A PF doesn't have to be a great rebounder, but between your starting SF, PF, and C you have to be able to bring down 22-24 rpg if you want to be successful. I think EG will be a 9-10 rpg guy when he matures and if we can draft a SF like Woods who can bring down 6-7 then that means we can live with Mo only getting 6 or so rpg (assuming he were playing PF/C for us in the same lineup with those guys...with EG and him kind of playing some weird combo of sorts). The problem is that we don't have a good rebounding SF and EG hasn't developed enough yet to be that guy. I think in 2 years EG will be that guy, so if we get a 3 that can fill that rebounding void then we can live with Mo's inadequacy as a rebounder so long as he makes up for it with his wide body on defense and nice stroke from the outside. Oh, and the SF I'm thinking of is Woods. I can dream can't I?
1) A power forward should rebound...PERIOD. That is one of the prime responsibilities of a power forward. In fact, on a team where the backcourt does a good portion of the scoring, it is not only a responsibility, its a priority. Stick that in italics. What happened to 'stinks'? What happened to 'underachiever'? Is it possible that other people (including the Rocket organization) aren't interested in building their team according to stereotypes? Is Robert Horry a good rebounding power forward? Or just good enough to win multiple championships at the 4 spot? 2)I never said it was Mo T's FAULT that we didnt go after Webber..i said he was the REASON. We should only be so lucky that Mo worked in the front office and not in the front court. That's funny, I remember quotes in the paper from Francis saying how the Rockets didn't pursue Webber because the organization thought he was 'too cocky'. What does that have to do with Mo Taylor? What about Eddie Griffin? Does he have anything to do with the decision not to go after Webber? Or is it all just Mo Taylor? 3) freak injury or not...he tore his achilles...im no doctor but if he couldnt jump for a rebound (or low and behold..block a shot) before this injury, he sure as hell aint going to be imitating a pogo stick anytime soon Wait....what happened to 'injury prone'? You're right, Mo wasn't a good rebounder before the injury, and he's likely not going to be one after the injury. Some of us have accepted that, and like the strengths he brings to the team. You better get used to it -- he's signed for 5 more years.
I disagree. He's played in 248 of 296 possible games prior to this year. If they had played the entire 98/99 year & he had maintained an 84% clip, he would've played in an average of 69 games per year. While that's still a little low, it sure isn't a sign of a chronically injury prone player. While you're correct here, you're also not giving him credit for improving in almost every statistical catagory, in each of his first 3 years. He regressed slightly overall, last year, because he joined a new team & had to learn a totally new offensive scheme. However, before he was injured, he was consistently scoring 20+ ppg & grabbing 6+ rpg. Here's the link to the box scores for last year. Start with the March 24 game & work your way back. http://www.nba.com/rockets/schedule/results_2000.html I disagree. We were waiting on Dream to make a decision & during that time, it became obvious that Webber was looking to get the max & wasn't really interested in coming here, just in using us as leverage to get what he wanted. Here's a link to an ESPN story that reaffirms that. http://espn.go.com/magazine/bucher_20010719.html Webber gave Dumars every means of contacting him -- phone numbers, pagers, e-mail address -- but despite various subsequent messages and attempts, Dumars never heard back from him. Other teams bailed much earlier -- Orlando, San Antonio and Houston, for example -- after he failed to follow through on his professed interest. Let's take a look at those stats, shall we? Until last year (when he joined a new team with a new offensive scheme), his stats were rising each of the first 3 years, including rebounds. http://www.nba.com/playerfile/maurice_taylor/index.html?nav=page YEAR TEAM G GS MPG FG% 3P% FT% OFF DEF RPG APG SPG BPG TO PF PPG 97-98 LAC 71 3 21.3 .476 .000 .709 1.70 2.50 4.20 .7 .48 .56 1.51 3.10 11.5 98-99 LAC 46 45 32.7 .461 .167 .728 2.20 3.10 5.30 1.5 .35 .63 2.61 3.90 16.8 99-00 LAC 62 60 35.9 .464 .125 .711 1.50 4.90 6.50 1.6 .82 .77 2.73 3.50 17.1 00-01 HOU 69 69 28.6 .489 .000 .735 1.60 3.90 5.50 1.5 .41 .55 1.81 3.00 13.0 Career 248 177 29.1 .472 .105 .720 1.70 3.60 5.30 1.3 .52 .63 2.10 3.30 14.3
Obviously you are too busy making sure your post count is up rather than paying attention because the fact that we didnt go afer Webber had EVERYTHING to do with the fact that the Rockets were giving most of the money we had under the cap to Mo and not to Webber. before you say what I think you'll say, I DO realize that some of that money was spent retaining Moochie etc but once the decision was made that Mo was our 4, the rest of the money didnt matter robert horry blah blah blah... yeah...we really needed Horry to rebound...1st of all genius, he played the 3...OT (along with Herrera and Chucky Brown) and Dream were picking up the rebounding slack during the championship run (right about the time of your 1000th post) so try again I realize he is signed for 5 more years....that should explain my why I am so frustrated with the situation. I would like nothing more than for this slug to average 20 and 10 and lead us deep into the playoffs and for everybody to say "i told you so" etc etc etc. But its not happening (or at least he wont be the one leading us there averaging 20 and 10) and maybe YOU should get used to it
Funny...I remember about a week ago Clutch's headline had a picture of Webber and the caption read something to the extent of how Webber was going to make the Rockets pay for not trying to sign him. As far as his increased rebound stats....please...you cant be serious about that. He went from 4 to 6 rebounds in 3 years...cmon will ya?
