Kobe has this reputation for being so clutch, but two of the Lakers key wins in the playoffs this year came when his teammates bailed him out after he missed a potential game winner.
First of all, you don't know that the Heat won't be winning because of Lebron's greatness. What if, even teamed with Wade and Bosh, Lebron is still by far the most important player on that team? What if he dominates on a nightly basis? It's far too early to say why the team did or did not win championships when they haven't even played a game together. Second, using your logic, the Lakers never won because of Kobe's greatness either. They won because of stacked teams (Shaq, Rice, Gasol, Artest, Odom), all-star starters (Shaq, Gasol), gold and silver medal olympians (Shaq, Gasol), and a few clutch veterans (Harper, Horry, Fisher). By that logic, no team has ever won a championship because of the greatness of their best player, with the possible exception of the Houston Rockets in 1994.
Gasol made one all star, zero all NBA team before he joined Lakers. Since then, he got 2 more all star, 2 NBA 3rd team. Gasol never started in allstar BTW. And Kobe won one without Artest, Odom never made all star. Before joining the Lakers, nobody took Gasol as top 5 bigman in the league, maybe top 10. At best Gasol can be compared to Bosh's status today. If LeBron could win with the help of Bosh, AS, Boozer, nobody will be saying he's riding coattail, but Wade is a top 3 player in this league and had an FMVP. This is like Jordan couldn't beat Pistons and had to join Bird and Parish to do it. Even if he would be the best player in the team, it'd hurt his legacy. Don't pretend Kobe had a stacked team, we all know how Bynum got injured every playoff, how Lakers bench were outplayed in every round. And would you trade Wade for Odom and Artest/Ariza? Enough said.
This Kobe/Lebron argument is over. Kobe has 5 rings and Lebron has 0. Shaq was 1 in those 3 peat years and Kobe was 1a. Look up history and tell me how many guys can give you 25/5/5 as a no. 2 option like Kobe did? Nuff said.
Why do you think Gasol was traded to the Lakers?? Because Kobe whined about needing help. When Kobe finally became "the man" getting rid of Shaq and making the Lakers "his team", the Lakers were MEDIOCRE. He didn't "stick it out" to "help his legacy", he did hos best to FORCE A TRADE
You'd better find a pretty reliable quote that states that Kobe shipped Shaq out of the Lakers. Secondy, mediocre means average, or sub-par....now I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that the Lakers Kobe was stuck with weren't even that (I think a couple of members here have already pointed that out). Kobe did not whine...mmkay? He was visibly upset, and wanted the team to put better players around him so that he could win. Now can me a sceptic, but even though I'm a semi LeBron fan, I don't see why he couldn't have done the same...it's not like the Cavs wanted him to go- He could've asked for support, and in doing so he could've (well he DID get Shaq and Antwion Jamison) gotten even more SUPPORTING players. He could've told Cleveland that either he was gonna get help, or he was gonna leave. That's a perfectly reasonable demand for someone who truely wants to win. Well we know that didn't happen. Instead we get the hour long LeBronathon, in which he basically said "sorry guys, but I'm outta here", like he didn't even give the Cavs a chance. What I'm basically saying here is that LeBron's move is no less of a "dick move" than Kobe's, though I don't think either was. but it's just that the Kobe hate has grown to a unconformfortble level round here....guy gets no respect , even when MJ has spoken. You guys really need to realize that praising LeBron doesn't translate into hating Kobe, or the other way around. K guys? I'm so serial!
This Kobe/Lebron argument is completely pointless. Mentioning MJ and his legacy is also pointless. Bill Russell has 11 rings, MJ only has 6. Russell did it with many different players around him, he was the only constant. Therefore, Russell is the greatest player in the history of the NBA. In fact, I believe he is the greatest player in the history of American professional sports.
Gasol was still an all-star, even if he wasn't a starter. Shaq was the best player in the league while Kobe was "riding coattail." And while the Lakers teams of the last few years haven't been really deep, they have had the best five man unit in the league.
People did call Kobe "riding coattail" for his first 3 rings, although he's the game closer. It's natural for a good rookie to sign his first long contract with the team that drafted him. That's totally different from being an established superstar FA Kobe didn't want to share spotlight with Shaq no more when he's 25. He could and eventually Shaq would concede. But he wanted to be the clear-cut da man to get his ring. LeBron wasn't an alpha dog by nature. He couldn't handle pressure and he would quit in critical game.
Because Buss promised to bring quality support and all he got was Kwame (in expense of Butler) and Radman for reinforcement. They had a trade on table to get Kidd and they didn't want to give up Bynum, who couldn't beat Mihm and Kwame for starting spot at that time. It's not like he got Mo, Shaq, Jamison. Lakers didn't want to spend money and was looking at getting YM as FA. Basically Kobe was in Wade's shoes but in a much stronger conference. He had to score 40 to have a chance to win. Of course he wouldn't be happy with that. 3 seasons in the prime with NBDL quality team was very long, didn't Wade whine last season too? And isn't CP3 asking to be traded now?
have you seen them play without kobe? get league pass and watch them closely next year. if you forgot to catch them this playoffs where it was truly a team effort. kobe is their best player, but he didn't "carry" them per se.
so losing = quitting? if a player ever posted 27 points, 19 boards, 10 dimes, 3 steals, 9 turnovers, shut down d on paul pierce => and you call them a quitter in a crucial game 6... well, you must really hate the player or don't know jack about basketball. how the hell do you quit and put up a triple double AND shut down a top offensive player like pierce? how the hell do you even believe what you are typing? REPEAT THIS: triple double + shut down D -> a player is quitting. seriously? i call that go out BALLING. and your teammates just struggled in the spotlight. but hey, its understandable when you lose, you get criticsm. so criticize lebron all you want, but a QUITTER? just stop.
Thanks, I actually do have league pass . But Kobe hasnt missed many games his whole career, how can you judge the Laker's without Kobe if they havent played a large amount of games without him. Before Gasol got to the Lakers, he was labeled "soft". Lamar Odom is wildly inconsistent. Fisher is old. I mean the Lakers arent anymore talented than Dallas, Denver or Portlant. As a matter of fact, all those team are collectivley more talented than the Lakers. So the notion that Kobe is "lucky" is ridiculously IGNORANT. Basically a tired cop out. Williams Jamison Parker Big Z Gibson Shaq Moon All those guys are solid players. Heck, Jamison is VERY good. If ur argument is Lebron doesnt have a supporting cast than ur simply making excuses for a man who aint getting the job done. He can average 40pts in the regular season for all i care, but until he learns how to finish games he'll always be behind Kobe and Wade.
LeBron quit in game 5, he didn't play well in game 6, but he understood how he would be burned if he didn't even try.
so if lebron quit in that game, that's not as bad as kobe quitting in game 7 v. the suns several years ago (if you call what lebron did quitting, kobe was much worse). at least lebron still attacked the rim (hence 12 ft attempts in that game). kobe just stood around the 3pt line. so you blast lebron for this, while your boy kobe did it in a game 7 v. the suns. and another point, if lebron "didn't play well" in game 6, kobe must sucked in game 7 v. boston in the finals. please, have some standards.
Umm Jerry Buss refused to pay Shaq an inflated contract on the downside of his career so let him go....
