More Than 500,000 Rally in L.A. for Immigrants' Rights

I completely agree and feel that they should have the right to treat preventatively. I feel that every American is due medical care regardless of financial standing.

 

I'm saying if you want America to grant you citizenship you should be able to display that your loyalty lies with America and not with any other country.

You make it seem like the government is trying to take things they're entitled to. They are not citizens and aren't guaranteed anything. Many of them do hate the country they just see an economic opportunity they can't pass up. There's a lot more of the racist anti-America thought in a lot of these illegals than some are willing to admit.







If only more of the protestors were more like this girl:



The last pic is from the Dallas News website: http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/pt/slideshows/2006/03/protest2_2006/

 

This is not your homeland and it wasn't stolen. Here's a history lesson for you, Mexico lost so STFU.

1836 b****es

 

The Tax pays subsidizing him is like
you paying for you brother. . . he family
but
some guy moves into your house - without being invited
and stays in the addict
even though he keeps it clean and trims the hedges. .
does not mean you wanted that extra mouth to feed
and
you don't want to cover his kidney transplants

Universal Health Care is a totally different convo

Rocket River

 

Fixed it for you.

...

 

Awesome

 

That is one of my main problems
This would mean . .the best way to become a citizen would be
to sneak in illegally . . . and then try to get processed
why wait. . .

Rocket River

 

Just another example of these LAW breaker. .These people have no respect for America.

 

They are trying to take away their religion, I would say they are entitled to that...

As far as the anti-Americanism and racism, LOL! they aren't even in a position to be racist, it's not a big deal, stop worrying about it, signs aren't hurting anyone, all the illegal immigrants really have is work, they can't vote, same for most of the legal immigrants working here. You're asking them to love a country that not only doesn't want them here and labels them as criminals, but they're not allowed to vote, (I'm not saying they should be able to vote) how can they feel like they are part of a country when all they're doing here is working?

 

Fair enough. There are two types of illegal immigrants:

Type #1: Day-labor types; they pay a portion of taxes - no income taxes, but they certainly pay sales tax and the like.

Type #2: The ones with the fake SS number. They do pay full taxes, yet only get a portion of the benefits.

So do your feelings apply to both types, or just #1. Because type #2, outside of being illegal, is no different than a legal foreign resident.

 

Oh I agree on the legality issue. That was exactly what I was pointing out. There are Americans all over the world doing the same things halfbreed was complaining that illegal immigrants do. My point is that I don't think the real point of contention is that they send money away, etc. It may simply be that one group is legal and the other is illegal. But in that case, what makes him dislike the illegal immigrants is the legality aspect, not the sending money home, having loyalty to a different country, taking jobs, etc - because the legal American residents in other countries do all of these things.

Now, certainly, the aspect of paying taxes is a part of it, and that's what I'm trying to clarify in my previous post because many illegal immigrants do pay their full share of taxes when they use fake SS#s.

As to your second part - I agree. Legal immigrants are really being shafted here. I have two friends that are going through that process and its a nightmare. I don't know the solution. As I mentioned in an earlier post, the situation we have is not ideal right now - but the solutions being proposed just make things worse. I really don't what the proper solution / balance is. The proposal going through the Senate might be a functional solution - but the one in the House is a total disaster.

 

What would be your break down of the types
50-50?

Rocket RIver

 

I definitely am more inclined to be critical of Type #1. I have a feeling that this is where most illegal immigrants lie as well.

As you've said, the only criticism I have of type #2 is that they entered the country illegally and bypassed the process that thousands of others are going through to get into the country.

 

Thanks. I'm glad you understood my post. (and not surprised! ) This is really one of the most complex problems facing our country, with no easy solutions in sight. I agree that the House bill is a disaster, although they are certainly making things easier for Democrats this Fall, in my opinion. I'm not sure about the Senate bill, and there is no telling what will come out, eventually, after the two get through hammering out their differences. I wouldn't be surprised if a bill ultimately comes out that no one likes, or if the whole thing dies in the conference committee.

My wife's Mom was an immigrant from the Netherlands, in the '30's, and we visited Ellis Island last June... an awesome experience. I have to admit to having reservations about the illegal immigration we've been having, and the fact that, because anyone born here becomes a citizen, that there are those becoming Americans by avoiding the legal process that countless others had to go through, and continue to go through. I think a legal process that allows guest workers here from Latin America would be ideal, if it were coupled with not allowing children born in the States, under those particular conditions, becoming Americans, but that would require a constitutional amendment, which I don't see happening. We'll probably just have to continue putting up with that aspect of illegal immigration as a fact of life. Hopefully, we can create a mechanism that will allow those doing it now to do it legally.



Keep D&D Civil.

 

Honestly, I have no idea. I suspect type #2 (fake SS) are much harder to track simply because they blend in extremely well with legal immigrants or American citizens.

I think part of the solution is better border controls - its much better to keep people out than to have to figure out what to do with them once they are here and established. I'm more concerned with things like not allowing humanitarian organizations (churches and hospitals) to do their jobs. Not helping the poor because they are illegal immigrants would go against the fundamental concept of Christianity, for example. Asking every homeless shelter to do ID checks of some sort or face criminal prosecution is both a logistical nightmare and flat out ridiculous. Things like that in the House bill are just insane, in my opinion. They are political statements rather than solutions to anything.

 

Makes sense - thanks. I fully agree that a major group of people that are suffering here are the ones trying to get in legally.

 

I can tell you as someone who dated a home gardner and tried some home gardening myself its not that easy to grow your own produce and anyway the time you spend planting, fertilizing, watering, weeding and harvesting your own produce could be spent far more productively doing other things. The same as I bought an old house a few months ago and have been mostly fixing it up myself. I'm way behind because I have too many otherthings to do including work. If I needed to get it done rapidly, say if I needed to rent it out for income to pay the mortgage, it makes little sense for me to do the renovation work myself when I could hire someone. Being someone who cares about what I'm spending if I can hire a contractor at less price but delivers the same quality I'm going with the cheaper contractor. That he may be hiring illegals isn't going to prevent me from seeking to get the best deal.

 

Yeah, I think it's just a messed up situation all around. My other problem with the discussion (and why I got involved in the first place) is the idea that these people are bad somehow. I understand they are breaking the law and subject to whatever punishment we deem, etc, etc. I just think if I were in their shoes, I would probably do the same thing. I don't think they (as a group - I'm sure some do) hate the US, etc. I think they just want a better life, and they see America as the way to do that. And they likely will wait their entire lifetimes to get in legally, so from a "what's best for my family perspective," they make the reasonable decision to try to get in however they can. The fact that they risk their lives crossing shows the benefits they think it has.

So while I understand our need to limit the flow of immigrants, I don't blame the illegal immigrants for doing what they do. It simply comes out of a fundamental pursuit of happiness and a better life, which I think all people rightfully should pursue. And that makes it far more complex for me in terms of thinking of what the proper punishment and solutions are.

 

We are growing strawberries and about 8 different herbs on our balcony as we speak.

Here are our strawberries. No illegal workers need apply, we got it.