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Meet Me in the Middle

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by MadMax, Sep 5, 2023.

  1. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Contributing Member

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    Why do you keep coming up with these weird misappropriations? A pitcher "literally writes in the name of the catcher on the lineup card" - who said that?.... The manager asks and then gives the pitcher who he wants. The line-up then belongs to the manager's.

    First of all, you assume this doesn't happen. It's possible Dusty has tried to talk these guys into Diaz - or maybe the pitching coach has?

    But no manager would defy a pitcher like that - certainly not a pitcher of Verlander's ilk. They just wouldn't. But, to answer your question: if Dusty felt strongly about it, I'm sure he would make the case and work with the pitcher on it.

    Consider another context: Who do you think dictates rest for the pitchers? No manager is going to throw a guy on four days rest if the pitchers says no. They don't defy these guys. Why would a catcher preference be treated any differently? You want your pitcher at max potential. If they tell you they're more likely to reach that with six days rest + XYZ catcher......

    And look, let me be clear: not all pitchers have a preference. But those that do... you listen to them. These are adults with a tremendous amount of experience and respect for one another.
     
  2. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Contributing Member

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    Do you even understand what this statement means?......
     
  3. lnchan

    lnchan Sugar Land Leonard

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    Maybe it is time to expand who is on our ignore lists...
     
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  4. Tomstro

    Tomstro Member

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    Look at our pitchers ERA’s to determine the difference between this year and last. Your arguments are ****ing stupid. Nobody is saying anything about injuries. We are only saying that Diaz and Chas make the team better if they are playing C and CF everyday. Also, our pitchers don’t perform well enough to be picking their catchers. You’re just doing mental gymnastics to try and say that we aren’t better with better players playing. If we lose close games in the playoffs and we don’t have our best team in there, you will try more gymnastics but nobody will listen. There are 2 or 3 others that will defend Dusty no matter what. They are your people. Go talk to them. The rest of us just know baseball and would never be swayed by your biased arguments.
     
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  5. Tomstro

    Tomstro Member

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    Lol. So ****ing stupid.
     
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  6. Screaming Fist

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    I don’t think Dusty has tried to talk these guys into having Diaz catch. If that were true then I would expect Diaz to have caught Framber at least once under the rationale that those two need some familiarity should the unthinkable happen and the Astros were to lose Maldy for the remainder of the season.

    The fact that that hasn’t happened, along with comments Dusty has made, indicates to me that he believes Maldy is a better catcher than Diaz which is why he’s the primary catcher. I think the “pitchers prefer Maldy” thing is more of an excuse than the actual reason driving his decision making.
     
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  7. lnchan

    lnchan Sugar Land Leonard

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    Everyone insisted on having McCann as their catcher in 2017... but guess what... he only played 97 games despite only batting .020 points lower than Gattis and .010 points higher than Centero. Yet, Maldonado has already exceeded those 97 games with a month to go this year despite INFERIOR IN EVERY CATEGORY TO HIS BACKUPS.
     
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  8. lnchan

    lnchan Sugar Land Leonard

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    I also remember the Astros literally pulling a social media post in April that pointed out that the team was 8-0 in Diaz catcher starts when we were hovering around .500.
     
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  9. lnchan

    lnchan Sugar Land Leonard

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    So are you saying AJ Hinch was misguided with this? @Hey Now! ? Keuchel had the pedigree considering he has a Cy Young by the time of this article.

    https://www.chron.com/sports/astros...r-A-J-Hinch-says-he-won-t-assign-11107713.php

    Astros manager A.J. Hinch says he won't assign personal catchers
    So far this season, starting pitcher Dallas Keuchel has pitched exclusively to newly acquired veteran catcher Brian McCann and Charlie Morton to Evan Gattis.

    Keuchel (4-0, 1.22 ERA) has looked like the southpaw ace who won the 2015 AL Cy Young award, but Astros manager A.J. Hinch insisted the pairings are not rigidly defined. He alluded to schedule changes. A rainout on April 16 in Oakland jostled the rotation.

    "I'm not going to have the personal catcher every single time," Hinch said before Friday's game against the Athletics, in which Gattis would receive Morton for the fifth time.


    Unlike Keuchel, Morton (1-2, 4.29 ERA) consistently has labored in and out of jams in three of his four starts. Still, Hinch explained his choice for catcher depends more on lineup configurations.

    "McCann's going to catch Morton eventually," Hinch said. "Keuchel is eventually, probably, going to have to pitch to Gattis."

