1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

  2. LIVE WATCH EVENT
    REED SHEPPARD DEBUT -- come join Clutch and the gang as we're watching live the Rockets open up Summer League in Vegas Friday night at 6:30pm CT. It will be Reed Sheppard's debut as he, Cam Whitmore, Aj Griffin and others take on Bronny James and the Lakers.

    Rockets vs Lakers LIVE!

Mobely = John Starks

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by tod the bod, Feb 22, 2001.

  1. tod the bod

    tod the bod Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 1999
    Messages:
    182
    Likes Received:
    2
    Lots of comparisons between the two. Starks was a CBA player and a bag boy at a supermarket before he got a contract with the Knicks. Mobely was a second-round draft pick, projected by nobody to make the NBA. Both had (have) good moves to the basket. And neither ever saw a shot they didn't like.
    Most important, both feel that they will eventually shoot their way out of any slump.

    Last night, Mobely can't buy a shot, finally he hits a three, and then on the next trip down the court, he jacks up a tremendously misguided shot. Just no judgment.

    Here's the fact. The Rockets, for better or for worse, are going to live and die with Mobely. When he is on, the team is going to win, when he is off, the team is usually going to lose (unless the opposing team, like the Timberwolves, are shooting even worse).

    I would like to see Mobely excercise better judgment, and there was one point in the fourth quarter, I think, where it looked like he was about to jack up the shot and then he passed it to Francis who was open. I was very impressed with this move. It would be good to see more of that.
     
  2. AroundTheWorld

    AroundTheWorld Insufferable 98er
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2000
    Messages:
    71,035
    Likes Received:
    49,274
    I hope Mobely and Olujowan and Fracnis will take the team to the playoffs.
     
  3. RockenRam5

    RockenRam5 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2001
    Messages:
    216
    Likes Received:
    0
    Mobley is nothing like Starks. Did Starks ever average 20 points a game? Did he ever have the quickist first step? Mobley game right out of college and hit a game-winner in his debut, since then, he has been treated like a lottery pick. Starks is nowhere near has good has Mobley [​IMG]

    ------------------
    "GiddyUP!!!"
    Krammer from Seinfeld
     
  4. tod the bod

    tod the bod Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 1999
    Messages:
    182
    Likes Received:
    2
    I'm sorry. But you can you please tell me when Mobely averaged 20 pts./game in a season? It hasn't happened yet.

    Second in 93/94 Starks averaged 19 pts./game (pretty much what Mobely is doing now) and in 92/93 Starks averaged 17.5 pts./game. And yes, Starks had a very quick move to the basket. But maybe you don't remember that because your mother didn't let you stay up to watch basketball on TV seven yrs ago.
     
  5. slcrocket

    slcrocket Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2000
    Messages:
    1,633
    Likes Received:
    38
    Starks CANNOT beat his man off the dribble like Mobley. He lacks that quick first step, which is Mobley's greatest attribute. Oh, sure, Starks has gotten to the basket occasionally, but so did Uwe Blab. Mobley can consistently break down his opponent every time down the floor in single coverage.

    They've both been strong shooters--Mobley more consistent, but strong shooters, nonetheless.

    ------------------
    Jazzkiller
     
  6. TheFreak

    TheFreak Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 1999
    Messages:
    18,265
    Likes Received:
    3,233
    That's funny, I don't seem to remember teams opting to double-team Starks while leaving Ewing with single coverage. Never saw any ability in Starks to play both guard spots. Don't seem to remember the Knick offense ever running through Starks either. Starks' highest offensive output for his career was 19.0 ppg. Mobley's averaging 19.4 in his 2nd full season. Mobley's getting to the line 6.2 times a game, Starks only got there more than 4 times a game twice. Mobley's averaging close to 5 boards a game, Starks only topped 3 a game twice. Career free throw shooting--Mobley 83%, Starks 77%. Yeah, good comparison.
     
  7. Achebe

    Achebe Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 1999
    Messages:
    6,237
    Likes Received:
    2
    Thank you TheFreak. We like your work here.

