'abhorrent'? Did you look up that word in the SAT practice book? Too much loyalty is what causes things to remain in the status- quo and become out of date. The Rockets and Rudy T. He needs to go. It's painfully obvious that Rudy needs to go. This is a new era(not the Hakeem era) and Rudy's ideas and schemas aren't working. I think it's going to be a long drawn-out process for Rudy T. to actually get canned, because of his deep roots with the team. Jeff van Gundy.
true rockets fans does not necessarily mean being loyal to a certain player esp. if that player is hurting the team overall. if we are not true rockets fans then we would not waste our time criticizing the team. these opinions are all made because we care for the team not for a single player.
I like this one much better. The lack of loyalty in this forum is quite abhorrent. After three and a half years of hard work and dedication to the Rockets site, Clutch is rewarded by Rocket fans with nothing but castigation and scorn. I don't understand the resentment for Jeff. He is the best poster on the ClutchCity.net so far. Codell has a while to go before reaching a true all star level, and perhaps may exceed Jeff in the future as the most valuable poster on the bbs. This resentment from fans is foolish since Jeff has done much to help the bbs. In his first two years, Jeff actually deferred to other posters in trying to become a Clutch Crew--a position he had little experience in. However, the lack of rocket offense prompted Clutch and the Clutch staff to urge Jeff to post more. The past two years have been evident of Jeff's move to more of an offensive poster. However, he still tries to get others involved including poster such as RM95 and HeyPartner. Perhaps some of you people have high expectations of Jeff to become a great moderator. Well, it takes time for greatness. It took HeyPartner six years to reach that level, and five years to become a well established poster. Another Brother has learned to play the thread starter more effectively, and become one of the better posters on the site. Jeff is growing and continuing to learn this difficult position. Rember he is a rock musician in Houston. The ISSUE here is poster loyalty. How can you be enraged at a guy dedicated to posting about winning. Sure his defense of arguments needs work, but the more you listen to his posts, the more you watch him direct the threads on the bbs, you see the desire in his signature.
This is nothing compared to the treatment that Ralph Sampson recieved from Houston and the fans in the 80's. Steve Francis is treated extremely well compared to Sampson and all Sampson did was take us to the play-offs and hit the series winning last second shot that put the Rockets in the Finals. What has Steve Francis done so far in 3.5 years? Nothing. Steve has tons of talent but has shown very limited improvement over his 3.5 years as a Rocket and has yet to deliver this team to the play-offs. Even Francis has said on several occasions that the play-offs are the next step. I'll revisit your complaint after Francis takes the next step in his development by returning this team to the play-offs. Until then he is just another talented prospect that has failed to deliver the goods.
Tbui First, I will like to inform you that the phrase "True Fan" is just a myth. Secondly, Loyalty in sports (at least these days) - in respect to Fanatics, players and owner - is just another myth. Do think if Francis was not offered the Max he would stay? Loyalty eh? Does he deserve Max contract? What about Jeff Bagwell (a more acomplished Star and Houstonian)? Do you think he would have stayed if the Astros offered only 10M per? Save for the inflated league salary, is he also really worth that much? No on both cases. I don't want to say that you are being naive about this whole 'Loyalty' thing but I can see you are letting your emotions get the better of you here (which is not abnormal - hech that is what fuels us many atime) but I will advice you to chill out and just deal with it. In other words, Loyalty is OVERRATED unless it is to your family and your God - period. Get it? I am Loyal to the City of Houston. If the Rockets move out today, I will root for the next team that comes along. Now that is reality - that is Loyalty - that is life!
Let's see how well you can handle logic. I'm reading alot of emotional rhetoric and personal definitions of "loyalty", but I'm not seeing much "logic". First, I and many others here are Rockets fans. If Steve Francis were traded tomorrow...most of us would still be Rockets fans. Do you think that you are a greater fan than owner Les Alexander? Do you think you are more "loyal" than he is? If Les or CD or RT evaluates a player and comes to a different conclusion than you about the players abilites are they "disloyal"? Did the fact that some of us mentioned Kenny Thomas being part of a logjam at PF and mentioning him not having the ability to play SF make us not "loyal"? The fact that the Rocket management came to the same conclusion make them not "loyal"? Are the Rockets more "loyal" to Steve because it was KT that was traded or is it because Steve is a better player and there is no logjam at PG? If the Rockets miss the playoffs this season and next and the TWolves offered Garnett and a pick for Francis and change...is the Rockets managment disloyal if they pull the trigger? Second, the NBA is a business and it's entertainment. Players get traded frequently on the basis of someones opinion about that players pluses and minuses. It is purely subjective. It has very little to do with "loyalty". Lastly, is a coach who provides constructive criticism to one of his players not "loyal"? Hell no he's not. And there is no reason under the sun as a Rockets fan and a student of the game that I or anyone on this board should put on some rose-colored glasses and make ourselves oblivious to what we percieve as obvious faults of a player. IMHO, Steve Francis is a shoot first, pass second guard and I don't feel that type of guard play (coupled with good post play) will win the Rockets an NBA championship. That's not cruxification...that's my opinion. If you have "faith" this will work, fine. But faith and loyalty have different dictionary definitions and I'm not subscribing to your redefining of anything. If Francis can lead the Rockets to an NBA championship in spite of what I feel are flaws, more power to him. I'll be glad for the Rockets, I'll glad for him...but I won't feel the slightest bit disloyal along the way.