Giving up 2nd chance points is one of the reasons our defense is so weak... How many times this year have you seen the rockets play good D only to watch opposing players tip it in uncontested. That is the job of the power forward, it's not just that Mo gets a sad amount of rebounds for the team, but he allows others to stick them back in. If MoT averaged 5.5 boards and boxed out on every play, and Cato picked up 11 rbs I'd say fine he's doing an adequate job, but he never has. Wouldn't you say that a young, high flying backcourt would be at it's best with a frontcourt that can rebound and outlet the ball. Steve and Cuttino average 11.3 rbs vs 13.5 for Cato and Taylor. That is just not conducive to a running team and I think we can agree that at this point that is when Houston is most effective. Running teams are very rarely contenders, however. I think Eddie will push MoT to the bench late in the season next year because he's that damn good. His rebounding will improve as he gets bigger and learns the game. I think we can draft another rookie, (Haslip, Wilcox, Stoudemire) and wait patiently for them to develop. We won't be contenders until Steve and Cat are mature vets imo, anyway. Eddie will be the man for us going into his 4th-5th seasons. Eddie is the STUD. be patient
Apparently, you can only remember a week at a time. From the very beginning of the Webber free agency speculation, he would say one thing this week & another the next. He never gave any team a strong enough indication that he wanted to play for them. The article I posted in my previous post shows just that. The article you're referring to is just Webber's way of saving face. Another thing. Webber openly stated that he didn't want to play the center position. The Rockets were trying to resign Dream low enough to allow room to go after Webber, & until we either resigned, traded, or renounced Dream, we had no idea how much cap space we would have available to seriously pursue Webber with. During that waiting period, Webber became more wishy washy about his direction. Taylor agreed to wait on the team, even though he knew that they were interested in signing Webber. Webber resigned with Sacramento on 7/21/01 & Dream wasn't traded until 8/2/01. 6.5 rebounds & it shows that the guy's improving each year. He's not a superstar & he's not getting paid superstar money. For a big man that can score 20+ ppg, he's a steal. His rebounds are coming around & I believe they will continue to increase.
Again, Eddie Griffin has nothing to do with this I guess. No one from the Rockets ever said anything about the acquisition of Eddie Griffin solving a lot of their frontcourt deficiencies? Your words: "He's the reason (emphasis mine) we didn't even attempt to get Webber". He is not the reason. The reason is that the Rockets did not want Webber. If the Rockets wanted Webber, they would have tried to get him. Besides, you have no proof that the Rockets did not try to get Webber, only quotes from the media. Unless someone from the Rockets comes out and says "we didn't try to get Webber", you have no proof that they did/didn't try. Robert Horry plays for the Lakers, who have won the past two championships. I was responding to your statement: "A power forward should rebound...PERIOD. That is one of the prime responsibilities of a power forward." The two power forwards for the world champion Lakers last year (Horry and Grant) averaged 10.8 boards a game between them. Mo Taylor and Kenny Thomas averaged 11.1 boards between them. Rebounding numbers by themselves are a useless stat. Golden State routinely is at the top of the NBA in rebounding. It means nothing. Saying a power forward should "rebound...PERIOD" is about as productive as saying a point guard should pass, a center should block shots, or a shooting guard should shoot a certain percentage. All you're doing is throwing out a stereotype. The fact is that most successful teams win due in part to players who don't fit your stereotypes of the prototypical player. Considering there are currently only 4 guys in the league averaging 20 and 10, I'd say the chances of the Rockets having a 20/10 guy on their team anytime soon are pretty remote. What do I need to get used to? You complaining?
You guys haven'tseen Mo T play in a year and you do not know what he has been doing in that year, but yet ya'll are sitting here bashing him. I think his rebounding will improve by far next year if all the good things Bill and Calvin have been saying about him are true. The have been constantly saying that Mo has been in the weight room all year and has gained 20-30 POUNDS OF MUSCLE! Now, whether he uses this new 'bulk' or not is another thing. If he can use it, I would say that he has a shot at most improved next year. I think he will cme back and help this team ignite next season. I personally think you guys hve no idea what ya'll are talking about when ya'll start bashing on Mo.
