guy" to adjust to Asik's "seniority" to keep Asik happy.

I underlined Garnett/Lopez because I think they have a semi-similar issue to Houston. Garnett these days is a better player at CENTER than at power forward. They might have more effective lineups when they DON'T share the court (and depending who they go against)

I bolded teams that would give Rockets "Tall Ball" lineup some problems.

-Rockets will still be a version of a fast paced team, but Nuggets are generally fast paced and Faried would outquick Asik and Howard down the court.
-Bosh would be a mismatch. Like how Luis Scola couldnt keep up with Lamar Odom (though Odom couldnt hang with Scola either). Thats where you hope someone like Terrence Jones can come through.
-No one is more "stretch" than Andrea Bargnani. It forces Asik and Howard out to defend on the perimeter, and thats an uncomfortable notion. Thats exactly what stretch players and small ball looks to exploit (Though Bargnani isnt particularly good at it so could be a non-factor anyway)
-Millsap has enough offensive versatility from midrange and off the dribble to give slower footed players some problems.

It was highlighted last year how Lamarcus Aldridge was lighting up the Rockets PFs, then the Rockets put Asik on him and it just about shut him down. THATS the kind of POTENTIAL that Rockets Tall Ball can have. It makes Asik into designated oversized "Chuck Hayes" defensive stopper, and then Dwight can go to work on the Robin Lopez JJ Hickson types.

I think it can work in 5-10 minute stretches against certain teams, not full game against everyone. But it all depends how much Howard and Asik WANT to adapt (thats something to be skeptical about since they're both established vets in prime of careers and arent in rookie/2nd year and not in end-of-career "ring chase" mode either)

 

McHale in staff will experiment with different lineups 4 sho. We should all know that simple fact.

 

But let's not pretend that isn't the plan anyway. Believe me, Asik would just leave in two years. So we make the best of the combo while we can. Let teams come up with better offers than whatever crap they served up to Morey this summer; you can bet teams were like, "I'll take Asik and Parsons for So-and-So," or, "I'll give you Expiring Worthless Guy and a Pick".

 

Haven't seen everything in thread, but I would assume that Asik would be center with Howard at PF. I think other lineups will work better than twin towers and we won't see it in the regular season much if at all. If the Rockets have issue with a small lineup with the twin towers, the Rockets can generally counter with better small ball.

 

Dwight has never had a problem with size and athleticism before... his problem has been guarding skilled post players. Yao used to handle Dwight very well strickly because of fundamentals. He wouldn't beat him with his size, he would do it with his brain and skill.

I'm not saying Dwight is dumb, or makes that many mental mistakes on the defensive end, but this will be his issue guarding skilled pf's. There will be well prepared players that learn to move into areas that Dwight is not comfortable in, use picks to get him tangled up in rotations, and beat him with their jump shot.

Dwight is most likely going to stick to his comfort levels as a paint patrolling big who has a tendency to not come out to shooters who spread the floor, and might get caught up on switches where he normally would stay home in the paint.

There are some major fundamental differences in role that he will need to prove he can do if he's really going to play the PF position defensively. Offensively, you're opening up a whole other can of worms.

Im not saying it can't be successful, but fans should temper their expectations.

 

Try it if it does not work,trade Omer,this team needs a PF who can stretch the floor and hit jumpers.


Oh and Asik destroyed Tim Duncan (one of the best PFs in NBA history) last season,just saiyan.

 

Don't think it will work in todays NBA because Asik has a limited offensive game and smaller PF's can hold him on the block. Please stop the madness of this experiment. Neither Dwight nor Asik can play D in open space at the 3 point line. This would be ridiculous!

 

With Dwight then passing to the other big man for a dunk. I completely disagree with you.

Dwight posts up with Asik on the other side of the floor, just kind of roaming for weak side rebounds, put backs, and backdoor cuts off of the pass out of the double team. Dream did this well with Chucky freaking Brown at the PF and Chucky couldn't hit anything further than 5 feet from the basket.

I'm looking forward to the experiment, if McHale has any kind of offensive mind, he can make two good big men work without relegating one of them to chucking from the outside.

 

ones that can shoot.. a healthy dirk would light it up from all over the court with dwight on him.

 

Of course. Just on the odd chance that it does work quite well, though, and often enough to have a clearly positive impact on wins, does Morey hang on to Omer past the deadline, which is also past when he could probably get the most for Asik? If we move Omer over the summer, while a team wouldn't be impacted by more than the $8 million-plus hit on their cap, they'd still have to pay the balloon amount, and only for one season of Omer. Then Asik is going to want to get paid. In other words, do the Rockets pass on the ideal time to deal Asik (now, or at the deadline) in order to "win now," possibly with a deep run in the playoffs if Dwight and Omer seem to be clicking? That's a problem I'd like Morey to have. Just wondering. Based on Alexander's comments, one might think they'd keep Asik and take their chances.

 

I think this is a very similar situation like the Harden-Lin problem. Asik and Howard have largely overlapping strengths, just like Harden and Lin. Lin has to defer because Harden is clearly better, just like Howard is clearly better than Asik.

Besides, it is almost certain that McHale will stagger their time so that at least one of them will be on the floor at all time. That means they will play together only about 15-18 minutes per game.

 

Asik should not be traded. At least not for cheap. The guy is a defensive anchor.

D12 has option to opt out on year 3 right? Hold Asik.

 

They probably won't average 15 minutes together. But there will be games when they possibly play 15-20 minutes together. They're probably going to average about 10-14 minutes together. And if they do that, they'll still each be averaging 30 minutes a game.

