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Midterms

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by rimrocker, Jul 16, 2010.

  1. tallanvor

    tallanvor Member

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    Yes but this is weird because Manchin has like a 65% approval rating as governor. Should be easy for him.
     
  2. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    From The Center for American Progress...

    [​IMG]
     
  3. Depressio

    Depressio Member

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    Sounds like a liberal/progressive/socialist/Marxist website, to me!
     
  4. thumbs

    thumbs Member

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    I'm all for significant cuts in the Department of Defense as well. However, I knew I was contributing to the derailment of your "Midterms" thread. I tried to make a limited observation while acknowledging that we were far afield from your 2010 elections thread.
     
  5. thumbs

    thumbs Member

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    That $69 billion, divided by the number of K-12 students in the United States, would be better used by statewide school districts for teacher pay and teaching tools. The programs you mentioned could easily be continued under the aegis of the various states with the stipulation the funds would be used as designated by federal law.

    Now, back to the elections.
     
  6. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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    Yeah I guess if we do away with the "Safe and Drug Free Schools" federal budget our schools won't be safe and drug free. All they have to do is slap a silly name on an entrenched bureaucracy and you shut your brain off.

    Why not start an "Essential Skills" program and give it a $10 billion budget. It will be beyond reproach, who could question it. Are you against essential skills?

    Abolish the entire department, what on earth is D.C. doing trying to manage education for the entire country, they can't even perform their constitutionally mandated duties properly.

    Even the name Dept. of Education is straight out of 1984.

    No thanks to the state dictating what children learn. They have an extremely poor track record in this regard.
     
  7. gifford1967

    gifford1967 Member
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    I'm really curious. Which countries do you think do a better job of educating their kids? And do these countries have a more or less centralized education system?
     
  8. Rashmon

    Rashmon Member

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    And you seriously believe state governments are more capable? Really? Because we all know that state governments have such a sterling record in governance.

    Under your proposed system, would you want your child to receive an education in South Carolina? Alaska? Arkansas? Mississippi?
     
  9. Depressio

    Depressio Member

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    I laugh at the idea that somehow state government is less corrupt/wasteful than the national government. Laugh, I tell you!
     
  10. thumbs

    thumbs Member

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    Fewer bureaucrats, more money for education ... simple equation. State government is just as wasteful as federal government, but why have two wasteful systems when you can have just one? Let's say there are 30,000,000 K-12 children. The $69 billion sent to a federal program could be divided so that each child gets somewhere between $2,000 to $3,000 in additional funding. Of course, much of that could go to teachers and teaching tools with certain federal mandates on how much money should be spent on designated programs.
     
  11. Depressio

    Depressio Member

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    I see your point for this, at least.

    Assume there's 20% (probably generous) waste at each level of government. With $1 billion at the federal level, it's reduced to $800M at the state level. Then perhaps down to $640M at the local level. And then (assuming local government is corrupt, too, which is probably a safe assumption given my cynicism) widdled down to $512M. So, through three levels of corruption, we lost $488M or a total of 48.8% of the original. This makes me sad.

    Of course, it's probably not so simplistic, but I wouldn't be surprised if it were true! It's like playing that kids' game "Telephone" -- pass it around too much, and the message gets lost.

    Still, I'd prefer to just fix the corruption/greed/stupidity myself. That's the idealistic personality talking, though.
     
    #371 Depressio, Sep 28, 2010
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2010
  12. mc mark

    mc mark Member

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    you forgot Texas
     
  13. thumbs

    thumbs Member

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    It's hard to dismiss idealism. I suffer from the same affliction.
     
  14. Depressio

    Depressio Member

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    Funny enough, when I have kids, I don't want them educated in Texas. If it happens it happens, but I'm going to try and avoid it. Somewhere in the northwest would be good... or perhaps Canada.
     
  15. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    We live in Texas. Given the record of the "leadership" of Perry and the Lege, how you can seriously believe that leaving the education of our kids entirely in the hands of those fools is beyond my understanding. They have been incompetent. Hell, that word is far too mild. While I'm not crazy about the Federal government using our tax dollars to coorce the states into following policies wanted by Washington (like state speed limits), in this case, Texas desperately needs the extra funding, and the state needs someone to force state government to fund education.

    "tea partiers" rage on about government interference, but Ms. Perry and the GOP "leaders" in the Lege have cost the state huge amounts of Texas tax dollars sent to Washington that we could have gotten back to spend on education and a hell of a lot more, accusing the Feds of forcing "unfunded mandates" on the state, which is hilarious, because Perry and the GOP Lege have crammed unfunded state mandates onto state school districts over and over again. Exactly what they accuse "terrible Washington" of doing. The ****ing hypocrites.

    In short, in my opinion, you are wrong, thumbs. :)


    Good luck with that, man. When you actually are a father, get back to us and tell us how that worked out for you. Reality can be a b****.
     
  16. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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    A system where the school has autonomy and parents control funding is ideal. That's why the Obamas send their kids to such a school.

    Belgium would be a good example, although it is by no means perfect.

    Charter schools have autonomy, but still rely largely on the state for funding Which means the parents can think the charter school sucks but as long as it can keep getting state funding it won't go away.

    Eva Moskowitz and Harlem Success are the model. They are state funded, but not state controlled. She has autonomy.

    <object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/asd6wTlkVAk?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/asd6wTlkVAk?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

    The one simple act of tieing funding to parents would change everything. Schools no one wanted to attend would lose funding and go away, and schools that did well would expand.
     
  17. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    Oregon seems to have good curriculum, but the school year is one of the shortest in the country because of budget shortfalls at the state level. My kids didn't start until September 7 and they will get out on June 10... and there are 7 Mondays of no school (Budget Days) aside from regular holidays.
     
  18. mc mark

    mc mark Member

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    I can't beleve there are people that think abolishing the Department of Education is a good idea!

    really?!?!?

    What is happening to thoughtful conservatives is this country?
     
  19. thumbs

    thumbs Member

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    I agree with your assessment of the poor educational agenda administered by Perry and the legislature. I don't foresee much improvement under White.

    BTW, tea parties are very unhappy with the current Texas school system as well as federal oversight. I am not alone in my suggestions to reform the current system, although one big internal tea difference is "local control." Many want local control extended, and others (like me) want it centralized for economy and equalization.

    I know my suggestions are not the only solutions, but we have to do something to get more money to the teachers and school children. Taxing more just puts more money in the hands of the empire builders -- not the classrooms.
     
  20. tallanvor

    tallanvor Member

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    The only argument I have seen presented against it is that state governments are more corrupt then federal ones so we shouldn't leave education up to the states. That feels pretty weak to me. Throw out something stronger.
     

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