DrN, I was following you (though not really agreeing) most of the way until you said "perhaps he desirres to be a key player for a team that will have sucess in the playoffs". Come on now, the Bulls have had the worst record in the league over what 5 years and again had the worst record in the league. Their outlook for playoff success is next to nil, at least for the next few years. By the time their young talented players become good, if they do become good, their veterans will be on their last legs. On some other points: I think JW will be a good player but I don't expect him to have a good assist-TO ratio nor to be real good about getting his guys the ball when they want the ball--at least for quite some time. I would be willing to bet Marshall's FG% with the Bulls will be a lot closer to what it was with GS than it was with the Jazz--and its it more fun to get open, get the ball, and knock down shots at a decent clip than having to rush shots out of the flow of an offense and miss far more often then you make it. It seems to me Donyell is going into much the same situation he was in GS and the Bulls are falling in the same trap of GS a few years ago. Having a mediocre to bad team that is bipolar--where the talent is either young or on the downhill side but not much in between--is not a good place to have a franchise. We saw how much TC, Starks, Chris Mills and Co on their downhill slide helped the development of Jamison, Dampier, Foyle, V. Cummings, and Hughes as team player (not sure if he played on a Mills team or not)--I would say not very much. Again though, I don't fault the decision too much by the Bulls--I think they got a pretty good player at a very good price even if he may already be 30, but for DM perspective all I can think is he isn't very bright or is more interested in padding his stats (except for FG%) while his team loses.
I just don't think the Bulls are putting all their eggs in the basket of Messers Chandler and Curry! Rose is an established veteran who they're looking to build around, and I think Donyell and a reasonable showing from JWill is enough to get them to the playoffs. Perhaps you're right in that it doesn't make much sense for Donyell - personally I think that it makes sense for him, and my opinion is that he'll show some veteran qualities there. From memory, his last 1/2 season in Golden State wasn't unduly awful FG% wise (I think it was 45 for that half season compared with 33 first half - my brother is a Golden State fan...) and if he only manages that sort of %, then he's not doing terribly badly! On JWill - I think he's fortunate to have a point-forward(ish) type in Rose who can take the pressure off his decision making to a small degree. If his rookie season resembles Millers (with the ability to hit outside shots) then the Bulls should be pretty happy with it! I'm going out on a limb in suggesting playoffs for the Bulls, but let's wait and see!
As for why Marshall might want to leave Utah, you ever try living in Salt Lake City as a black man? It's not as if he was going anywhere in Utah either.
Uh.... don't play that race card again please. Karl Malone is a black man and he is hated everywhere *except inside Utah*.
hey gettingbranded whats up man desert scar, do you really think utah is headed anywhere BUT the lottery? sure they have a relistic shot this season, but malone and stock will be gone after this year, why would marshall stick with a rebuilding team like the jazz when theres a bulls team right there in the last stages of its own rebuilding and ready to start winning? the jazz have knowhere to go but down, and the bulls dont have anywhere to go but up
IKK, the Bulls should go up, but will get now where near the playoffs until well after the last bit of skill in DM is roasted out of him (by that time he won't be a major player). If I were DM there are few teams I would want to go to less than the Bulls (based on the low current level of skilled players and extreme youth). DM is no 20 year old spring chicken who would enjoy another 3 years of brutal frustration ball before the team gets decent. Also, any friendly wagers that the Bulls have a better record than the Jazz next year? As much as I dislike them, I'll take the Jazz, they should be around 500, no worse than 400.
I don't think the Bulls will win as many as the Jazz, but I think the Bulls will win 30-35 this year and contend for the playoffs next year. Marshall and Rose are both 29. It's not like they are past their primes by any means. And next year will be Curry and Chandler's 3rd year, the time when high school picks usually start to be consistent players. Fizer and Crawford may not be worth where they were drafted, but both will be nice offensive contributors off the bench. Bulls will start: PG - Jay Williams SG - Jalen Rose SF - Donyell Marshall PF - Tyson Chandler (best overall defender) CT - Eddy Curry (best post scorer) Off the bench: Jamal Crawford Trenton Hassell Eddie Robinson Marcus Fizer Corie Blount Bulls have alot of multi-position players and they can put alot of lineups out on the floor to take advantage of mismatches. I don't see how that team doesn't at least get 30 wins this year, and contend for playoffs next year. This is a much deeper, talented, and experienced team then Chicago has had during their last 4 years in siberia.
There front line may be the worst in the league and their team defense will be among the worst as well. Sure they are going to get better, but ya'll seem to forget how far they have to go. It is not like they were 2, let alone, 1, player away. It is a big leap to get from league dreg to mediocre-poor, and another leap from mediocre-poor to playoff contender. I have seen over an over again where people over assess young talent, overlooking results. It was Vancouver a few years ago ("wow, what a nucleaus of Bibby, MD, SAR will be"), the Nuggests ("boy, with McDyess, Lafrenz, NVE, Posey--they will bust out"), GS (Jamison, Hughes, Forston, Dampier, Blaylock), people say this about the Clips every other year as well. I don't by it until I see Ws translated except under very unusual circumstances (like us, where half our squad was injured, we were above 500 the year before, and add 2 rookies with potential immediate impact). The Bulls have some young guys who have shown flashes. They have a very good veteran (Rose) who will be 30 before mid-season, a solid 29 year old forward who has never quite settled into a position, and a very explosive and gifted rookie PG but one with a long learning curve to run an NBA offense. They also have lost more games than any other team over the last 5 years. I would be very surprised if they made the playoffs within 2 years and not suprised at all if they didn't make it within the next 4 year. I see the Bulls closer to where GS was about 4 years ago--something DM was very familiar with and I don't think it was much fun, of course this is just my opinion.
