I counted 4 championships The first one was arguable he was still very young.........Shaq took the ship all the way.
Kobe was always the closer on the championship teams and the second best player at worst. You can throw out the Horrys and Kerrs to point out that number of rings doesn't equal greatness but it does when you are one of the best players on your team. If somebody wants to argue Duncan>Hakeem Duncan having twice as many rings is a valid point to factor in. It's not the end all but it is evidence of greatness when you are talking about Superstar players.
I am playing it with it..... I said if you really want to do it.... Kobe's first 2 championships he wasn't the closer that he is today. 3 ships remains.... still impressive
I am trying to say that he was very very young when he won first two championships and that helped him but he couldn't follow until he got Gasol.
Kobe was hurt in the first finals for games 2 and 3 so I can agree that he wasn't fully the closer in that series but he was the leading scorer in two of their four wins during the second championship run and was only outscored by 3 in one of the other wins.
deserves comparison as what? if it's the GOAT, then kobe isn't even close. if it's the greatest SG, then it's obvious cause lebron is a SF.
I did not say he was not great but as Sekou Smith said Both Jordan and Bryant worry too much about their legacy. http://hangtime.blogs.nba.com/2012/01/18/mj-kobe-and-everybody-else/?ls=iref:nbahpt1
I agree with your main point, but you listed some questionable comparisons. Shaq, Barkley, Ewing... maybe... but the rest of those guys shouldn't even be in the discussion.
I'm not trying to make this into a LeBron/whoever thread, but I think that the argument that he doesn't have that 'killer mentality,' or whatever you want to call it, doesn't make sense. If you listen to MJ, Kobe, LeBron, then you'll come out with the opinion that MJ and Kobe just have that fire. Obviously, they want to be the best at everything, and will **** on people that they don't think are in their league. MJ was right all of the time for his era; Kobe probably too. But just because someone does come out with a '***** everyone else attitude,' doesn't mean he's not a great basketball player. Just think about LeBron on Jordan's Bulls or Shaq's Lakers. I think he might be the best player we've ever seen in this game, but honestly there are too many variables to ever tell, so let's just enjoy his greatness while it lasts.
You take that away from their personalities and neither one would probably be as great as they were. That drive is what made them the superstars they are. You give T-Mac or Vince a Jordan/Kobe personality and they might have a few rings too.
It is something to Say that MJ who is known not to give credit and just be petty in compliments towards many of the things, infact just sort of take revenge on people, gave one person 'sort of' credit. We all know, he knows, MJ is the best. But he says even if there is someone who is not as good but can hold a candle because his life is just in and out basketall, on the court his desire to win, his will to work, dedication, commitment that it takes to make the game the most important thing in your life, there is kobe. So the fact that he sees some of himself in kobe is something he has never said for any other play that I have heard of. It is probably a testimony to the guys like lebron, dwight who have made moves that some ofthe old schoolers haven't Remember, Pippen was a top 5 MVP candidate the years that MJ retired. Don't be fooled, good players don't win championships, good Teams do. But it takes a culture and winning leader to demand the best of your players to do it. When your best player is not out there dancing nad horsing around, but working his ass off trying to kill it any time he is on the court, it doesn't matter how many direct assists he gets to help the team, he is making teammates better, he is rising the level of what it takes nad how hard you have to work. That is something PER can't measure in saying you make your teammates better. With ieverson, he was good so he slacked in culture, practice, and that sets the bar, teammmates can do whatever they want. But when your best damn player is out hustling you, you better step it up. Kudos to Mj, Kobe nad also to the young ones like Rose for being the hardest worker leaders on their team
I copped heat for mentioning those guys but I was simply trying to point out not all stars can carry a team. I included stars from different times. With TMAC - I had to include his name on the list because he is the perfect example. Just because you win scoring titles it doesnt mean you can carry a team. Then remember he had the "its on me" statement and he failed. I had to point that out. I thought Carter was an example in another way. Flashy, exciting, all the top 10 plays in the world (just like Jordan and Kobe) but not when it counts (unlike those two). Pierce and Garnet couldn't do it until they formed up and now we have Lebron. I was trying to point out a list of failures in comparison to the success of Jordan and Kobe. I was trying to say TMAC and Carter deserve the same dues as Malone and Barkely.
why you do put tmac in capital letters? I agree with Vince Carter, if you watch just his highlight reels you think he's the best player in the world, but if you watch his entire career, you realize he's soft and nowhere as tough as MJ. MJ led the league in scoring 10 times. good luck to Kobe trying to accomplish that.