    ------------------
     
  8. ROCKETBOOSTER

    ROCKETBOOSTER Member

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 1999
    Messages:
    1,297
    Likes Received:
    1
    Maybe the only thing that is comparable is shot attempts if even that, but i dont see any other comparable attributes between the two. As some others have already mentioned before, Mobley's one-on-one capabilities are much more threatening than Starks ever were. Mobley and Starks attitudes are as dissimilar as you can get. Mobely is friendly and affectionate toward his teamates while Starks seems passionate and indiffrent most of the time. Considering their diffrent attitudes on and off the court its really an injsutice for Mobley to be compared to Starks in any way.

    Oh yeah, Starks was a better defender, though.

    ------------------
     
  9. SamCassell

    SamCassell Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 1999
    Messages:
    8,878
    Likes Received:
    1,332
    Mobes and Starks are 2 completely different players. Starks is much more like V. Maxwell: great defender in his day, but a "streaky" shooter. Which is to say mostly a bad shooter, who gets hot on occassion.

    Mobley is a pretty good shooter, and could get even better with improved shot selection. He's not the defender that Starks is, and probably never will be. But he has gotten better at that lately, as well. And as TheFreak noted, he's got a much quicker first step and is able to draw alot of fouls, especially for a guard.

    The quality that both share is heart. They go all out, all the time, and aren't afraid to take the big shots. You can't say that about most players.

    ------------------
    In Italy for 30 years under the Borgias they had warfare, terror, murder, and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci, and the Renaissance. In Switzerland they had brotherly love - they had 500 years of democracy and peace, and what did that produce? The cuckoo clock.
     
  10. haven

    haven Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 1999
    Messages:
    7,945
    Likes Received:
    14
    Starks and Mobley share an affinity for shooting when they shouldn't... but beyond that, no. Mobley is a great deal more physically gifted, and has much better handles and speed.

    BTW, what makes you think the Rockets live and die with Mobley? He scores the most when the Rockets lose [​IMG]. That may very well just be because nobody else is scoring, but they've certainly won a few where he hasn't played that well. I think Francis OR mobley has to score (last night being an obvious exception)... not both in any one game for us to have a good chance.

    ------------------
    Why is it that everytime BC defeats a major conference opponent, that opponent promptly goes on a losing streak?

    PS. Notre Dame sucks
     
  11. Lil Francis

    Lil Francis Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2000
    Messages:
    3,772
    Likes Received:
    0
    That would be a nice one on one game between
    Mobley now and Starks the year he dunked on the whole Bulls team. I think its even.

    ------------------
    President of the Steve Francis, Jamal Crawford,Larry Hughes, and Charles Woodson fan club.
     
  12. Rocketability

    Rocketability Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 1999
    Messages:
    1,366
    Likes Received:
    1
    As far as bonehead plays are concerned, they are equivalent. [​IMG]
     
  13. nyrocket

    nyrocket Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2000
    Messages:
    448
    Likes Received:
    0
    I think the comparison is off the mark for many of the reasons listed above. My interjection is this:

    Let's just sit back and watch how many times Cuttino gets traded over the course of his career.

    ------------------
     
  14. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 1999
    Messages:
    34,360
    Likes Received:
    13,931
    There are differences between the two of course, but I think it is an appropriate comparison. They're both scorers and seem to have a very similar approach to the game.

    Freak, if Olajuwon were as good now as Ewing was back then, they'd put single coverage on Mobley. And the offense wouldn't be running through Mobley either. Also, I think Starks makes about as good a PG as Mobley -- which is not very good. Most of the ways in which you say Mobley and Starks are different have more to do with the architecture of the teams than it does with the games and personalities of the players. As for the rest, as I said, there are some differences, but on the whole they are similar -- I haven't heard a better comparison yet.

    ------------------
    RealGM
    Rockets Draft Obligations Summary
    Gafford Art
    Artisan
     
  15. tod the bod

    tod the bod Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 1999
    Messages:
    182
    Likes Received:
    2
    I don't know. Starks played with the Knicks for eight years. And then when his skills declined he has moved around a bit. Talk to me when Mobely plays eight years with the Rockets. Personally, I don't think that it's going to happen.
     
  16. RockenRam5

    RockenRam5 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2001
    Messages:
    216
    Likes Received:
    0
    Why shouldn't it happen. He is signed for six years which will take him up to his 8th year in the league

    ------------------
    "GiddyUP!!!"
    Krammer from Seinfeld
     
  17. gr8-1

    gr8-1 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 1999
    Messages:
    7,918
    Likes Received:
    4
    I would never say that Starks was indifferent, more like pouty and intense. In his prime, Starks was prolly close to Mobes, I wouldn't dispute that.