 

I disagree with you. Dwight is not a good passer and never will be. He's always had more TOs than assists and hasn't averaged 2 assists/game once in his entire career. With Asik's very limited offensive skills on the floor next to him, Dwight will be a bigger double-team magnet than ever. If he can't effectively hit well-spaced players on the perimeter, what makes you think he can thread passes to Asik. Perhaps if Asik had great hands to compensate, but we all know he doesn't.

With Asik on the floor, Dwight's assists/TO ratio will plummet even further, from 1/2 to 1/3.

 

Neither Asik nor Dwight are cut out to play power forward in today's NBA. Neither can hit a shot. I think there may be certain times when you want to have a big defensive front court on the floor though; against a team like Washington for example...where you're looking at a massive front line with NeNe and Okafor. Or Golden State, where you're looking at Lee and Bogut. Or San Antonio with Duncan and Splitter. Or Brooklyn with Garnett and Lopez. There may be certain times when it makes sense to play them together for a stretch, but thats gonna be the exception, not the rule. we need a real 4. Most unsettled position on the team. Can't feel confident about DMo or Jones being ready to start. Greg Smith is clearly still developing. We don't know what we're gonna get from Casppi. Camp is gonna be very important this year. A lot to sort out!

 

We'll see soon enough.

Honestly though, I can understand what you guys are saying that are against the twin towers setup. My point to you is...you play to the strengths of the players on the floor. Last year...what did we do? We opened up the game, opened up the floor and we played to those strengths. What I don't understand is why would you think for one minute that if we have 2 bigs in the game that we are going to plod up the court and set up half court ball....especially with 2 defensive anchors in the paint like we have?

You see, I don't envision a terrible lot of half-court sets like you guys keep thinking are going to happen. What I see happening with Dwight and Asik in the game is the other 3 guys overplaying and scrambling on the perimeter to prevent the 3-balls, generating steals and forcing turnovers, and letting their opponent get past them if they have to and giving the opponent the choice of the long 2 ball or driving into Asik/Dwight...while our guy LEAKS OUT!!! It's gonna be a bam-bam situation. Opponent takes shot, Dwight or Asik gets the board and then the opponent is already at a man to two men disadvantage on the break going the other way.

Look....when are we MOST LIKELY to have these 2 bigs in the game at the same time??? It's when we are playing power teams like the Clips and the Griz. It's not all the time. It's only realistically going to be for about 10-15 minutes on average each game and it will be situationally against big power teams. Having our 2 bigs in the game is about DEFENSE. It's about shutting down the opponent, dominating the defensive boards and beating them up 3 on 3 or 3 on 2 or 3 on 1 or 2 on 1 or 1 on 1. In any of those situations with our 3 or 2 or 1 perimeter players running the break against the opponents 3 or 2 or 1....we have the distinct advantage.

Now, when you start defensively...look at these 2 guys and their defensive strengths. They are perfect complements for each other. Asik is the guy with the best feet, perhaps the quickest defensive feet for a big man in the business. How do you scheme with him defensively? Simple. You put him out high on the pick and roll. You put him out high on guys like Blake and Zach facing up. You put him out high on Timmy D when Timmy goes out high post and faces. Asik gets up in them and forces them to put the ball on the floor. What is Dwight best at defensively? It's obvious. He's best at roaming the paint and helping out on a shooter with space. Watch Dwight's defensive highlights. The overwhelming majority of Dwight's big plays are him coming over to help on a perimeter guy that has beat his defender. Guys....it's the opponents that have to figure out how to be effective and create space against our big 2. Our big 2 if schemed correctly (and I have no doubt that McHale and Kelvin already have this figured out) will cause the opponent to have to go away from their power game. So, the Spurs have to go away from Splitter playing with Timmy. They have to go spread. Great. We counter with Bev, Lin, Harden, Parsons, Dwight. Memphis has to park Zach on the bench and spread the floor with Poindexter or whoever. Great, we'll take that. Clips have to move DeAndre to the bench and put Blake at the 5. I'll take those matchups.

The opponent is forced to adjust because we are shutting down their offensive strength and then we are running out off all their misses and turnovers. It's really not about setting up in the half-court.

Now, do we have to have an effective half-court set with the big 2 in the game together???? Absolutely. Don't you want to see what that looks like with 2 dominant rebounding forces heading to the offensive glass???? Man, forget spacing in that scenario. The perimeter guys are going to space. Let the play mash down towards the basket. We have not 1 but 2 of the top 5 rebounders in all of basketball mashing down at the rim together. Heavens to Betsy...who in their right mind doesn't want to see what the results would be?

 

I like your optimism but have to disagree with much of it. Twin Towers work well when both players are multifaceted, which does not apply Dwight or Omer. Each guy defends the paint on defense. Each guy can only score from very close on offense. They do NOT compliment each other; they DUPLICATE. Duplication is fine when versatile players are involved but is bad otherwise. Is that not plain to understand?

With "Dwasik" both on the floor, teams won't waste time crashing the offensive glass and their #1 goal will be stopping the break. It will be easy for them to force the Rockets into a half-court offense with Dwasik getting in each other's way. As explained earlier, spacing will be very difficult for Dwight and the lanes the Harden, Lin and Parsons depend on to attack the rim will be clogged.

I think a lot of us WANT the concept to work because Omer is such a likable player. But pull back from wishful thinking and imagine these two on another team. How many here would be singing the praises of the twin tower lineup with these two? Somebody posted earlier they could see Asik hitting 18-foot jumpers next season. Really? A guy that barely shoots over 50% from the FT line?

Keep in mind the Dwasik lineup is only being considered because of how bad the Rockets PF options are. This is a sign of weakness, not strength. I expect Morey to address it by the trade deadline for sure, if not before the season (assuming Dwight stays healthy).