To those who want to trade Mobley....shame! The guy has done too much for us to up and trade him the day without working to incorporate his game into our new style. The solution to this problem seems pretty simple to me. Mobley played the point his first year and came of the bench once Steve arrived, so he is used to both playing the point and coming off the pine. We should trade Moochie and a combination of Rice (expiring contract), KT (expiring contract), or Cato (could make noise in east) for a starting 2 and let Cat back up both guard spots. Just went to realgm and this worked out, what do you all think? Moochie, KT, and Collier to New Orleans for Bullard, Alexander, and Augmon Rockets 1 Francis/Mobley 2 Alexander/Mobley/Francis/Augmon 3 Rice/Morris/Bullard/Boki 4 EG/Mo/Bullard 5 Yao/Cato Mobley can spell either guard, Alexander is young and big (6'5'', 205) with a shot, Bullard we know, and Augmon is nasty on d
What happens if we give Mobley a year to fit in and he doesn't? Wouldn't his value drop? Face it, Mobley will not be getting 20-25 shots a game anymore. Lets see, we need Mobley to pass and play defense and hit an occassional 3 to keep defenses honest. First off, Mobley is a terrible passer. Has he even thrown a pass to Yao this season? He either has a problem giving the ball to Yao or he would rather put up a low percentage shot. Secondly, he is no defensive wizard. The bigger shooting guards in the league take Mobley to school. Mobley is a better fit with another team, Cleveland, Detroit, Atlanta are 3 teams that come to mind. Trade him now while we can get some value in return.
You guys diss Cat like nobodys business. First of all, he does pass Ming the ball. I have seen on several possessions, when cat would be on the left wing trying to iso; but if ming gets in there trying to post up, Cat would pass him the ball. Before yesterdays game, it was Steve who would not pass the ball to Ming. I remember, especially in the Cleveland game, Francis was on the right wing by his lonesome; but then ming came in there trying to post and had good position, but instead of giving him the ball, Steve just tried to crossover his man, and didnt accomplish anything. But Steve was much better against Dallas though. But the point is Cat does pass the ball. Second, who thinks Cat has to take 20-25 shots to succeed? He took 8 yesterday since he was having a bad game. He took only 12 against the Lakers i think. Yeah, such a ballhog; He takes more shots when he is hitting. Third, Cat has improved his defense a great deal. I saw him at least on 2 possessions stop the Dallas fast break basically by himself, just hustling back on transition D. I still dont think he is great defensively, but he is average to above average at least. Maybe people missed Cat's hustle yesterday because of Ming's dominance. But trust me, dont take Mobley for granted!!!! Poor Cat
Where do I sign? Talk about a great deal for both clubs, the Pacers need a scorer, which they get in Mobley,and we need a point gaurd and small forward which we get in Tinsley and Artest. Throw in Kenny and its sounds good on paper. Although ive neva liked tinsley, i think he'll be a good fit for this team.....a pass first type player. I always luved Artest.....always wanted to see him in pinstripes! Here's to wishing this were true! Cheers.
Troy Baros (aka Yao's Vertical on ESPN) has stolen Clutch's brilliant idea on the trade with the Pacers. He has also added some other trash as usual. http://boards.espn.go.com/cgi/nba/request.dll?MESSAGE&room=nba_hou&id=85414
Kinda funny. Well, you're obviously related to Cat; either that or you're incredible stupid trying to defend Cat by stating his "unbelievable" defense then taking it a step further by criticizing Francis' lack of D. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt, though, and say it's the former. But also, I agree w/you that the Rockets orginization need not worry about trading key peices like Mobley YET b/c while Ming should be getting the ball more (just look @ what he does w/the touches he gets), it's as much of an adjustment for the other players learning to play w/Yao as it is for Yao himsef.