    Both catchers have made Hinch "completely comfortable" picking either to start. They have hit similarly well through 22 games. Gattis, a fifth-year righty with more gap power than McCann, is hitting .289 with two home runs and 11 runs batted in. McCann, a left-handed pull hitter, in his 13th season, is batting .279, with three home runs and 11 runs batted in.

    Several teams in baseball likely would bat Gattis or McCann in the heart of their lineups because of their tape-measure shot capabilities. Hinch has the luxury of a deep lineup.


    "That's a great strength of ours to have," Hinch said. "Two close to middle-of-the-order bats to choose from behind the plate."
     
  10. Screaming Fist

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    No you see in my kid’s select league the pitchers get to pick their catcher so clearly a MLB manager cannot defy a pitcher wanting the same.
     
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  11. lnchan

    lnchan Sugar Land Leonard

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    I would have a major league catcher has enough gumption to tell a pitcher's parent <cough> Jan Pressly <cough> what's going down more than a Little League manager.
     
  12. Joe Joe

    Joe Joe Go Stros!
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    Screenshot 2023-09-12 154153.png
     
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  13. lnchan

    lnchan Sugar Land Leonard

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    Where's the circle of 'one player doesn't make a difference'?
     
  14. IdStrosfan

    IdStrosfan Member

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    Managers move the needle when they determine who is in the game and who is eating banana pudding on the bench.

    The bottom line is that over 162 games, when the chances of winning are diminished 5% every game by not playing the best players, the season will end with 5-10 more losses than if the best players played everyday.

    Call it math. Call it luck. Call it the law of averages.

    In 162 games, the best players have to rest. This isn't 1975. But a good manager will still play the best players 95% of the time. Dusty doesn't do that and it's simply unrealistic to think it has not cost the team wins.
     
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  15. BMoney

    BMoney Contributing Member

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    Your argument does not account for the physical and mental well-being of players going into the playoffs, or the understanding that a manager has about his players. Do players peak later because of the faith, or trust their manager has in them when they are struggling? Are inconsistent performance linked to inconsistent lineups? Is it better to keep the full squad engaged and ready, or do you lock in with your playoff roster two months before they start?

    I pose all of these questions because I don't know and I don't think anybody from the outside of the clubhouse could know.
    I have questioned every manager of every team I have ever followed. I thought AJ Hinch cost us a title in 2019 through how he handled his bullpen.I think Dusty has made some head scratching moves, too.

    I just think the hysteria around him this year is a bit much.

    Their pitching fell off sharply after June. Their hitting has been inconsistent. Two, of their three best hitters, Yordan and Altuve, have missed significant chunks of the year. Yet, here they are. The Astros are in contention and have a shot. All things are possible with this team. Dusty is part of that equation.
     
  16. Tomstro

    Tomstro Member

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    So what about Bregman and Tucker’s mental well being? They play everyday. Remember that Dusty said that Chas “isn’t a big boy yet”. Yeah he said that to the ****ing media. He also said that if he had Rodriguez, who’s number aren’t as good as Chas’ numbers, that he would play him everyday in CF. You can’t be more of an a$$hole manager to say something like that about your player. Dusty has sucked beyond belief this year. Yes we are still in first. That ain’t because of Dusty. Just like our title wasn't because of him.
     
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  17. BlindHog

    BlindHog Member

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    The top of the lineup is not missing any longer, and Diaz > Maldonado is significantly changing the results every time Maldy starts or is left in the game after the starting pitcher is done for the day. No matter who the starting pitcher is there is simply no excuse for leaving Maldy in the game after the pen takes over. Diaz should be in every game where the starter does not pitch a complete game. Replacing Maldonado at bats should be a priority in every game. I do not think much of Diaz's game behind the dish. Everyone knows I preferred Lee over Diaz. But there are only two options left and I have to admit Diaz gives us a much better chance to win games than our only other option. I do not like it much but it is cathartic to recognize the truth and move on. You should give it a try.
     
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  18. lnchan

    lnchan Sugar Land Leonard

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    Maldy as a single player with a base running blunder just cost us a run or so. Just saying.
     
  19. cmlmel77

    cmlmel77 Up all Night Watching Houston Sports

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    Already done. He is a waste of time - completely ignores the actual point to ramble about last year, injuries, etc. It’s such a simple question (“Has not playing Chas and Diaz as full time regulars cost the Astros games in a close division race?”) with such an obvious answer (“yes”).

    Anyone who cannot see that, or refuses to acknowledge it, is not worth reading.
     
  20. Tomstro

    Tomstro Member

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    I don’t put people on ignore but I understand. He is an insufferable Dusty fluffer.
     
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