its obvious you havent watched the bulls much after the rose trade and are severely underrating jay williams, donyell marshell tyson and eddy, eddy is already a very capable scorer RIGHT NOW, he scored 24 points on dale davis in 18 minutes when the bulls played the blazers, tyson scored 19 points and pulled down 16 rebounds against the pistons and ben wallace, you just have to see them to realize that playoffs NEXT year isnt out of the question especially considering that the top 3 teams in the east PISTONS, CELTICS, and the NETS were all in the LOTTERY last year, but with the aquisition of capable veterans in cliffy robinson, rodney rogers, tony delk, and jason kidd, these three bottom dwelling teams made the playoffs in the lowly eastern conference
The thing is, the Bulls won 21 games last year. Most of their players will improve noticeably this season, because of the number of young players on the team. Add in Jay Williams and Donyell Marshall, and the fact the Crawford and E-Rob were out with injuries most of last year, and it's easy to see how the Bulls can get an additional 9+ wins this year.
If they all stay healthy,play good defense and pass the ball to get good shots,they can win around 35 games maybe even more.
Bulls will go as far as Jay pushes them. They need (little more than usual) from Marshall. Rose must have a very good year. Bench must be healthy. Curry & Tyson must be poductive. Fizer must become a factor.
I am not arguing the Bulls won't get at least 30 wins next year or have some good prospects--but ya'll are underestimating the rest of the league. The Bulls should hit at least 30 wins, but that is still only at best halfway to "playoff contention". As far as I can tell, only 2 teams will obviously be worse than the Bulls in the whole league. Even in the weak East, the Bulls are only a solid bet to be better than one team, Cleveland. The 8 EC playoff teams from last year are much better than the Bulls, as are Milw (still loaded on offense), NY (should improve w/McDyess), & Atl (added Big Dog to SAR and Terry, maybe get Ratlif back too). The Bulls might be better than Washington (if Jordan doesn't play and the team returns to the gutter) or Miami (even more of a reach the Bulls pass them)--but I kind of doubt that too, at least for next year. It is not that they are not getting better, but most of ya'll are seriously underestimating how far they have to go and the level of competence in all the others teams except Cleveland (although if Wagner and Miles blow up, and Davis continues to progress--they may be about the level of the Bulls) and Denver (who I admit there is no way the Bulls can possibly underperform them next year).
A recent article about this: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketball/news/2002/08/27/bulls_preview/ -QUOTE- How will the Baby Bulls develop? Chicago's future hinges on the development of two players who will be just 19 years old when camp opens: Curry and Chandler. Both players struggled mightily during the first half of last season but dialed it up a notch during the second half. Chandler still needs to put on muscle, but at 7-foot-1 and with good athletic skills, he drew comparisons to a young Ralph Sampson. Best of all, he became more aggressive on the glass as the year went on, and is learning how to use his length to dominate defensively. Curry was even better last season, flashing a surprisingly effective mid-range jumper and turning into a bona fide scoring threat down the stretch. He has the opposite problem of Chandler -- keeping his weight under control will be his biggest struggle. If he can stay in shape, he has a bright future, because his offensive skills could make him a star. Even with his struggles out of the gate, he finished last year at 50 percent from the floor. ... The soft frontcourt and absence of a superstar means the Bulls will need everything to break perfectly to make the playoffs. However, 30 wins looks quite attainable. -QUOTE-
Of the Eastern Conference teams, here's who I think improved, stayed the same, or declined. NJ - Impoved (Mutombo, Rogers) BOS - Stayed the same (get Baker, lose Anderson, Rogers) ORL - Improved (if Hill is healthy) PHI - Stayed the same (maybe decline without Mutombo) WAS - Stayed the same (How much will MJ play?) MIA - Improved (if Mourning is healthy) NY - Improved (McDyess) DET - Improved (Billups) NO - Improved (Courtney Alexander) TOR - Stayed the same (Lost Keon, VC should be better) IND - Improved (if Harrington healthy) MIL - Declined (Lost Glenn Robinson) ATL - Improved (got Big Dog) CLE - Declined (Lose Andre Miller) Out of the Eastern Conference teams, I count 6 teams pretty much staying the same or declining. To say most of the East Conference is improving as much as the Bulls is an overstatement, I believe. Looking at the teams, I think New Jersey improved the most. They got a tough lineup, maybe the best defensive lineup in the NBA. PG - Kidd SG - Kittles SF - Jefferson PF - Martin CT - Mutombo MAIN BENCH Chris Childs Luscious Harris Rodney Rogers Aaron Williams Jason Collins
That wasn't what I said. My point is you have to factor how much the team improved relative to where they are coming from . The Bulls have the farthest to go to be playoff competitive. Think about it this way. Milwalkee, a non EC playoff team declined. The Bull a non-playoff team improved. Now how many believe the Bulls will have a better record than the Bucks next year? I stand pretty firm the only team in the EC the Bulls are a safe bet to be better than is Cleveland. They might be better than Washington or Miami--but I wouldn't count on either as a sure bet for next year. So I would say the greater overstatement is that the Bulls will be knocking down the playoff door next year. They have a lot to prove before I would even say they will be knocking down the playoff door in 2-3 years. People are acting like they only have to leapfrom 1 or 2 teams to be in playoff contention--and that just isn't the case.
