I think most people are sympathetic to both sides of the story (why I think protesting impacting mass transit will backfire). There was a somewhat similar incident in the 80s where vigilant justice was exposed, and the perpetrator was prosecuted. I might dig up more information on that later if I have time.
Ya exactly. At a baseline the "moderates" in America are sympathetic to both sides. That is a psychopathic baseline. Most people overseas would have zero tolerance for a dude rear naked choking a homeless man for 10 minutes regardless of what the dude was yelling before hand. We just have to both sides everything huh.
I'm one of those who consider both sides in this case. Now, I lean towards prosecution, so both sides have weighty components to them. What would you want him to be charged with?
Second degree murder. He didn't walk into the train cart expecting to murder someone so it wasn't premeditated. But I want you to sit in a chair and set a timer for 5 minutes and just stare at a wall and remember the report is that it was a 10 minute choke hold. So ya eventually the dude intended to murder because no one holds someone in a choke like that for multiple minutes, let alone 10 minutes, not wanting to do a murder. So second degree. America got a both sides everything huh.
I also find cases like these important because in a way they set precedent for the value of life and basic human dignity for homeless people. A trial like this can show the world how much value we put in life of those who are mentally ill and homeless.
I already said that it's excessive, and that's why I think he should be prosecuted. Him being restrained for fear of him possibly doing something bad seems reasonable enough. Those are my two sides. FWIW - I didn't know how deadly a chokehold procedure could be and had to read up on that before concluding it's excessive. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one who was ignorant about the procedure.
I think any modern human raised in the modern education system understands what happens when you restrict airflow and blood to the brain for 10 minutes. Again set a timer for 5 minutes and stare at a wall. Think of all the passing thoughts you went through in that time. Think of the amount of thought that went into this guy's head while strangling his neck for 10 minutes. This is similar to the George Floyd situation of a dude putting his knee on someone's neck for 8 minutes straight obviously knowing what the effect is going to be. So similar charge as what Chauvin got. Similar circumstance prior also with a rowdy individual who was loud and imposing.
What is the average of tweets you've posted from Charlie Kirk that turned out to be accurate? About .113?
Do you understand that we are discussing the justification of murder? Is that something you forgot? Or are you one of those types that devalue human life where feeling uncomfortable is a worthy enough cause to end life?
Preventing operators and countless other uninvolved parties from working and earning their livelihoods. That’ll teach em. Lol
I think we all know what happens when you restrict airflow or blood. We also see chokeholds used regularly in martial arts as a submission technique, and I didn't think much about it other than that. Can it be used only for submission and not for restricting airflow or blood? I didn't know the answer, but from what I read, no.
Are you thinking of the Bernie Goetz situation Where a white man shot three black teenagers on. NYC subway? He was convicted but also a lit of people considered him a hero.
I don’t know exactly what you mean by psychotic baseline but if you’re talking about that many Americans express fear and unease about mentally I’ll and homeless people yes that is greater in the US than it is in other countries. I would argue though that it is psychotic when there are many incidences especially in the last few years of seemingly random attacks by mentally ill and homeless people. In the last few years there’s been many attacks by mentally ill on Asians including in public transit. That history doesn’t justify this case as any situation of use of force has to be considered with the specific threat but ignoring that there are actual assaults by the mentally ill homeless comes off as callous and out of touch also.
The cutting of blood flow and airflow is submission. The pressure on the back of the neck by many of these techniques also causes a lot of physical pain. That thought can cause a lot of stress in the body and particularly the heart. That’s why many of the deaths from these are listed as cardiac failure. We have to consider these as part of a range of use of force. In competitive martial arts we have to release when the opponent submits or passed out. Using these in an LE situation it should be when the have the suspect under control, cuffed. As we saw with George Floyd Chauvin had Floyd very well under control but kept the technique in even though other LEO were asking him to take it off. It looks to me like Chauvin was no longer using it as a control technique but as punishing Floyd.
I think that Penny didn’t intend to kill Neely but what’s not clear is what was Penny’s training. This is a fundamental difference between this situation and the killing of George Floyd because Chauvin was both trained and also asked by another LEO to move Floyd to the recovery position. In this case other bystanders do ask Penny to move Neely to his side (the recovery position) and he is moved but at that point is dead already.
u don’t need training to know that putting someone in a chokehold for 15 minutes will likely kill them
