i'm not sure where you're going with all this. don't listen to me...listen to virtually every legal analyst out there. the guy is in deep, deep trouble. the evidence is high...he's facing the feds who put people away at a 95% clip...and who do not want to be embarassed in a high-profile case. he has co-defendants likely turning on him. he is no longer allowed to practice with his team. his endorsement deals are falling left and right. i think it is highly likely he will do SOME time. i don't know how much. but if he's negotiating off 6 years...i'm guessing he does at least 2. and with the new sentencing guidelines, my understanding is that means you actually do 2 years, or very close to that. then we'll see how the NFL deals with it. all of this is speculation to be sure....but this case is a perfect storm. it's the feds..the facts are distasteful..and the guy is being portrayed in the indictment as the man who keeps it all together. it isn't a drunken rage..a one-time mistake being prosecuted by Jim Bob and Billy Frank in Podunk County. the crimes they're prosecuting are systematic and occur over the course of many years. in that sense, it's very different from the sorts of allegations we normally see leveled at pro athletes.
what do you mean its a perfect storm, its a guy accused of dog fighting, athletes get accused of terrible things all the time. was kobe's trial a "perfect storm"? I don't understand what you mean by that.
did you read the rest of my post?? that's what i meant: it's the feds..the facts are distasteful..and the guy is being portrayed in the indictment as the man who keeps it all together. it isn't a drunken rage..a one-time mistake being prosecuted by Jim Bob and Billy Frank in Podunk County. the crimes they're prosecuting are systematic and occur over the course of many years. in that sense, it's very different from the sorts of allegations we normally see leveled at pro athletes.
He will get his day in court, but it sure looks like his days as an NFL player are over, and probably permanently. DD
Exactly. That statement was as absurd as yours. Do you think the media and protestors would be OK with all of this if it was someone else other than Michael Vick? Do you think if Peyton Manning was found to have a dog fighting compound in his back yard and was accused of torturing and killing animals, people wouldn't be pissed to the nth degree? You don't think he would lose endorsements? You don't think it would hurt his public image?
my position is that its ridiculous to suggest ending someone's career over dog fighting considering what some people have been accused of and even been found guilty of in the nfl.
Like what? Steroids? Doing drugs? I don't give a crap if Ricky Williams smokes weed. Big freaking deal. And how did the NFL deal with him? Theyve stopped him from playing. That's a completely different situation than someone promoting a barabric practice resulting in the death and torture of innocent dogs. What's worse???
and this is why i think you're missing the point. it's not merely dog-fighting. it isn't like they're accusing the guy of merely showing up to some fights or even just gambling on some fights.
like killing a woman drunk driving. jamal lewis just served time for conspiracy to distribute cocaine?
if you're involved in dog fighting you breed dogs, you kill them, you gamble, its no different from any dog fighting case.
except that this one is being prosecuted by the feds because it spanned 9 states. as you've said before...dog fighting gets you a year. it's the other charges that bring it to 6. we'll see what other charges the Feds add this month. but to pretend this isn't different, practically, whether you agree with it or not.... is to ignore the fact that everyone is dropping this guy like a bad habit right now. they're not printing his jerseys...nike dropped him...they're not printing football cards. this is unique. this isn't your run-of-the-mill case.
I think you seriously underestimate people's disgust for dog fighting in general. Killing a woman drunk driving is obviously terrible and they should be jailed and prosecuted to the maximum sentence allowed. However, most people who do this are completely remorseful and wish it never happened. People who engage in this act do it intentionally, enjoy it, and are completely emotionless to the pain and suffering. That's scary.
its only different because the feds are prosecuting it. its no different from any other case, other the feds want to make a statement, but that doesn't make the case unique. just like in any other crime involving a celebrity, its only unique because it involves a celebrity.
I'm not going to get into a pyschoanalysis debate over dog fighting. and I'm not going to entertain what's more valuable human lives or dogs.
Why bother debating? Here's some research: Overview Psychological studies have shown that individuals who take pleasure in inflicting harm on animals are more likely to do so to humans. One of the known warning signs of certain psychopathologies, including anti-social personality disorder, also known as psychopathic personality disorder, is a history of torturing pets and small animals, a behavior known as zoosadism. According to the New York Times, "[t]he FBI has found that a history of cruelty to animals is one of the traits that regularly appears in its computer records of serial rapists and murderers, and the standard diagnostic and treatment manual for psychiatric and emotional disorders lists cruelty to animals a diagnostic criterion for conduct disorders, though it should be noted that the inclusion of animal cruelty within this standard only began with DSM-IV. [1] "A survey of psychiatric patients who had repeatedly tortured dogs and cats found all of them had high levels of aggression toward people as well, including one patient who had murdered a young boy." [2] MacDonald Triad, indicators of violent antisocial behavior in children and adolescents. According to the studies used to form this model, cruelty to animals is a common (but not with every case) behavior in children and adolescents who grow up to become serial killers and other violent criminals. It has also been found that animal cruelty in children is frequently committed by children who have witnessed or been victims of abuse themselves. In two separate studies cited by the Humane Society of the United States (HSUS), roughly one-third of families suffering from domestic abuse indicated that at least one child had hurt or killed a pet.
that's not about dog-fighting, that's about little jeffery dahmer killing the family pet when he was a kid. which illustrates my point of how people are going over board with this with you even linking this to michael vick.
