Exactly. The whole issue of the law of standard terms and conditions is far from being settled - since the days of Karl Llewellyn and even before that. It's actually quite interesting, especially in the online context. I think that the focus on consumer protection against unconscionable terms will increase in American jurisprudence over the next few years, especially when more cases of abuse in the online context will be popping up - same thing with software EULA. Just because I try to unilaterally impose terms on the other side doesn't always mean they are enforceable. And if the terms I try to impose are ambiguous, I need to have it held against me, which means that if it's my own fault that it is unclear, I cannot enforce the term.
GOOD GRIEF, PEOPLE!!!!! Why is this an argument at all?!@? OK people, this is how it works: Waiter's know there are good tipper's and bad. Nobody is "obligated" to pay a tip. The jackass in this story is included. This case WILL be dismissed, and the jackass in this suit now gets to countersue. The 15-18% automatically added is a suggestion. You are by no means obligated to pay it, ever. Certain races and genders are notoriously "bad" tipper's. Waiter's know this and will give sub-par service out of predjudice. Again, if the waiter doesn't like this, they will get out of the business. Just like every other job out there. Bad tipper's at least give waiter's great stories to b**** with fellow waiter's. The fact that there is a debate about this is laughable! Waiter's know they get paid FARRR more than the minimum wage. Quit yer b****in' or work someplace else. (the surprising part is I am a good tipper. !5% on food, 20% on drinks, pretty much regardless of service. I want them to remember me next time)
Can our in-house lawyers confirm this? Does a restaurant have the right to refuse service for anyone? What and where are the rules for the restaurant displayed? Can they just make up any rules they want? I can understand "no shirt, no shoe, no service" but can they enforce a "shirt and tie" or formal dress rule? Can the restaurant deny service to mr. Taveras the next time he shows up? In general, if a restaurant knew of a previous trouble-maker, can they refuse to let the man in?
You are asking many different questions in one post. I don't think we have all the facts about what rules were displayed. No, they cannot just make up ANY rules they want - well, they can, but if they are unconscionable, they are not enforcable. Yes, they can enforce a "shirt and tie" or formal dress rule, if they want. Yes, they can refuse service to him, since they are a private entity and there is no obligation for them to enter into a contract with someone with whom they do not want to agree to a contract. Yes, if a restaurant knows of a previous trouble-maker, they can refuse to let the man in, for the same reason. All this is just being said based on general principles. If someone is a member of a minority or whatever, there might be special anti-discrimination laws or there might be other specific laws for special cases which might lead to a different outcome from what I just posted.
The mandatory tip for large parties is a very common practice. Any adult American with even modest restaurant-going experience is familiar with the system and knows that it is mandatory. I think his claim that he was ignorant of the terms of service to be laughable. He knew, and I'm glad he was arrested. Sounds like a jerk. But, I still hate the whole system of tipping and wish we could be rid of it. Among its many, many problems, I've found it turns waiters into real jerks. Besides the complaints about bad tippers in internet BBSes, it creates an animosity in the restuarant between cook staff and wait staff. The wait staff is always upset because cook staff jeopardizes their tips by being late of making bad food. The cook staff resents the wait staff because they make more money and complain about their tips, when the cooks are working for a straight wage. I good childhood friend was a career waiter and I'd hear him complaining about his customers. He's got everyone pegged as soon as they come through the door. A group of white businessmen after work are good. They'll order big dinners and beer. They want to impress one another with their big spending. A group of women after church is terrible, they're all pinching pennies. A couple of a first date is pretty good. The woman will hardly eat, but they may have wine and the guy will tip well to impress. Once they get married though, they're terrible. Suddenly, the money belongs to both of them and they want to keep it: no wine, minimal tip, though the woman will at least eat a bit better. Black people are terrible tippers, apparently. Old people are terrible too, they're on fixed incomes, plus they're very particular about everything. He's made up his mind on you when you come in and provides service according to your profile. I'd never sit at his table, though it seems that many seasoned waiters are the same. He was once a happy little Smeagol, but he's been twisted and transformed by the terrible power of the tip. He seems to be a good, successful waiter at least, but he's jaded.
Juan Valdez: He may be jaded, but he's fairly accurate. Tipping is stupid, but we're used to it. Learn it and live it. BUT it is not legally enforceable, and the cop who arrested this guy is an idiot.
Teachers are also pegged as bad tippers, especially when on lunch break and in groups where they will undoubtedly want separate checks. But hey, those are the breaks. Unfortunately those stereotypes are dead on a good percentage of the time depending on the restaurant. The problem for him is that he lets those stereotypes affect his work. There is always an exception that will blow the stereotype out of the water. I always made it a point to give exceptional service to the people many other waiters stereotyped. I knew they were probably often used to less than average service because they were pegged as poor tippers. Many times they lived up to the stereotype, but other times they saw that I cared about their experience and usually gave a decent if not great tip.
On the whole, I find the restaurant experience in Europe so much better. The gratuity is already included in the overall price and the waitstaff never rushes you to order or leave. And the food is soooo much better
Good point, Pimp. When I waited tables, I heard the same exact stereotypes, including one about servicemen and women (I worked close to the Great Lakes Navy somethinganother in Waukegan, IL). However, I never let it affect how I treated them over other groups, and I would have to say those negative stereotypes were shattered the vast majority of the time.
do people in America Tip 18%????? that is alot, in holland we tip about 10% And most people do not even do that. Waiting for the dutch are cheap jokes
Same in Germany, I tip more, mostly influenced by my time in the US and an inherent unwillingness to be called cheap.
When i travel i tell the street vendors i'm a teacher from Holland.... They quickly stop harrassing me!
What about the fact that the waiters just need to do their jobs, regardless of the tip? To look professional and all... of course, a lot of people in these jobs are thinking about short-term gratification, and they stereotype you. Teachers probably aren't the greatest tippers. We just don't have that much spending money. Usually we at least do the 15% though. We eat out a lot at the cheaper sit-down restaurants (just Chili's type places) and I wonder if we get stereotyped. The tip is supposed to be a percentage of the total cost and we always order the cheap items with no alcohol. No desserts or appetizers either. So they don't get that much out of us (though it could be worse; at least we get sodas instead of water). This is just the way it is based on our lifestyle and our budget. Still, though, if you provide us decent service, we'll be good repeat customers, and isn't that worth more in the long run? Of course, our immediate waitperson is not thinking of the long run. Ferdinand always tips the exact 15%. I usually throw more coins on the pile (even if it was his turn to pay) if the service has been decent. If you didn't refill our drinks, then you're not getting a whole lot extra. If you were really nice or we came in late at night or something, I throw in a lot extra. I don't really calculate it though, past the initial 15%.
I rarely tip more than 15% at expensive restaurants (though i almost always hit the 15% mark) unless the service was excellent, or i'm particularly drunk. At breakfast, I'll easilly tip 50% or more as those waitresses work their buns off for much, much less money. (and it seems they're always refilling coffee and generally running about). Somehow i figure the extra $3-$4 at breakfast is more appreciated (and better earned). Plus anytime you can be a bigshot for under $5, you really can't lose.