A power forward in my opinion should defend and rebound. In the case of Horry, he does the intangibles. He is a perfect compliment to franchise centers such as Shaq or Dream. Horry would not be as effective in Houston right now. Although Mo has not been a very good rebounder thus far, I believe he has the potential to one day average double figures. He is still young and this injury might, may I dare say, make him better. If he does not get close to doulble figure rebounds next year then the Rockets organization in my opinion will have made a mistake. Let's be patient and see what happens next year. The only thing I do not want to see is Mo taking Eddie's minutes. Either Mo or KT has to go. I am indifferent to which one.
Maurice Taylor averaged merely 29 minutes a game yet still managed to pull dow nearly 6 rebounds a game. Hey thats not shabby for limited minutes. Give Maurice Taylor Chris Webber minutes and his rebounding totals will inevitably improve.
rocketbooster MoT is usually in early foul trouble He has to match up against the nastiest, roughest PF's in the west which accounts for his limited minutes I'm fighting of a MoT rant so i'll just end this post
How about trading our first pick for Ostertag? Maybe as Calvin and Bill say he just plays well agsinst us. However, he is as big as they come, has experience and might do much better with a change of scenery, since he is always fighting with Sloan. He and Cat would always give us bulk and shot blocking. I know he isn't as good as we can hope for in the draft, where everyone is the next Shaq, Kobe, Iverson and Malone but in real life.....
I think if we can't get Odom, Marion, or Lewis, I would draft either Ming or Marcus. Both seems to be willing to learn and both are big. It seems Collier is eithe injured or just can't play. After that, it could be set up to make a run at Duncan at the end of next yr. If it calls for giving up Griffin, Taylor, and someone else then I'll do it because then they'll go from pretenders to contenders in a heart beat. That would be my vision. C-Marcus or Ming Pf-Duncan Sf-Morris,Rice or whoever Sg-Cat Pg-Steve bench, Thomas,Morris or Rice,Moochie,Brown,Collier,and whoever else. Thats a championship team period!
------------------------------------------------------ 1) i suppose you have proof that the Rockets didnt want or need him??? There were only 3 teams with the cap space to sign the best free agent in years...if Eddie had so much to do with it, he would have been starting from day 1 being that Mo T never saw the court this year...next 2) You arent comparing Cato and Collier to Dream and Shaq are you??? I think maybe....just MAYBE the fact the Horry played with the 2 best centers of their respective generations had a little something to do with his low rebound average... PS...if Mo T could hit the three or play D like Horry, I think I could overlook that he couldnt outrebound Spud Webb 3)Hottoddie...could you please tell me when the last time Mo averaged 20 ppg??? Let me help you with the tough ones...NEVER...He averaged 17 IN HIS CONTRACT YEAR...thats as close as he got. You know, you guys get on me for bashig a guy who, based on what he is making and what he produces , deserves every bit of it...what the hell has he ever done to receive any type of praise?
Mo T will play a significant role for us next season and in years to come. Get over it. His contract isn't that bad. If it wasn't for his injury, he would be easy to move. Quite a few people actually LIKED what he brought to the table last year, including Rockets management.
How about the ten or so points he would score for the Rockets in the first quarter of many games last season? He's got great touch for a big man and is a high-percentage mid-range jump shooter. You act like there is absolutely nothing good about him, which just isn't true.
I almost forgot...the Rockets organization had to pony up for a new front door for Mo T since so many teams were banging on it when he was a free agent
Rockets management also liked what Matt Maloney brought to the table even though no one else in the league did. Taylor is a good jump shooter for a big guy, but thats about it. He doesn't rebound, he doesn't defend. Thomas more than made up for his lost which is basically saying that Taylor is just an avg player. Thomas hit the same shots Taylor did for his so called great shot, rebounded better, and played better defense. The yr we got Taylor no one wanted him except Seattle and that was beacuse they were trying anything to get rid of Bakers contract, otherwise no one wanted him. The Rockets management must have had an under the table deal they had to pay beacuse no one in the league even approached Taylor with the money the Rockets coughed up. Role players like Taylor are a dime a dozen and its nothing great about 13pts 5 rebs for a power forward.
How about the 2nd quarter? Or the 2nd half? For a guy who has a career average of around 14-15 ppg, 10 in the 1st quarter aint gonna cut it down the stretch. I guess he hit his quota so why not let him commit some fouls instead of playing defense and this way he can sit on the bench for 50 million. Gee...you maybe think that a bigger reason the Rockets were better last year is more because Steve Francis played 80 games and less because Mo got us going in the 1st quarter?