    Can someone refresh my memory, was Starks a good defender ?

    The similarities I see are they are the same size and both of them like to shoot, but they're shooting guards.

    ------------------
    "Roses are red. Violets are blue. I'm a schizophrenic and so am I."
     
  18. Nolen

    Nolen Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 1999
    Messages:
    2,718
    Likes Received:
    1,261
    Dude, you have exposed yourself. You should have just stuck to the "they both jack up shots" argument and left it at that, because you don't have anything to back up the rest of your hatin'. And that's what this has come down to, that you just just are hatin' on Mobley, because you are making things up to justify it.

    Mobley doesn't face double teams?? Do you watch any games? If you do, have you noticed that everybody double-teams Mobley? Our offense is central to that fact. I am mystified that you open up saying Mobley is rarely double covered. Blatantly wrong.
    I guess to admit that Mobley often demands a double-team would mean you would have to acknowledge his ability to break down anybody one-on-one. But that's not for you, you would actually have to stop hatin' for a moment to do that.

    Uh, yeah, if we had Hakeem in his prime, Mobley wouln't be the focus of the offense. That's profound. Hakeem at the time was the greatest player in the league. Nobody other than him would be the focus of the offense.

    So Starks had good rebounders on his team; that must mean that if he was on a poor rebounding team, he would rebound as well as Mobley is now. There are always excuses.

    There is significance in the fact that Mobley is averaging more points in the middle of his third season than the best season average you could find in a long carreer for Starks. And his average is only going to go up from here.

    It's a good thing we don't have a big man that commands a double-team, or we'd have to listen to you complain about Rudy being completely unable to change from the dump-it-in-the-post offense like you were last year. Have you eaten your crow on that yet, by the way? You've had over a year to do it.

    Having said that, let all lend an ear to the profound statement I am about to make:

    Mobley jacks up stupid shots.

    Maybe we should just let that be the title of the thread, since that's the only significance here

    [This message has been edited by Nolen (edited February 22, 2001).]
     
  19. TheFreak

    TheFreak Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 1999
    Messages:
    18,265
    Likes Received:
    3,233
    Mobley (not Mobely) is rarely doubled? That's news to me. Nobody that's seen the Rockets play more than a few games this year would say something like that. He's doubled all the time. He's doubled all the time when Francis is in the game, which is the reason for the Ewing comparison. Mobley still gets doubled while our best player is in the game, Starks never even got doubled while Ewing wasn't in the game. When the Knicks were good, Ewing was better than Francis is now--but the Rockets are still rebuilding. Let's see if Mobley still gets doubled when he and Francis are both in their prime and both are in the game together. My guess is he will. It has nothing to do with big men.

    Point taken on the rebounding issue. Starks could have had more without a Ewing or Oakley there.

    As for the Knicks offense going through Starks--it didn't. Just because he touched the ball a lot doesn't mean the offense ran through him. That's like saying the Rocket offense went through Robert Horry because he always made entry passes. Starks relied on others to create his opportunities--whether it was a kickout from Ewing, or running off a screen. Mobley creates for himself, which is without a doubt a much tougher thing to do. The bottom line is Starks was a role player--the Knicks weren't built around him. The Rockets are built equally around the games of Mobley and Francis.

    As for 19.4 versus 19.0--the point is, Mobley has already topped Starks highest-ever scoring output in just his second full season.

    "They both shoot a lot", "they both don't take smart shots", they both "think they can shoot themselves out of slumps"--those are all opinions. You'll have a hard time proving those.

    JV -- Mobley does as much or more of the ball-handling for the Rockets as Francis does. Starks didn't have near the ball-handling skills of Mobley, and would not be effective in such a role. If you're looking for a comparison, how about Joe Dumars. Mobley doesn't play the defense Dumars did, but Dumars couldn't get to the hoop like Mobley either.
     
  20. tod the bod

    tod the bod Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 1999
    Messages:
    182
    Likes Received:
    2
    Yeah, you are right.

    You are so right that Bill Worrell only said ten times last night that Mobely was being defended in ways that he typically isn't (i.e. double-teamed), in part, resulting in his crappy game last night. But I guess that Bill doesn't watch the games either.
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now