The public purpose of codebreaker is actually legal and I think other teams do it. It was to find opposing pitchers' tells and see if they could figure out how they do signs, but not to relay anything live during the game - you just learn it so that when you're on 2nd base, you can figure out the signs. That "relaying things live" part is where things went awry. Here's an old article on it: https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-as...er-the-players-took-it-from-there-11581508800 In 2016, Houston third baseman Alex Bregman, then a rookie, mentioned to video room staffers at one point that other teams were better at stealing signs when runners were on second base than the Astros, according to a person familiar with the matter. Three people familiar with the matter said that Bregman wasn’t telling the Astros to cheat, but rather suggesting that they could find a way to decode signs legally. ... “I have no proof that it has worked, but we get real good dope on pitchers tipping and being lazy. That information, if it’s not already, will eventually yield major results in our favor once players get used to the implementation.”
Want to work in baseball again? Depend a lot on the owners. I was not expecting to be treated the way I was treated at the end by the owners of the Astros. If I trusted the owners & team had potential, if I wanted to do it again, I know I could. At the same time, I've taken a hard look at the NFL, the NBA, a little NHL, e-sports, soccer,...I'm considering all my options at this point. Why was now the proper time to speak out? After I was suspended & fired, I wanted to take some time to reflect. I knew that things were being said about me that were wrong. I also knew MLB was investigating other teams. The Red Sox investigation, I didn't want to get in the middle of that. Then the pandemic hit. Then the season started and once the season started, I wasn't going to say anything until the Astros were done playing. I didn't want to take away from anything they were trying to do this year. It's been hard to read and hear how I've been portrayed in the media. Think about for a second all the people that are with the organization that no one questions why they didn't know. My special assistants - Biggio, Bagwell, Enos Cabell, Reid Ryan, Jim Crane, all the marketing people - they're all around the clubhouse. They're around the players. None of them knew. Why is it all on me? To read,...everyone likes to boil things down to soundbites or twitter tweets "Luhnow is the mastermind." "Luhnow is behind this." "This is Luhnow's culture." It's not. Couldn't be further from the truth. I have to let people know that. My integrity is being questioned here. What would you say to Astros fans watching this? 2017, everything about 2017 was incredible. Beating the Red Sox, Yankees, Dodgers - the three most powerful teams in baseball - and winning our first championship in franchise history, no one can take that away from us. Those are memories that will always be with us. Don't ever let anyone take that away. At the same time, let's learn from this experience. The Astros broke the rules. They shouldn't have done it. I'm mad about it. We should be mad about it. We should use it as a learning experience. As long as we recognize it was wrong & don't do it again and we learn the lesson from it, no reason we can't appreciate all the great things that happened during that time. Those memories will be with me forever. This city, I gave it everything I have. I want every Houston Astro fan to know that. 8 years I gave it everything I have.
I’d take him in a heart beat for the Texans. the guy may have gone down as the goat GM. the Astros and Click will live off of this for the next 5 or 6 years.
I'm probably gullible but... HIRE THAT MAN BACK YOU COWARDS! WRONGLY FIRED! STAND BY YOUR MAN! Patriots didn't fire Belichick for SpyGate; Saints didn't fire Sean Payton for BountyGate; And the Red Sox blamed the "rogue video intern". Give me that "slime ball". Hell, let the Texans or Rockets hire him. (Felt that way before, even more strongly now.)
Agreed. Just like the Astros are being declared the “fall guy” for baseball, being the only team that’s ever stolen signs... Luhnow was held responsible for something he probably didn’t have intimate knowledge of (but to say he had zero inkling that they may be relaying decoded signs is probably a stretch). Interesting that the Taubman incident came up. While he never would have been suspended for that alone, he probably feels it played a role as to why he was the ultimate fall guy for this scandal. It was a poorly crafted statement at the time... and he probably isn’t in charge of writing press releases. But I can’t imagine somebody as calculating and smart as him would feel surprised by the response of the media for the whole incident/statement/and subsequent press conference.