After going through all four pages and reading what every poster had to say, I have to agree with Clutch. In no way is Clutch saying that Cat is a bad SG, which alot of you are acting like he said, but Cuttino has a bad game for the Rockets' needs. Cuttino takes bad shots. Whether he makes them or not, I still get pissed off, because no one is under the basket, or he doesn't even look for another player. Cat has been the 2nd option for a while now, and letting go of that is hard for him to do. Cuttino doesn't play defense, and he doesn't play the most important thing of all...team ball. There is a reason why alot of posters refer to Cat as a blackhole, and say things like,"he never met a shot he didn't like". Having a scorer like Cat is a benefit, but all his other drawbacks would seem to make Clutch's point valid, his game is all wrong for the Rockets. As for his 0-8 performance last night, its not that he couldn't hit a shot, but how many of those shots were ill-advised shots? I wouldn't say that Ron Artest is the answer, as I think that trading Cat would be a mistake. As I stated earlier having Cat's scoring ability is an asset, the kind of asset that needs to come off the bench. I think Cat could be like Bobby Jackson of the Kings. He doesn't start, but is the spark for the team off the bench. As for Kenny, if he were still a little heavier and two inches taller, he would be the perfect PF. KT the SF is as wrong as small ball. KT is much better suited as a scoring SF/PF on a team in bad need of scorers. Unfortunately for him he plays for a team that has way more options on offense than needed. KT is the odd-man out on this team, as we have MoT and Eddie Griffin. Its a shame because KT is a hustler, but he too like Cat is a blackhole. Watching the game now he has gotten the ball and not even attempted to pass the ball back out or lookf or some spacing in the offense, he just wants to get the ball , and score. KT is more of a team player than Cat in that he hustles, rebounds, nad does some of the little things needed, but he is just a man with no position. (Oh, and as I type this, KT has just missed another shot with no one under the basket, and with plenty of time left on the shot clock). Besides that KT can't play D on SF's. Moochie, well I've been saying this since last season when we had Damon Jones in camp," Let Moochie go!!!!!" He has a game suited for ISOs, not a halfcourt game that the Rockets are playing now. And especially since its bad enough that Steve hardly plays D, but Moochie is anemic on defense. Besides that, I have to give props to Yao Ming, you're making all you're detractors eat crow.
Ive been thinking a lot about this possibility since it was posted, and it seems to make a whole lot of sense. As much as I like Cuttino's attitude/desire/work ethic, I am starting to feel that it is just not going to work with this team. The minute Cat is out of the lineup, the Rockets average 48% from the field and start moving the ball and playing unselfishly. This is against a good defense, not the crap that is the Cavs. They made a committment to feed Yao in the post. I have also resigned myself to the fact that unless this team adds a true PG, there will not be nearly enough early offense and uptempo to take advantage of the overall talent. Dont think that just b/c Yao is taking a major role in this team that they cant get easy transition hoops. Yao is very good at making outlet passes and runs the floor well for a big man. I have been a HUGE fan of Jamaal Tinsley's game since his Iowa State days and feel it was a travesty he fell so far in the draft. It was merely teams completely overreacting b/c he did not show a consistent outside shot and zones were going to be implemented. Zone or no zone, Tinsley averaged 8 APG as a rookie which is phenomenal for a rookie PG. If anyone is curious, Jamaal averaged more APG as a rookie than John Stockton, Jason Kidd, Gary Payton or Andre Miller did as rookies. Tinsley also added a more consistent three pt shot to his arsenal this summer to keep defenses honest. Tinsley's pass first style and incredible ability to advance the ball up the court in a hurry would help fix many of the Rockets offensive woes. Francis could concentrate more on scoring (not have to be the permanent SG, he could play point sometimes, but his main focus would be scoring and running the wings in transition). As far as the Artest part of the transaction. This part may not be feasible for two reasons. First off, Im not so sure the Pacers will be willing to lose him after how much his game has evolved this season. Also, considering the Rockets needs, I think they could really use a more consistent outside threat in the backcourt to prevent the zones from sagging into Yao. Hawkins brings a lot of the similar