Oh brother. Please note this site is not called "SteveFrancis.com". It's called Clutchcity.net. It's related to the city of Houston and its basketball team, the Houston Rockets. As someone else has already stated, I'm a Rockets fan. If Steve screws up, he's definitely going to get criticized. Besides, unless you are eight years old, surely you realize that sports today moves so quickly, it's "What are you doing for me NOW?", not even "What have you done for me LATELY?" Oh, and I didn't know "Official Judge of Fan Loyalty" was an open position.
To GATER To GATER You have cleraly missed the point of my original posting. The purpose of the posting had nothing to do with management or les alexander, it has to do with a certain thinhg called fan loyalty. Steve Francis has undoubtedly been one of the best guards in the NBA and Rocket history. Much praise has been given to him by both the media and fans alike. However, with the addition of Yao MIng, most of you people all of a sudden expect this team to win a championship or go deep into the playoffs. As I said before the ROCKETS have several problems, and I do not believe Steve Francis is the problem. HOwever, those who dislike Steve Francis have put the burden on one man, which is just fallacious thinking. The Houston ROckets are not a good team. They may not even be as good as the Sonics or BUcks right now. The ironic thing is when Steve Francis was scoring 30+ a game and the team was winning, I don't believe anyone said anything. Now, you people must reevaluate yourselves about this lack of loyalty to the player. Steve Francis is the best thing in Houston right now, and his performances are not as overtly bad as Marbury a few years ago or the selfish Antoine Walker. You people seem to let zeal and desire get in the way of your thinking. It seems as if there is anger or resentment agianst Francis, which is just ridicuolous considered what he has done for the franchise in the last few years. Think about this dozens of teams would gladly have Francis in their hands--you people are spoiled. give the guy a chance.
Where were you with your loyalty when Rudy T. let Hakeem go to Toronto? I remember Mr. Les Alexander mentioned championship"S" after this year draft. He clearly thought he has enough talents. Not right away, but to get there you have to improve. For a long stretch, the Rockets did not show it! Quit question other people's "loyalty" and "thinking" and use words such as "foolish", "ridiculous", "abhorrent" ... You don't qualify! BTW, I like Steve. I think he is in the top 10, 15 players in the league but he plays like a guy off the street sometimes. For his credit, I actually have seen some improvement on his part in just the past few games. I like the games where he scores 10-15 points as well if he gets his team mates involved. I don't like games like the Lakers where he scored 42 and we won. Why? Because you don't win consistently that way. Kobe has Shaq. T Mac's Orlando is under average with him alone scoring 40. They all need help and since Steve is the PG, it is his job to make sure he gets help.
We're in the same boat crash but tell me, are you watching a different steve francis than me? What 'improvement' are you talking about? Rebounding? LOL. Every stat steve has is worse than his rookie season...except points and rebounding, but he takes more shots now than in his rookie season which would explain his point improvement. Other than that, steve isn't improving...in fact he's getting worse. That might be a good reason to 'scorn' him. Tbui, why don't you tell us what we should do when a player is regressing in terms of basketball efficiency, after being in the league over 3 years? Why don't you tell me how many 'Star' players actually get worse as their experience in the league increases...old age withheld. Steve is shooting worse, making worse decisions, and still has the worst Assist\Turnover ratio in the league for point guards. Maybe the reason why this team struggles is because the guy handling the ball is the most turnover prone point in the league...hmmmm, theres a thought.
Because we see the conflicts that Francis and Mobley have and how they are so poor at overcoming these conflicts. It doesn't make us any less of a fan. Even though some of us focus our favouritism on Yao Ming, dosen't make us any less a fervent a fan either! Although we criticise Mobley and Francis for wild decisions and a lack of player involvement, I believe that there are deeper conflicts at work in their minds. The court problems are only the outward signs, until they iron out their personal mental comflicts we will struggle on the court. The conflicts stem from their manhood and their need for recognition and glory.Both Francis and Mobley want to be the MAN on the Rockets and they were, till we won the lottery. From this point on they and in particular Francis were challenged by the mistery of fact that we were considering a Center for our pick. Not only a Center, but one from a different Country and of a race not considered,at that time, a producer of outstanding basketball talent. One that was spoken of as being of potential and possibly a great one at that! As the teams leaders they had individual plans on what they thaught was best for the Rockets. Management rightfully decided to take hold of the selection and make their own choices for the teams future. In his first season Yao Ming has shown our team how to play unselfish basketball. The team has shown themselves to be very slow learners. All our players need to get used to the idea that the direction of the team has changed and that the Rockets won't put up with any player set on any individual agenda, other than the success of the team. That will only be acheived by playing the game as a team sport. Each player must work to improve each member of his team so that they might contribute theit best effort to the team. Any player not willing to fit into this team concept and adapt themselves to it should find another place to be selfish.:cool