Rob Manfred, Dodgers can go die in a fire. “What were your specific conversations with Rob Manfred during and after the three month investigation?” "I had two lengthy interviews with Major League Baseball investigators, and there was a lot of back and forth between Rob (Manfred) and Jim (Crane), and Rob and Jim’s General Counsel, Giles (Kibbe.) And they were telling me more or less what Rob was thinking, and it was clear to me from the very beginning that the players weren’t going to be punished. That the ownership, Jim Crane, was not going to be punished. So it didn’t really leave a lot of places for the investigation to go. When I received a letter on January 3, with all of the accusations about me, I was shocked because none of the evidence that the letter contained was actual evidence that would hold up in a court of law. It just wouldn’t. It was all speculative; ‘he might have,’ ‘he was copied on this email, he might have read it,’ ‘you could read the email to think that he might have known,’etc. "I asked Rob Manfred for a meeting in New York, and I put together a binder. It’s about 150 pages long. It’s 14 different tabs. And I refuted, with facts, with emails, with documents, with testimony, each and every single allegation that was in that charging document. I sent it to him ahead of him, and I went through it with him there in person. I also looked at him and I told him “I would like to take a lie detector test,” because it essentially came down to one person’s word that I might have known against my word. And I have 16 years in the industry. I’ve been complying with rules for 16 years. In fact, early in my career, I helped Major League Baseball lead a study about how to eradicate wrongdoing in the international market because there was so much mischief going on. I have a long track record of following the rules, and helping apply the rules, and in fact helping create the rules. "I knew Rob knew all of this, and I also knew I had a lot of people who would speak for me. So I presented to Rob two pages of references; people inside of baseball on all levels from owners to former commissioners, to people who have worked with me for 16 years. And I presented him a list of people who know me outside of baseball in my three careers before. And I wanted him… he could have called any one of those people to ask about my integrity, my character, my honesty, and he chose not to contact any of those people. He turned down my offer to do a polygraph test. I don’t know how much of the 150 page binder he read, but none of it made its way into the final report, so frankly, he had his mind made up. He was going to punish me. There was nowhere else to go. He was going to punish AJ as well, and AJ admitted that he knew. “AJ also admitted that he never spoke to me about it and never told me about it. But with me, it was a tougher case. I mean, they extended the investigation for about two weeks just so they could find more evidence about me. And how do I know that? I was told that, directly, from somebody working on the investigation, that ‘you are the target of this investigation, and they are going to continue to dig until they find something on you,’ and they did. They found something that they believe is evidence. It’s not. I refuted it very quickly and thoroughly, but it was enough for them to feel good about suspending me.” “Why would Rob Manfred say ‘no’ to you taking a lie detector test? Why would he not call your references? Why would he not want that?” “Major League Baseball had to deliver a punishment that was perceived as severe to the other clubs. The Dodgers, and other clubs, but I know the Dodgers for sure, were adamant about some big punishments. And they wanted the manager, and they wanted the general manager to go down in this scandal. And they got it. And I think the investigation was not attempting to really uncover who did what, and who was really responsible. The goal of the investigation was to deliver punishments that Rob could feel good about and that would calm the panic. There was a drumbeat for punishments and so they weren’t going to punish Jim, like I said, they weren’t going to punish the players. I didn’t have an assistant GM; we have a very thin front office in terms of layers, so there wasn’t too many places to go. So they had to create a case they felt good enough about in order to punish me.”
He’d run circles around NFL GM’s who still fall in love with arbitrary 40 times and size peripherals. Plus he probably would master the cap system better than most, and love the year-to-year roster turnover process. The NBA is a bit harder. One player can make all the difference and cover up a lot of bad decisions.
I don’t believe for a second that he didn’t know. Nor do I care even if he did. I think I read all of the transcript and don’t really have a problem with it. He became the fall guy for the Astros just like the Astros became the fall guy for the MLB. He’s bitter. I’m bitter. All of it is ****ed up. If he wants to stay in Houston this guy could master any sport. Sign him up Cal.
Well...IF TRUE and he went to AJ Hinch who obviously knew about the cheating and lied to Luhnow I have a problem with Hinch getting another job while Luhnow is out in the cold.
AJ for sure has blood on his hands. Lunhow feels credible to me. He threw a lot of stuff out there that is easily able to be proven untrue if he was lying. in regards to AJ, we haven’t heard much.
It was a fluff piece, but a very believable one. I believe Luhnow did not know the intricate details of the cheating schemes and intentionally maintained plausible deniability, but was fired because the owners of the 3 most powerful/valuable franchises felt the cheating robbed them of a championship, and thus demanded his head from Manfred, and Crane was in no position to push back. The fact that Luhnow was a seemingly cold blooded outsider did not help his cause. Neither did the Taubman incident (which Luhnow’s weak excuse for does not hold much water). That is all speculation on my part. Jeff Luhnow will almost certainly never be an MLB GM again, and I consider it unlikely he works in sports again, except for maybe in consultant roles.
I believed most of what he said. We fired the wrong guy. I’m still bitter at the players for talking and Jim Crane from this whole ordeal.
He mentioned the watch scandal with boston and ny and how they got fined and made sure that our club took precaution to not being wearing them. Thats it.