defensive prowess as Artest. Also, I dont think a deal can be worked on the cap with Artest. He just signed a 6 year extension that does not kick in till next season and apparently this is preventing any deal from working. I tried every combination on RealGM, and it just doesnt not work. Here is what works: Jamaal Tinsley/Ron Mercer for Cuttino Mobley/Moochie Norris That deal worked on RealGM and provides some interesting possibilities. Personally I would try to figure out a way to engineer a deal like that but create a 3 way with Detroit to get Jon Barry also. I have no idea what the Pistons would want, but when Chauncey Billups comes back, Barry will probably be the odd man out. I would love a guard rotation of Tinsley, Barry and Francis. Barry is a career 39% from behind the arc and 44% from the field and has shown that when he receives atleast 20 MPG, his stats are much than that even. Plus at 6-5, Barry has the size to play both guard spots. The question on Francis playing more two guard: It is a huge question as to whether Francis would get pounded at that position by more physical players. Personally, I dont think it would be that huge of a deal. Against teams like the Magic and Lakers, the Rockets could go with a larger lineup with Hawkins and Francis in the backcourt and just rotate as necessary. They would have tremendous flexibility after a deal like this with atleast three different types of backcourts. Tinsley/Francis, Francis/Hawkins, Barry/Francis, etc.
Better without Cuttino? Wouldnt you love to see Cuttino play the way Hawkins did tonight? He was unselfish, took open shots, let the game come to him, played hard on defense, and got Yao the ball constantly. I just see Cuttino taking his man one on one and taking miserable shots when he comes back. I like the offense running through Yao and Steve, if they develop a chemistry on high pick and rolls, with Yao's touch, size, and understanding of defenses and Steve's ability to get to basket make the jumper and passing it would be really difficult to stop. Dont get me wrong I am a Cat fan for sure, he has good talent, certainly more talent than Hawkins, but he takes the team out of the flow on offense and doesnt put in the effort on defense that Hawkins does. If Cuttino accepts a role similiar to Hawkins did last night the Rockets will be a better team, but if he goes one on one and shoots bad shots and doesnt put out a concentrated effort on the defensive end the Rockets will suffer long term and I would rather see Hawkins in the game. Big win last night and I think we are on our way to something special here...We have a "Franchise" and a "Dynasty" on the same team....has to mean success.
I think this is insane, and it's way too early. Give Cat a chance; he wants to win too, I'm sure, and I think he can find a way into the offense while still getting numbers (just not as high) - another potential scoring threat is NEVER a bad thing. The number of shots he's taken has drastically decreased in the past few games, but if by midseason he's still not looking quite right, then I can understand some of the massive amounts of hate he's getting... Anyways, I don't think Francis (currently the most integral part of this team) would like this at all at this point. Last I heard, he and Cat were pretty good friends, and show some pretty nice chemistry on the court.
I'm curious as to how many people agree with this. To play D like Hawkins seems to require alot of talent and not just attitude, IMHO. I would think that Mobley in no way is "certainly" more talented--how many people who aren't dominating centers or big men can change the game defensively? Hawkins is one. Payton in is heyday was another. I think Doug Christie makes a defensive impact, as well.
Man, file this under Knee Jerk Reaction . In my opinion, Hawkins hasn't proved himself enough yet to just be handed the starting position. After all, he is only shooting 34% from the field. Anyone remember Shandon Anderson? I doubt too many of you were sad to see him go. The only thing I was sad about was that we just didn't let him go for free. If it wasn't for Rice, we might have had more room to bargain with Lewis. (I'm stilly trying to get over Rashard, but I just can't)
Gypsy, I'd have to agree with him - Mobley is surely more talented. Mobley has some D for one thing, he lead the Rockets in steals last year, and so far this year I think. And for another, does he not on average outscore his man? cuz that would be a big part of winning a game.
If this trade comes true, man I am just going to start rolling, and not stop. We'd be the cause for a trade that was never thought of untill us.
well obviously pacers have heard this http://www.indystar.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&daysprune=&forumid=11&x=15&y=11