Bingo. When I first learned about his firing, I was disgusted with Crane for not putting up a fight for his guys, especially Luhnow to whom he owes everything. I basically accepted that it was inexorable MLB politics that Hinch and Luhnow had to go. However, I just found out in this thread that Luhnow also got stiffed on his contract. That's bullshit. And being thrown to the disgusting media dogs on top of all of it... Anyone here ever feel like they got totally screwed, trashed, lied about, misrepresented, betrayed, etc. AND were expected to not even say anything in their own defense? Just hold it in and move on. Every single human being has felt the internal smouldering that comes from that. Many have let it out in far more destructive ways for much lesser slights. Sounds like he just wanted to get his side out there and maybe just move on. The way he was treated, I don't feel like he does owe the organization the gift of total silence on his end. If he goes on to write some tell-all book, give tons more interviews to turn it into a spectacle, and become some petty b*stard, I reserve the right to change my opinion of him. One interview defending himself? Doesn't bug me. Honestly, he could probably learn any sport, and I wouldn't be averse to taking the experimental chance on him with the Rockets or Texans in maybe a couple years. Except I worry about the owners of those two teams as well. Houston sports, man... How about we finally get ourselves an NHL team and let him handle that? I don't blame him for wanting to be done with MLB. I kind of feel like I also want to be done with it until I see Manfred's head figuratively (or maybe literally if it's possible) on a pike for something.
i was leaning towards believing him until he got to the brandon taubman part, where he was sheepishly acting like he didnt have the power to stop the organization's response to that incident. weird, he was only the general friggin manager, right? that cast some doubt on the rest of his interview for me. his story on the sign stealing does seem plausible though, as we know the league--and to a certain extent our team--was looking for sacrificial lambs to blame. but to me, just because lunhow didnt text or email about these activities isn't proof he didnt know or suspect. i'd assume he's smart enough to not incriminate himself that way. in the end, the only people who really know are the ones that were involved, and to my knowledge no one's come out to explicitly accuse him, aside from maybe the owner. i would like to know what made jim crane so sure that lunhow was in on it. or perhaps manfred had simply demanded he fire jeff in exchange for a lighter team punishment? either way, screw alex cora, screw beltran, screw hinch and all the other cheating dynasty teams that run this league and got off scot free. i dont really blame the young players who were basically impressionable kids, although they probably could have handled the fallout better. that being said, i wouldnt be mad if the texans took a flyer on lunhow in some capacity.
My body is ready for Luhnow to take over Texans operations. The only thing more impressive than him turning around the Astros would be him doing so with our lowly, mortgaged Texans. Cmon Cal. Cmon. In all seriousness, I do feel badly for Luhnow. He got shafted. He was the lowest man on the totem pole and was the easiest to kick off the island. I wish Crane would have had more of a backbone in this whole sham investigation. I wish he would have backed Jeff. I understand why he did not, but it doesn't make it an easier pill to swallow. I completely understand and sympathize with Luhnow's gripes against the Astros. Some of it is his own doing, but to get thrown on the sword with no knowledge...that's tough. The MLB did not care about the truth. They only cared about the external perceived accounts, akin to a bunch of gossipy teenage girls who scream until they get their way. It's a greek tragedy. Part of me feels like the Astros were duped because of the vibrations created by the Buster Olneys, Jeff Passans, Molly Knights, et al. What a disgrace this investigation has been on the league, not just the Astros, but most people can't see the real tragedy: that while everyone is calling for the integrity of the game to be restored, the league and core of the game has none, not even a shred. Fans nor the league care about actual cheating. Exhibit A is the sweep job under the rug of Red Sox Intern A. I mean, no one is the BOS org spoke a lick of truth, and MLB couldn't do a thing about it. Yet all of the moral gatekeepers are nowhere. It's maddening. If I were Luhnow, I don't know how I could stomach it. The smears, everything. It's all a big joke. This piece did exactly what I hoped it would do -- show some owner, somewhere, that it's okay to take a chance on Luhnow. He's learned from all of his Astro experiences. He's a great leader. He's smart. His resume is impeccable. What he was able to create in HOU is nothing short of amazing.Perhaps most importantly, I think this interview showed that he can get in front of any camera or reporter and have an articulate conversation about his past misdeeds and come out looking like...not a villain. I think an Owner could do a press conference pretty seamlessly with him ( "we believe in second chances, yada yada yada"). Perhaps JL's biggest misstep is that now he is not ahead of the curve. Analytics is at the forefront of the game now more than ever, and his ability to go scorched earth while the majority of teams try to win is just not possible. I hope another team takes a chance on him. I really do. He sharpened the edges of a baseball organization so finely to not care about PR BS that he screwed himself in the process. A martyr of sorts if you will. His main flaw was caring too much. He was so focused on winning that he overlooked the human side of the game, and his lack thereof likely cost him his career. Please, God, if you are out there, get this man in NRG Stadium on Kirby and let him play around with the old timer football GMs. First do something about COVID, racial inequality, our climate, and the world in general I suppose. In Luhnow I trust, still. (Also, do your thang, Click).
